Vela set to stay put at Arsenal.

Re: Vela set to stay put at Arsenal.

Postby StLGooner » Thu Jun 23, 2011 8:06 pm

Leody wrote:Reason you don't remember him beating defenders Chris, is after he managed to get by them he ran the ball over the endline, tripped over it or ran past it, or put the cross into row Z 80% of the time.



:lol:

He usually loses the ball before he can beat them though. His crossing has gotten better I think though, but it isn't great yet. When used right Theo can be a god send, because of his speed and his finishing, but when we try to play our quick passing with him, its not as effective because that isn't his game, but its Arsenals game, so the two don't always mix. I like Theo, I really do, the kid is great and is humble and says all the right things, but I think some of us Gooners put him on a higher pedestal than he should be.
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Re: Vela set to stay put at Arsenal.

Postby StLGooner » Thu Jun 23, 2011 8:08 pm

gzagee wrote:What sets Walcott apart from Vela is determination. Theo is more willing to put his body on the line than Vela.
Vela may have fancy feet and a cute chip-shot but, it means nothing if you aren't ready to fight and earn your spurs.
Vela, to my mind and those of WBA supporters, doesn't show that chutzpah. So having all that supposed 'talent' means nothing if you lack that inner strength.
Walcott is beginning to show that now. And I believe he'd do well in a two-man attack.
Vela's supporters cannot continue to blame the managers for his lack of opportunities. Somewhere down the line you have to look at yourself and ask what more you have to do to impress the bossman. That belief comes from an inner-strength. Vela may well have to but, he needs to show it.



Well put and I agree with that, and that may be his problem. But like I said, and what my point was, is that as far as skill wise, he's just as good if not better.
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Re: Vela set to stay put at Arsenal.

Postby Inchpräctice » Thu Jun 23, 2011 8:09 pm

ChVint22 wrote:Thats all besides the point you were trying to make though. You said he's 100 times more effective in the Prem, well thats because he's had 100 more chances. And I don't remember all those times Theo beat a defender, I don't think there are that many. Bottom line, imo, Vela has more tools in his bag than Theo, and the good things that Theo can do, Vela can do them as well. Maybe Theo has a better mental side to the game which allows him to perform well in training and when given the chance? I don't know, but until I see Vela given more chances, I'm not going to discount him being a good player for us.

You may not remember all those times he's beaten a defender but there must be at least 13 of them if he's scored 13 goals.
;)

I didn't discount Vela being a good player for us either. He could be.
All I ever said is that right now he's not as effective as Theo and when he HAS been given the chances to impress, whether that be coming on as a sub, or playing the full 90 in the FA Cup or whatever he hasn't done enough to convince me (or AW) that he could influence a game in the Prem or CL.

Whereas Theo started as a sub and gradually earned his starting place by impressing as a sub and scoring goals as a sub.
If Vela started influencing the game as a sub he'd get some starts but he hasn't.
Nobody's fault but his own.
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Re: Vela set to stay put at Arsenal.

Postby Inchpräctice » Thu Jun 23, 2011 8:11 pm

gzagee wrote:What sets Walcott apart from Vela is determination. Theo is more willing to put his body on the line than Vela.
Vela may have fancy feet and a cute chip-shot but, it means nothing if you aren't ready to fight and earn your spurs.
Vela, to my mind and those of WBA supporters, doesn't show that chutzpah. So having all that supposed 'talent' means nothing if you lack that inner strength.
Walcott is beginning to show that now. And I believe he'd do well in a two-man attack.
Vela's supporters cannot continue to blame the managers for his lack of opportunities. Somewhere down the line you have to look at yourself and ask what more you have to do to impress the bossman. That belief comes from an inner-strength. Vela may well have to but, he needs to show it.

I agree, it's the sheer determination, the fire in the belly etc.
Vela is a bit too laid back at times and maybe that's part of the problem.
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Re: Vela set to stay put at Arsenal.

Postby StLGooner » Thu Jun 23, 2011 8:12 pm

Inchpractice wrote:
ChVint22 wrote:Thats all besides the point you were trying to make though. You said he's 100 times more effective in the Prem, well thats because he's had 100 more chances. And I don't remember all those times Theo beat a defender, I don't think there are that many. Bottom line, imo, Vela has more tools in his bag than Theo, and the good things that Theo can do, Vela can do them as well. Maybe Theo has a better mental side to the game which allows him to perform well in training and when given the chance? I don't know, but until I see Vela given more chances, I'm not going to discount him being a good player for us.

You may not remember all those times he's beaten a defender but there must be at least 13 of them if he's scored 13 goals.
;)

I didn't discount Vela being a good player for us either. He could be.
All I ever said is that right now he's not as effective as Theo and when he HAS been given the chances to impress, whether that be coming on as a sub, or playing the full 90 in the FA Cup or whatever he hasn't done enough to convince me (or AW) that he could influence a game in the Prem or CL.

Whereas Theo started as a sub and gradually earned his starting place by impressing as a sub and scoring goals as a sub.
If Vela started influencing the game as a sub he'd get some starts but he hasn't.
Nobody's fault but his own.


Yea on through balls, where all he had to do is run past them without the ball. ;)

And I agree with the rest. And if he's given some more chances this season and gives more of the same then his times up with us.
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Re: Vela set to stay put at Arsenal.

Postby Leody » Thu Jun 23, 2011 8:13 pm

ChVint22 wrote:
Leody wrote:Reason you don't remember him beating defenders Chris, is after he managed to get by them he ran the ball over the endline, tripped over it or ran past it, or put the cross into row Z 80% of the time.



:lol:

He usually loses the ball before he can beat them though. His crossing has gotten better I think though, but it isn't great yet. When used right Theo can be a god send, because of his speed and his finishing, but when we try to play our quick passing with him, its not as effective because that isn't his game, but its Arsenals game, so the two don't always mix. I like Theo, I really do, the kid is great and is humble and says all the right things, but I think some of us Gooners put him on a higher pedestal than he should be.


He has gotten much better. It just drives me up the wall when he does that shit.
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Re: Vela set to stay put at Arsenal.

Postby StLGooner » Thu Jun 23, 2011 8:14 pm

Inchpractice wrote:
gzagee wrote:What sets Walcott apart from Vela is determination. Theo is more willing to put his body on the line than Vela.
Vela may have fancy feet and a cute chip-shot but, it means nothing if you aren't ready to fight and earn your spurs.
Vela, to my mind and those of WBA supporters, doesn't show that chutzpah. So having all that supposed 'talent' means nothing if you lack that inner strength.
Walcott is beginning to show that now. And I believe he'd do well in a two-man attack.
Vela's supporters cannot continue to blame the managers for his lack of opportunities. Somewhere down the line you have to look at yourself and ask what more you have to do to impress the bossman. That belief comes from an inner-strength. Vela may well have to but, he needs to show it.

I agree, it's the sheer determination, the fire in the belly etc.
Vela is a bit too laid back at times and maybe that's part of the problem.



Yep, you English f***ers are always fired up. The Mexicans only get fired up against us yanks, besides that they're usually softies. :biggrin:
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Re: Vela set to stay put at Arsenal.

Postby gzagee » Thu Jun 23, 2011 8:19 pm

Theo's DEFINITELY deserves to be ahead of Vela. Don't care what fancydan tricks Vela can preform. He's weak, easily dominated, goes into his shell and can be found wanting all too often for my liking.
That's why I have little to- no time for him.
I watched him play for Mexico against England in a warm-up game for last year's WC and the two chances he missed left me shaking my head. Where was that supposed clinical edge he's been hailed to possess? Where was that dead-eye composure I'd been led to believe?
The reason I found that performance particularly galling was because he was playing with his buddies. He should've felt comfortable playing with them. And the fact he was up against Ferdinand and King, two crocked England CBs. He fluffed his lines not once but TWICE. I'd seen enough because I'd seen it before.
What I saw was someone who was as useful as Dos Santos has been for Spudscums....
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Vela set to stay put at Arsenal.

Postby Tony_Adams » Thu Jun 23, 2011 8:34 pm

Super Nik is better than both!
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Re: Vela set to stay put at Arsenal.

Postby Inchpräctice » Thu Jun 23, 2011 8:39 pm

gzagee wrote:Theo's DEFINITELY deserves to be ahead of Vela. Don't care what fancydan tricks Vela can preform. He's weak, easily dominated, goes into his shell and can be found wanting all too often for my liking.
That's why I have little to- no time for him.
I watched him play for Mexico against England in a warm-up game for last year's WC and the two chances he missed left me shaking my head. Where was that supposed clinical edge he's been hailed to possess? Where was that dead-eye composure I'd been led to believe?
The reason I found that performance particularly galling was because he was playing with his buddies. He should've felt comfortable playing with them. And the fact he was up against Ferdinand and King, two crocked England CBs. He fluffed his lines not once but TWICE. I'd seen enough because I'd seen it before.
What I saw was someone who was as useful as Dos Santos has been for Spudscums....


Yeah I'd forgotten about that.
I watched that game specifically to see if Vela had progressed but as you say he wasted chances and never really looked dangerous.
The YouTube videos we watched before he came to us look like lies now. :crybaby:

Plymouth Gooner wrote:Super Nik is better than both!

Certainly better than Vela. Stronger, more capable of changing a game, more determined etc.
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Re: Vela set to stay put at Arsenal.

Postby Popey » Thu Jun 23, 2011 8:58 pm

vela has a better stats than torres with chelsea :arsesmile:
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Re: Vela set to stay put at Arsenal.

Postby Popey » Thu Jun 23, 2011 8:59 pm

Inchpractice wrote:
gzagee wrote:Theo's DEFINITELY deserves to be ahead of Vela. Don't care what fancydan tricks Vela can preform. He's weak, easily dominated, goes into his shell and can be found wanting all too often for my liking.
That's why I have little to- no time for him.
I watched him play for Mexico against England in a warm-up game for last year's WC and the two chances he missed left me shaking my head. Where was that supposed clinical edge he's been hailed to possess? Where was that dead-eye composure I'd been led to believe?
The reason I found that performance particularly galling was because he was playing with his buddies. He should've felt comfortable playing with them. And the fact he was up against Ferdinand and King, two crocked England CBs. He fluffed his lines not once but TWICE. I'd seen enough because I'd seen it before.
What I saw was someone who was as useful as Dos Santos has been for Spudscums....


Yeah I'd forgotten about that.
I watched that game specifically to see if Vela had progressed but as you say he wasted chances and never really looked dangerous.
The YouTube videos we watched before he came to us look like lies now. :crybaby:

Plymouth Gooner wrote:Super Nik is better than both!

Certainly better than Vela. Stronger, more capable of changing a game, more determined etc.


nic also had much more gametime than vela. nic had a full season at birmingham and wenger also used him much more than vela.
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Re: Vela set to stay put at Arsenal.

Postby Inchpräctice » Thu Jun 23, 2011 9:05 pm

Popey wrote:
Inchpractice wrote:
gzagee wrote:Theo's DEFINITELY deserves to be ahead of Vela. Don't care what fancydan tricks Vela can preform. He's weak, easily dominated, goes into his shell and can be found wanting all too often for my liking.
That's why I have little to- no time for him.
I watched him play for Mexico against England in a warm-up game for last year's WC and the two chances he missed left me shaking my head. Where was that supposed clinical edge he's been hailed to possess? Where was that dead-eye composure I'd been led to believe?
The reason I found that performance particularly galling was because he was playing with his buddies. He should've felt comfortable playing with them. And the fact he was up against Ferdinand and King, two crocked England CBs. He fluffed his lines not once but TWICE. I'd seen enough because I'd seen it before.
What I saw was someone who was as useful as Dos Santos has been for Spudscums....


Yeah I'd forgotten about that.
I watched that game specifically to see if Vela had progressed but as you say he wasted chances and never really looked dangerous.
The YouTube videos we watched before he came to us look like lies now. :crybaby:

Plymouth Gooner wrote:Super Nik is better than both!

Certainly better than Vela. Stronger, more capable of changing a game, more determined etc.


nic also had much more gametime than vela. nic had a full season at birmingham and wenger also used him much more than vela.

True.
Maybe this season Vela will be more determined to make an impact on the squad or whichever club he's loaned out to.
Feels a bit like he's running out of time though. If he doesn't so something this season I don't know how long he'll last even with AW's legendary patience.
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Re: Vela set to stay put at Arsenal.

Postby Popey » Fri Jun 24, 2011 7:08 am

Inchpractice wrote:
Popey wrote:
Inchpractice wrote:
gzagee wrote:Theo's DEFINITELY deserves to be ahead of Vela. Don't care what fancydan tricks Vela can preform. He's weak, easily dominated, goes into his shell and can be found wanting all too often for my liking.
That's why I have little to- no time for him.
I watched him play for Mexico against England in a warm-up game for last year's WC and the two chances he missed left me shaking my head. Where was that supposed clinical edge he's been hailed to possess? Where was that dead-eye composure I'd been led to believe?
The reason I found that performance particularly galling was because he was playing with his buddies. He should've felt comfortable playing with them. And the fact he was up against Ferdinand and King, two crocked England CBs. He fluffed his lines not once but TWICE. I'd seen enough because I'd seen it before.
What I saw was someone who was as useful as Dos Santos has been for Spudscums....


Yeah I'd forgotten about that.
I watched that game specifically to see if Vela had progressed but as you say he wasted chances and never really looked dangerous.
The YouTube videos we watched before he came to us look like lies now. :crybaby:

Plymouth Gooner wrote:Super Nik is better than both!

Certainly better than Vela. Stronger, more capable of changing a game, more determined etc.


nic also had much more gametime than vela. nic had a full season at birmingham and wenger also used him much more than vela.

True.
Maybe this season Vela will be more determined to make an impact on the squad or whichever club he's loaned out to.
Feels a bit like he's running out of time though. If he doesn't so something this season I don't know how long he'll last even with AW's legendary patience.


look at diaby and denilson ;) wenger is the patience master
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