The general boxing thread

Re: The general boxing thread

Postby VCC » Thu Oct 14, 2021 6:20 am

Dont have to hit hard if you counter punch and use the opponents momentum, it's all about timing.
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Re: The general boxing thread

Postby Rockape » Thu Oct 14, 2021 8:58 am

I gave up boxing when I discovered my back was allergic to canvas!

I was also a good looking young lad and didn't fancy having my nose spread across my face! :)
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Re: The general boxing thread

Postby Power n Glory » Thu Oct 14, 2021 1:42 pm

theHotHead wrote:
Power n Glory wrote:
jayramfootball wrote:I watched the Joshua - Usyk fight again.
Just really stood out how scared Joshua is these days of getting hit. He looks like a prancing pony when he boxes now. No intent, just trying to not get hit.
Thing is his defence is appalling and he can't take a punch well. When he gets hit his recovery time is way too long. Imagine Wilder or Fury hitting him instead of a cruiserweight. It would be dangerous for him.
Looking at that again, it seems to me that any fight he had in him left when he got battered by Ruiz.


He reminds me of Audley Harrison. Scarred to let his hands go and terrified of taking a punch.

Oh snap - thats EXACTLY who he reminds me of !! Likewise Harrison was a fraid to let the shots go, that was so apparent about Joshusa in the Usyk fight. The thing is, when Joshua did throw heat, you could see the difference in power anfd intent compatred to what Usyk threw, so much more power was there. Baffled about Joshua's game plan, to outbox a boxer :dontknow:


Yep. It was a like a flashback to watching Harrison fights and wondering why he hasn't thrown a right all round. He had the size advantage, like Joshua, most fights but just never had it in him to let loose. Joshua has been giving that same vibe over his last couple of fights.
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Re: The general boxing thread

Postby theHotHead » Fri Oct 15, 2021 12:54 pm

DiamondGooner wrote:
theHotHead wrote:Should have told Ali what ? you are the one claiming Fury is the best heavyweight ever :rofll:

If you think MMA and boxing are nothing alike you are a bigger fool than your previous posts suggested. Considering Boxing is a key part of MMA, considering every top MMA fighter has a striking coach, considering most of the top heavyweights in MMA are not grapplers at all, they are stand up fighters, boxing plays a massive part:

Shows how much you know about MMA, you claim all it takes is someone with a much higher level of submission to eradicate other skills, thats nonsense yet the vast majority of wins across all classes are from knockouts not submissions.

So when you see fighters standing up and "boxing" in the octogon according to you DG they are not boxing because it is nothing like boxing :lol:

No dunce can be a teacher, I thought you might be able to teach me something, turns out you are full of yourself .. and hot air.


Are you alright mate?

MMA and boxing are ......... nothing alike.

One is a sport purely stand up and you can only use punches, the other is the complete opposite, that's how they're nothing alike.

Muay thai, Wrestling, submissions, stand up and ground game are not in boxing so yeah ........ its like comparing Football and Rugby you bloody dougnut, you kick in Rugby as well, so what? completely different sports.

Have you not seen the recent MMA fighters crossing over to boxing? Tyrone Woodly, long time Welterweight champ beaten by Jake Paul ffs ........ so yeah totally the same.
Randy Couture beat James Tony in 1 round, if MMA was like boxing would that happen? no.

You've got problems lad.

You spent all that time trying to detail MMA to me, I've been watching the UFC since UFC 1 back before 1995, I mean what are you doing?

I've done MMA for years and my Cousin has had matches.

Boxing in MMA is nothing like boxing in actual boxing, the stance is different because of takedowns and Thai low leg kicks and MMA fighters to people who have a keen eye, don't have the intricacies of technique that a boxer has.

Look at the way Woodley couldn't beat Jake or the way Connor a renowned good striker in MMA, look at the way he boxed Floyd, no boxer fights like that.

.............. and no I can't teach you anything, as I said, its like trying to teach a dolphin to climb a tree.

Maybe if you stopped ranting and trying to "one-up" you'd stop to ask why I'm saying what I'm saying?

Mate, all I see is blah blah blah. Nothing you have responded with changes any of the facts, you post things and think you are making a point when the point is either moot or irrelevant. Here are some examples:

Johnny Wilkinson kicking penalties and conversions, discussion with David Beckham, Wilkinson then takes a load of free kicks and strikes the ball like ANY expert deadball football specialist. The fact he kicks a rugby ball for a living doesn't change how you strike a ball to keep it low and under the wind, to strike it high, to curl it from left to right or from right to left. Is kicking a rugby ball similar to kicking a football ? Are there techniques employed by both players when striking the ball ? Absolutely.

Dude - I made it quite clear, there are plenty of stand up fighters in MMA that prefer not to go to ground, they are strikers, be it Thai boxing, Kick boxing, Taekwondo or boxing. The link I sent showed that at the beginning of a fight the fight starts on the feet, you can see the karate fighters adopt a karate stance, Muay Thai boxers adopt a Muay stance, those more comfortable in a traditional boxing stance adopt a boxing stance. Anyone that knows anything about fighting (which you claim to know) understands the fundamental difference between how a traditional boxer throws a punch to how they do in martial arts, the thing that stands out when boxers box is their foot movement. Watch any striker in MMA and watch their footwork, its EXACTLY THE SAME as a traditional boxer's footwork. Half the MMA fights that have striker vs striker look like boxing matches minus the gloves and the boots. But according to you they are NOTHING alike :rofll:

To be clear, I said all you have done is think you are making a point but its either irrelevant or moot. At no point did I say Wrestling was the same as boxing, I made a very clear point of saying MMA INCLUDES boxing and that boxing is a very important part of MMA, so when MMA fighters go at it striking each other using their boxing - guess what - its the same as bloody boxing isn't it !! I never said anything about an MMA fighter taking down a boxer, I distanced the wrestling/grappling part of MMA quite clearly because I wasn't talking about that when I wrote:

If you think MMA and boxing are nothing alike you are a bigger fool than your previous posts suggested. Considering Boxing is a key part of MMA, considering every top MMA fighter has a striking coach, considering most of the top heavyweights in MMA are not grapplers at all, they are stand up fighters, boxing plays a massive part
:doh:

Everything else you wrote is irrelevant. Let me make my argument quite clear - AGAIN ! Boxing is a key component for EVERY MMA fighter, most MMA fighters secure victories through TKOs not submissions, most top heavyweight MMA fighters throw punches, they don't try to get you on the floor to submit you. Boxing is VERY evident in MMA, whether you want to admit it or not, up to you.
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Re: The general boxing thread

Postby theHotHead » Fri Oct 15, 2021 1:02 pm

Jedi wrote:Hothead you're talking absolute bollocks again. Nobody disagrees that boxing is a useful skill to have in MMA. The point is that to be remotely successful in MMA you need a good grappling background and even if you want to be a pure striker you still need to be good enough at grappling to at least be able to stuff takedowns consistently.

The grappling aspect of MMA plus the leg kicks/elbows and much smaller glove size completely change the dynamics and make most boxing styles/guards completely obsolete. So just because something works in MMA that doesn't mean that translates to boxing. All you need is to look at that idiot Jake Paul who's a boxing novice and is bringing in MMA champions to the boxing ring and knocking them out.

Dude, please keep up !

DG said Boxing and MMA are nothing alike. I countered by showing how Boxing and MMA have a lot of similarities, not least because most fighters don't go for submission wins they go to knock people out, they have boxing coaches, they spend a lot of their time boxing, doing footwork, the key skill that all MMA fighters begin the fight with. DG brought in wrestling. Pugelistic sports people have exactly the same traits across the various disciplines, if you don't agree then neither of you know what the f**k you are talking about. You can't be scared to take shots, you have to remain disciplined, you have to have determination, you have to be able to draw from the well when the going gets tough, you need to have heart. Tell me what f***ing pugelistic sport these attributes are not important in :rofll:
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Re: The general boxing thread

Postby theHotHead » Fri Oct 15, 2021 1:10 pm

DiamondGooner wrote:
theHotHead wrote:One of my ex colleagues was an amateur heavyweight, had about 10 fights I think he said, his brother had a lot more than that. We started training together to get fit, he convinced me to buy some gloves and a whacking great body protector, we used to go to the gym during our lunch break and spar. Turns out the body protector was big and cumbersome and got in the way so I got rid of it. We used 16oz Lonsdale gloves. We said no headshots but anything else goes.

The first time I got hit on the nose from a stray shot, the searing pain that went through me literally made my eyes water ! We were both 17st10 at the time, 6ft3, identical size and stature. What I noticed was his combinations, I had never really paid any mind to combinations prior, he was throwing 4 and 5 punch combos and always seemed to be in perfect balance with each shot, he never put full power in his shots, more like 60-75%, the sheer volume of his attacks would leave me in a heap as opposed to the power. I'd go for revenge and try to crack him with hard shots because I didn't have combos. Taught me a thing or two, boxing wasn't for me, the pain of being punched accidentally on the nose confirmed that.


Well neither of those words have ever or would I ever allow to utter from my mouth.

The first boxing session I went to when I was 16 I came home thinking it was the hardest thing I'd ever done in my life and was thinking "I might just go back to Judo", I decided right there and then that if I ever wanted to be the fighter I wanted to be I was going to go back to the next boxing class and become fit enough etc.

Anyway 20 or so years later .............

I used to have epic sparring matches, always go hard as long as the other guy wasn't a complete flake then I'd have to take it easy.

I didn't go hard to be an arsehole, I used to go hard because that's what a proper match is going to be like and you can't ask for "no head shots" in a match, for me I used to prepare to kill or be killed, I just found that was the best way for me to prepare for a match.

Also I got hit in the nose in my last sparring session by a guy over 18st who's now a bare knuckle champion and his KO'ing HW's all over the show.
I barely squinted although I had a small trickle of blood come down, I just thought "Right I'm going to whack this big mofo with the best shot I have" and I did.
He said that was the hardest he's been hit in any of his fights.

Bit out of my weight class though by 4 stone and I'm getting older, not as fit / tough as I used to be, I used to be an animal, I miss the days. :lol:

Yeah see, this is what VCC is saying, it takes a certain type of person to put themselves through that, either to better themselves or for enjoyment ! Like I said, I only did it to get fit, I had no interest in taking it further than that, but, like I said, getting hit on the nose for me was freekin awful !! I can tell you right now its not for me. In recent time I did think about this blue/white collar boxing malarkey, I know some guys and girls that have done it and said it was exhilarating. But I think that boat has passed by.

The thing is, I know I can take care of myself, so when it comes to stuff on the street it doesn't bother me, but just thinking about getting punched on the nose in the boxing ring is like "nah, no haps!!" That shit hurts like fook !
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Re: The general boxing thread

Postby DiamondGooner » Fri Oct 15, 2021 3:01 pm

theHotHead wrote:Everything else you wrote is irrelevant. Let me make my argument quite clear - AGAIN ! Boxing is a key component for EVERY MMA fighter, most MMA fighters secure victories through TKOs not submissions, most top heavyweight MMA fighters throw punches, they don't try to get you on the floor to submit you. Boxing is VERY evident in MMA, whether you want to admit it or not, up to you.


Sigh ............

Boxing is as similar to MMA as it is to Muay Thai ............

In fact its more similar to Muay Thai because Thai is stand up only, but guess what?

Muay Thai and boxing are nothing alike either. :rofll:

Just because you have a fighter who's throwing punches, when you start adding in kicks and grappling, its not the same.

The only point you have is the bleeding fkin obvious one and that is punches are thrown in those sports, but guess what, punches are thrown in Karate as well, doesn't mean its similar to boxing.

......... Royce Gracie didn't use boxing, Randy Couture barely used boxing, Brock Lesnar, GSP's boxing sucked, all were champions.

Just because MMA fighters have boxing coaches, so what, they have kickboxing and grappling coaches as well.

Boxing is punching only, if the sport isn't punching only then its not similar is it pal?
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Re: The general boxing thread

Postby DiamondGooner » Fri Oct 15, 2021 3:09 pm

theHotHead wrote:Yeah see, this is what VCC is saying, it takes a certain type of person to put themselves through that, either to better themselves or for enjoyment ! Like I said, I only did it to get fit, I had no interest in taking it further than that, but, like I said, getting hit on the nose for me was freekin awful !! I can tell you right now its not for me. In recent time I did think about this blue/white collar boxing malarkey, I know some guys and girls that have done it and said it was exhilarating. But I think that boat has passed by.

The thing is, I know I can take care of myself, so when it comes to stuff on the street it doesn't bother me, but just thinking about getting punched on the nose in the boxing ring is like "nah, no haps!!" That shit hurts like fook !


I've only been hit on the nose properly about 3x in 20+ years, never broken though.

Once you get good enough you learn how to angle away from those sorts of things as your defence improves.

That's why you have career boxers like Floyd, Ali, Jones Jr in fact lots of them don't have crooked or broken noses.
Don't get me wrong it can happen to anyone but there are pro's with 30+ fights plus amatuer fights who like me have noses which are absolutey fine.

I'd never have a white collar, boxing with 16oz gloves and headguards is a complete turn off, I wear less protection than that in sparring.
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Re: The general boxing thread

Postby theHotHead » Sat Oct 16, 2021 1:31 pm

DiamondGooner wrote:
theHotHead wrote:Everything else you wrote is irrelevant. Let me make my argument quite clear - AGAIN ! Boxing is a key component for EVERY MMA fighter, most MMA fighters secure victories through TKOs not submissions, most top heavyweight MMA fighters throw punches, they don't try to get you on the floor to submit you. Boxing is VERY evident in MMA, whether you want to admit it or not, up to you.


Sigh ............

Boxing is as similar to MMA as it is to Muay Thai ............

In fact its more similar to Muay Thai because Thai is stand up only, but guess what?

Muay Thai and boxing are nothing alike either. :rofll:

Just because you have a fighter who's throwing punches, when you start adding in kicks and grappling, its not the same.

The only point you have is the bleeding fkin obvious one and that is punches are thrown in those sports, but guess what, punches are thrown in Karate as well, doesn't mean its similar to boxing.

......... Royce Gracie didn't use boxing, Randy Couture barely used boxing, Brock Lesnar, GSP's boxing sucked, all were champions.

Just because MMA fighters have boxing coaches, so what, they have kickboxing and grappling coaches as well.

Boxing is punching only, if the sport isn't punching only then its not similar is it pal?

And therein you miss the entire point I was making in one fell swoop.

Forget the kicks, forget the grappling. When you have 2 stand up fighters that are not interested in taking the fight down to the ground and engage predominantly in boxing - where plenty of MMA fighters and their fights do play out as such - its a boxing match. I made that point clear from the start, I continued to make that point, but you seem to bypass it with worrying regularity. If peeps aren't kicking and wrestling each other - they are punching each other - and they are not throwing karate or wing chun punches, they are throwing boxing punches ... with a few spinning back fists and elbows thrown in
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Re: The general boxing thread

Postby DiamondGooner » Sat Oct 16, 2021 6:17 pm

theHotHead wrote:And therein you miss the entire point I was making in one fell swoop.

Forget the kicks, forget the grappling. When you have 2 stand up fighters that are not interested in taking the fight down to the ground and engage predominantly in boxing - where plenty of MMA fighters and their fights do play out as such - its a boxing match. I made that point clear from the start, I continued to make that point, but you seem to bypass it with worrying regularity. If peeps aren't kicking and wrestling each other - they are punching each other - and they are not throwing karate or wing chun punches, they are throwing boxing punches ... with a few spinning back fists and elbows thrown in


............. right, now go show me one and I mean EVEN ONE UFC fight where the fighters went the full 5mins not throwing one kick, knee, elbow or didn't go to the ground for the whole round.

I'll wait fucko.

Check mate, thanks for that.

How the fk can you forget the kicks and the grappling when its MMA you court jester???
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Re: The general boxing thread

Postby theHotHead » Sat Oct 16, 2021 6:26 pm

Mate - you said they were nothing alike, I think I have proven they are very similar, I think I proved that the traits that make a great boxer make a great MMA fighter. You are the one that can't accept the truth. MMA fighters box, as much as they kick and some as much as they grapple/wrestle. Argument done.
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Re: The general boxing thread

Postby DiamondGooner » Sat Oct 16, 2021 6:32 pm

theHotHead wrote:Mate - you said they were nothing alike, I think I have proven they are very similar, I think I proved that the traits that make a great boxer make a great MMA fighter. You are the one that can't accept the truth. MMA fighters box, as much as they kick and some as much as they grapple/wrestle. Argument done.


Nope you're wrong on all our points except that punching is part of the sport, one part of many.

Go find me that footage or its over for you dude.

:rofll:

While you're doing that, the "traits" you mentioned are the same "traits" for any athlete or combat sport.

Toughness isn't exclusive to MMA and boxing, its every martial art, NFL, Rugby.

Just take the L on this one.
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Re: The general boxing thread

Postby Rockape » Sun Oct 17, 2021 6:57 am

:lol:
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Re: The general boxing thread

Postby Va-Va-Voom » Sun Oct 17, 2021 6:33 pm

MMA boxing and boxing are very different.

A lot of the defense in boxing is predicated on the size of the gloves, you lose all of that in MMA.

Covering up, parrying, blocking, a typical guard - all that goes out the window in MMA.

It's so easy for punches that would have been blocked or deflected by boxing gloves to slip through and land in MMA - and you're going to feel a way bigger impact getting hit with 4 oz. gloves compared to the 8, 10 or 12 oz. gloves they use in boxing.

Not to mention the most fundamental aspect of all: your stance.

You can't even dream of using the side on stance used in boxing with your shoulder facing your opponent, it's simply not applicable.

In MMA you would be taken down immediately or have your legs kicked to ribbons.

MMA fighters have to be ready to check kicks and sprawl/stuff takedown attempts at all times.

Also if you watch MMA you know that the jab is insanely under utilized in the sport whereas it's literally the staple technique in boxing.

The same is true of body work, I can count on one hand the number of fighters who consistently employ and have success with going to the body in the UFC.
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Re: The general boxing thread

Postby jayramfootball » Sun Oct 17, 2021 6:51 pm

I think people are going OTT a bit on how different MMA and Boxing are.
Yes, they are different, but they do share a lot too.
If they didn't we would never have seen McGregor vs Mayweather in an actual sanctioned boxing match.
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