The Wizard of Özil

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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby theHotHead » Wed Jan 13, 2021 8:02 am

VCC wrote:
swipe right wrote:
EliteKiller wrote:
swipe right wrote:Speaking on his FIVE YouTube channel, Ferdinand said: “If I was Mikel Arteta I would have gone in and assessed the situation. Why hasn’t he played previously? Speak to Mesut.

“And then it’s all about how he applies himself on the training pitch. I’d ask him how it was in the last regime but then I’d give him a clean slate and say, ‘Right, you go out there and do the work for me. Work on the training pitch and then I see it playing out in the 90 minutes at the Emirates and all the grounds, then we’ll have a great time together’, that’s the way I’d have approached it.

“The problem is with this whole situation, whether you’re an Arsenal fan or someone looking in as a football fan, we haven’t really been given any insights about how the situation has got to where it has got to.

“Mesut Ozil is a World Cup winner, a player who played at Madrid and was fantastic there, done some great things at Arsenal. But he’s spending more time sitting on Twitter and Instagram talking about his team and the young players and sending out funny messages than he is kicking a ball and it doesn’t make sense to me.

“And I want to know the reasons why, like everybody else. Why is he not playing? The kid’s talent is unbelievable. Cristiano Ronaldo was devastated when he left Real Madrid because he was the man who was putting chances on a plate more than anyone for him.

“If I was a manager, it’s about clarity and consistency with messaging. Don’t leave any grey areas for people like us to keep debating about it and asking questions.

“Come out in your first press conference or whenever that time is and say, ‘Listen, he ain’t for me. This kid ain’t for me! He was a great player in the past but he ain’t the same player who I saw years ago and he ain’t good enough to wear this shirt’.

“So he can either sit in the background and be quiet and train on his own or get his agent to find him a new club. That clarity I think dispels and takes away so much of the grey areas and the debates and the conversations that go around. Because what it all does is it destabilises the club in the end.”


So when Arteta came out and said almost exactly that "it's my decision he's not in the squad for footballing reasons" all the Ozil fanboys piled in calling him a liar, they still do.

Do you believe the manager or not? and frankly who cares what anyone else believes, that's exactly what Arteta said ....

If Arteta is to be believed there are 25 players better for “footballing reasons” than Ozil. That’s just not true but of course the Mikel Mafia won’t acknowledge that.

It may be the case that 25 players are willing to work harder for the cause than Ozil

If working harder for the cause doesn't trump supreme technical ability I would take supreme technical ability all day every day.

Working harder for the cause didn't prevent us from having the worst start to a season in 40 odd years!
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby swipe right » Wed Jan 13, 2021 8:13 am

theHotHead wrote:
VCC wrote:
swipe right wrote:
EliteKiller wrote:
swipe right wrote:Speaking on his FIVE YouTube channel, Ferdinand said: “If I was Mikel Arteta I would have gone in and assessed the situation. Why hasn’t he played previously? Speak to Mesut.

“And then it’s all about how he applies himself on the training pitch. I’d ask him how it was in the last regime but then I’d give him a clean slate and say, ‘Right, you go out there and do the work for me. Work on the training pitch and then I see it playing out in the 90 minutes at the Emirates and all the grounds, then we’ll have a great time together’, that’s the way I’d have approached it.

“The problem is with this whole situation, whether you’re an Arsenal fan or someone looking in as a football fan, we haven’t really been given any insights about how the situation has got to where it has got to.

“Mesut Ozil is a World Cup winner, a player who played at Madrid and was fantastic there, done some great things at Arsenal. But he’s spending more time sitting on Twitter and Instagram talking about his team and the young players and sending out funny messages than he is kicking a ball and it doesn’t make sense to me.

“And I want to know the reasons why, like everybody else. Why is he not playing? The kid’s talent is unbelievable. Cristiano Ronaldo was devastated when he left Real Madrid because he was the man who was putting chances on a plate more than anyone for him.

“If I was a manager, it’s about clarity and consistency with messaging. Don’t leave any grey areas for people like us to keep debating about it and asking questions.

“Come out in your first press conference or whenever that time is and say, ‘Listen, he ain’t for me. This kid ain’t for me! He was a great player in the past but he ain’t the same player who I saw years ago and he ain’t good enough to wear this shirt’.

“So he can either sit in the background and be quiet and train on his own or get his agent to find him a new club. That clarity I think dispels and takes away so much of the grey areas and the debates and the conversations that go around. Because what it all does is it destabilises the club in the end.”


So when Arteta came out and said almost exactly that "it's my decision he's not in the squad for footballing reasons" all the Ozil fanboys piled in calling him a liar, they still do.

Do you believe the manager or not? and frankly who cares what anyone else believes, that's exactly what Arteta said ....

If Arteta is to be believed there are 25 players better for “footballing reasons” than Ozil. That’s just not true but of course the Mikel Mafia won’t acknowledge that.

It may be the case that 25 players are willing to work harder for the cause than Ozil

If working harder for the cause doesn't trump supreme technical ability I would take supreme technical ability all day every day.

Working harder for the cause didn't prevent us from having the worst start to a season in 40 odd years!

Mah man HH :clap:
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby EliteKiller » Wed Jan 13, 2021 9:09 am

theHotHead wrote:Its a big grey area. Football reasons means anything, it does nothing to explain a damned thing. What are these football reasons, be a man and give details. Or is it most likely the case that Arteta is full of shit and he knows his reasons are wank!!


Manager says a footballer isn't doing the business at playing football - fanboy says give us another reason? .... maybe the fanboy is full of shit and he knows his reasoning is wank!?
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby swipe right » Wed Jan 13, 2021 10:50 am

EliteKiller wrote:
theHotHead wrote:Its a big grey area. Football reasons means anything, it does nothing to explain a damned thing. What are these football reasons, be a man and give details. Or is it most likely the case that Arteta is full of shit and he knows his reasons are wank!!


Manager says a footballer isn't doing the business at playing football - fanboy says give us another reason? .... maybe the fanboy is full of shit and he knows his reasoning is wank!?

Same manager buys Willian who is two months older than Ozil, significantly worse and gives him a three year deal. Footballing reasons. Sure.
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby EliteKiller » Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:24 am

swipe right wrote:
EliteKiller wrote:
theHotHead wrote:Its a big grey area. Football reasons means anything, it does nothing to explain a damned thing. What are these football reasons, be a man and give details. Or is it most likely the case that Arteta is full of shit and he knows his reasons are wank!!


Manager says a footballer isn't doing the business at playing football - fanboy says give us another reason? .... maybe the fanboy is full of shit and he knows his reasoning is wank!?

Same manager buys Willian who is two months older than Ozil, significantly worse and gives him a three year deal. Footballing reasons. Sure.


Fanboy gets upset and compares Ozil to Willian - so let's see how 'significantly worse' that looks

Ozil 2018-2020 EPL goals and assists - 4 goals 3 assists
Willian 2018-2020 EPL goals and assists - 12 goals 14 assists

But - but - but Ozil won the World Cup in 2014 ..... :rofll: :rofll: :rofll: :rofll:

Now Willian is crap and a terrible signing, but in the last two years he was soooooooooo much better than Ozil, great comparison.
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby Santi » Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:57 am

Well I completely disagree, Willian is a great signing and improved us massively!

20/21
Willian - 3 assists
Ozil - 0 assists

That's a huge improvement, imagine where we'd be without that extra productivity.
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby swipe right » Wed Jan 13, 2021 12:51 pm

EliteKiller wrote:
swipe right wrote:
EliteKiller wrote:
theHotHead wrote:Its a big grey area. Football reasons means anything, it does nothing to explain a damned thing. What are these football reasons, be a man and give details. Or is it most likely the case that Arteta is full of shit and he knows his reasons are wank!!


Manager says a footballer isn't doing the business at playing football - fanboy says give us another reason? .... maybe the fanboy is full of shit and he knows his reasoning is wank!?

Same manager buys Willian who is two months older than Ozil, significantly worse and gives him a three year deal. Footballing reasons. Sure.


Fanboy gets upset and compares Ozil to Willian - so let's see how 'significantly worse' that looks

Ozil 2018-2020 EPL goals and assists - 4 goals 3 assists
Willian 2018-2020 EPL goals and assists - 12 goals 14 assists

But - but - but Ozil won the World Cup in 2014 ..... :rofll: :rofll: :rofll: :rofll:

Now Willian is crap and a terrible signing, but in the last two years he was soooooooooo much better than Ozil, great comparison.

How many minutes did each play?
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby EliteKiller » Wed Jan 13, 2021 1:27 pm

swipe right wrote:
EliteKiller wrote:
swipe right wrote:
EliteKiller wrote:
theHotHead wrote:Its a big grey area. Football reasons means anything, it does nothing to explain a damned thing. What are these football reasons, be a man and give details. Or is it most likely the case that Arteta is full of shit and he knows his reasons are wank!!


Manager says a footballer isn't doing the business at playing football - fanboy says give us another reason? .... maybe the fanboy is full of shit and he knows his reasoning is wank!?

Same manager buys Willian who is two months older than Ozil, significantly worse and gives him a three year deal. Footballing reasons. Sure.


Fanboy gets upset and compares Ozil to Willian - so let's see how 'significantly worse' that looks

Ozil 2018-2020 EPL goals and assists - 6 goals 4 assists
Willian 2018-2020 EPL goals and assists - 12 goals 13 assists

But - but - but Ozil won the World Cup in 2014 ..... :rofll: :rofll: :rofll: :rofll:

Now Willian is crap and a terrible signing, but in the last two years he was soooooooooo much better than Ozil, great comparison.

How many minutes did each play?


Who cares? It's what they do for the club that matters .... siting on your arse posting internet crap, that's not worth 350 pence a week let alone 350k .... if Ozil was playing like he did five years ago then none of our last three managers would have binned him - he isn't and they did.

But as you asked, and just to show that you really don't know -

2018-20 EPL Willian played 4,714 minutes and provided a goal or an assist every 188 minutes -

2018-20 EPL Ozil played 3,191 and provided a goal or an assist every 319 minutes ....

Your argument is looking more like a Swiss cheese with every post .....................
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby theHotHead » Wed Jan 13, 2021 2:21 pm

EliteKiller wrote:
theHotHead wrote:Its a big grey area. Football reasons means anything, it does nothing to explain a damned thing. What are these football reasons, be a man and give details. Or is it most likely the case that Arteta is full of shit and he knows his reasons are wank!!


Manager says a footballer isn't doing the business at playing football - fanboy says give us another reason? .... maybe the fanboy is full of shit and he knows his reasoning is wank!?

So YOU - hater - got "for footballing reasons" to mean "footballer isn't doing the business" :rofll:

It could mean a plethora or things, one of which could be "footballer does not fit the system desired".

But your blind hate of the player makes you INCAPABLE of seeing things clearly. Blinded by hate ... and you call ME a fanboy :rofll:
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby EliteKiller » Wed Jan 13, 2021 2:46 pm

theHotHead wrote:
EliteKiller wrote:
theHotHead wrote:Its a big grey area. Football reasons means anything, it does nothing to explain a damned thing. What are these football reasons, be a man and give details. Or is it most likely the case that Arteta is full of shit and he knows his reasons are wank!!


Manager says a footballer isn't doing the business at playing football - fanboy says give us another reason? .... maybe the fanboy is full of shit and he knows his reasoning is wank!?

So YOU - hater - got "for footballing reasons" to mean "footballer isn't doing the business" :rofll:

It could mean a plethora or things, one of which could be "footballer does not fit the system desired".

But your blind hate of the player makes you INCAPABLE of seeing things clearly. Blinded by hate ... and you call ME a fanboy :rofll:


footballing reasons doesn't mean footballing reasons - only you could make that argument - a case of fanboy strikes again

I don't hate Ozil just think he's been pretty shit for us for three years whilst costing us 60 million in wages which we could have far better used on a decent player ... if seeing things clearly means you think he's been great value for money ... well there's not much anyone can say.
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby theHotHead » Wed Jan 13, 2021 6:46 pm

You what?

You are holding on to "footballing reasons", like a drunkard holding his cider bottle. You then equate it to meaning Ozil was not good enough or performing, which is a perfectly valid reason. But you fail to grasp that "footballing reasons" covers a plethora of things"

I gave you an example of another perfectly valid footballing reason that Ozil may not be playing, you dismissed it and accused me of being a fanboy. You pleb!

So let's get this straight, I acknowledge there are a multitude of valid reasons Ozil is not playing, and that makes me a fanboy. You acknowledge just a single reason and think that makes you right.

Then have the audacity to make strawman arguments. Who said Ozil has been value for money? Nobody has ever said Ozil was worth £350k per week, even when he signed da ting.
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby Angelito » Wed Jan 13, 2021 9:03 pm

I don't get why some of you are defending Arteta's decision to exclude Ozil. He's not been obvious about it. The club hasn't fed any such explanation to the media.

Whenever asked, Arteta always has a diplomatic answer. He's talked about footballing reasons. That would make sense if we didn't have Willian, Xhaka, and the likes. It would be relevant if we were performing well this season.

He could have pulled off a Conte or a Mourinho and simply stated that Ozil isn't the player he thinks he is anymore, and if you're not Messi or Ronaldo, you simply have to work hard for the team and prove yourself every day. Klopp's words btw.

He could have added that Ozil hasn't shown such a conviction, nor is he the same Ozil he was, so either he buys into what the team needs, or he is free to leave.

He hasn't said it. The club has been mysterious about the whole thing.

If Pep Guardiola came to Arsenal, banished Ozil, and found himself struggling to challenge for Europe, the same questions would he asked. And, Pep has won it all.

Ozil isn't the future of Arsenal. Arteta is. There's more to worry about Arteta's own abilities and man-management skills than find solace in slating a player who won't be here next season.

All of this is merely deflecting. Today, Ozil is the scapegoat. Tomorrow, it will be Pepe or Aubameyang. Nobody wins here.

During the Wenger years, people had an inherent right to defend Wenger because of his legacy. Arteta isn't Wenger.

Ozil doesn't even play. Yet, since we've started winning games, the vitriol has been deflected back to him.

None of this helps Arsenal. The worry is Arsenal itself doesn't want to help Arsenal.

There's nothing more to this. The club brought this on itself.
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby Zenith » Wed Jan 13, 2021 9:22 pm

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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby Ach » Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:21 pm

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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby EliteKiller » Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:36 pm

theHotHead wrote:You what?

You are holding on to "footballing reasons", like a drunkard holding his cider bottle. You then equate it to meaning Ozil was not good enough or performing, which is a perfectly valid reason. But you fail to grasp that "footballing reasons" covers a plethora of things"

I gave you an example of another perfectly valid footballing reason that Ozil may not be playing, you dismissed it and accused me of being a fanboy. You pleb!

So let's get this straight, I acknowledge there are a multitude of valid reasons Ozil is not playing, and that makes me a fanboy. You acknowledge just a single reason and think that makes you right.

Then have the audacity to make strawman arguments. Who said Ozil has been value for money? Nobody has ever said Ozil was worth £350k per week, even when he signed da ting.


You just make up what suits your argument .... you can "acknowledge there are a multitude of valid reasons" all you want, truth is they are only in your fanboy brain.

Arteta has repeatedly said "footballing reasons" - the ONLY thing anyone can take from that statement, is that he's not playing for "footballing reasons" for "footballing reasons" he's been dropped from the squad ... that's it footballing reasons nothing else. Pretending there are a "plethora of things" thus only applies in your head .... footballing reasons means simply footballing reasons.

Ozil footballing wise has become a one trick pony, he can only play as an attacking number 10 with zero defensive attributes, a position made almost redundant under Arteta, his lack of contribution over the last two years doesn't deserve a place in the squad.

On the plus side the board have at last shown some balls - if you want to leave now you can forget about getting paid another 7.5m - so now it's 100% down to the desire for money. Ozil can stay playing keyboard warrior at Arsenal's expense, or he can go play football somewhere else ...
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