Amazing
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by Dejan » Thu Apr 02, 2020 3:11 pm
by Power n Glory » Thu Apr 02, 2020 3:25 pm
Angelito wrote:Power n Glory wrote:Looking at the exact quote.They were pretty much done by the time they were in their late-20s.
Putting him in the same category as Michael Owen who really was done by his late 20s is off.
Yes. He was in his late-20s after the 2014 season, so I'm not sure where in the semantics did I march wrong.
by Angelito » Thu Apr 02, 2020 5:59 pm
Power n Glory wrote:Angelito wrote:Power n Glory wrote:Looking at the exact quote.They were pretty much done by the time they were in their late-20s.
Putting him in the same category as Michael Owen who really was done by his late 20s is off.
Yes. He was in his late-20s after the 2014 season, so I'm not sure where in the semantics did I march wrong.
It's not semantics if your contradicting yourself and getting facts wrong. You denied saying he was done, I pulled the quote up and you're contradicting yourself again. Ceac won 2 league titles, a league Cup and FA Cup after 2014 and in his late 20s. If that's 'done' then it's really time to give up the ghost on some of our aging stars.
Also, Owen was playing for Newcastle in his late 20s and his body was wrecked by injuries.
Angelito wrote:Agree with you guys. Those who peak early tend to fade away quickly. That's what happened with Cesc.
It's amazing that Cesc was actually past his prime by 12/13. And, Rooney went downhill from 14/15. Cesc was 25/26. Rooney was 29.
It's even weirder in Cesc and Owen's cases. They were pretty much done by the time they were in their late-20s.
by Power n Glory » Thu Apr 02, 2020 6:44 pm
by Angelito » Fri Apr 03, 2020 2:16 pm
Power n Glory wrote:16/17 Cesc scored 7 with 15 assists. Conte wasn't a major fan of Cesc but he played his part and they won the league despite having to fight for his place. The following season he started way more games. Only 3 goals and 9 assists but far from done.
Now bear in mind Ozil in 16/17 scored 12 goals with 14 assists but played almost twice as many minutes. That should at least put things in perspective.
by Marsbar100 » Fri Apr 03, 2020 4:22 pm
by Power n Glory » Fri Apr 03, 2020 4:26 pm
by Marsbar100 » Fri Apr 03, 2020 6:19 pm
by Ach » Fri Apr 03, 2020 7:11 pm
by swipe right » Sat Apr 04, 2020 11:23 am
by Angelito » Sun Apr 05, 2020 2:00 pm
Marsbar100 wrote:Cesc has more assists than ozil from 14 onwards in the pl, put into perspective he was in a defensive team under maureen, he played deeper than ozil with less flexibility m
If you take ozils great half a season out he was as getting out assisted and scored by Ramsey and Cazorla times.
by Power n Glory » Sun Apr 05, 2020 3:25 pm
Angelito wrote:Marsbar100 wrote:Cesc has more assists than ozil from 14 onwards in the pl, put into perspective he was in a defensive team under maureen, he played deeper than ozil with less flexibility m
If you take ozils great half a season out he was as getting out assisted and scored by Ramsey and Cazorla times.
Ozil has a total of 60 assists and 36 goals since 14/15.
Cesc had a total of 59 assists and 22 goals.
Using your logic, Ozil played for an inferior side, under inferior managers. Do you want me to bring Ozil's assist record when they were at Spain or for their national teams on the table too?
Regardless, this isn't a Ozil vs Cesc issue. I was afraid it would turn into one once the argument commenced.
This also pretty much counters Power's argument.
That said, the original argument was about Cesc being done by his late 20s. I haven't seen a point against that argument yet. I don't think anyone can deny that. It's fine to appreciate the man. But he was pretty much on his last legs by 2015; by 2016 at the latest.
Much ado about nothing.
He didn't play a significant role in Conte's side. He played a mere ~ 1400 minutes.
It still doesn't address the fact that he was still capable of scoring and assisting. It's not easy to ignore the numbers and it definitely kills any argument of him not contributing to that second title win. He finished the season with the most assists in the league for Chelsea so it's pretty silly to downplay his contribution.
by Arsenal Tone » Sun Apr 05, 2020 3:51 pm
Which strikers were they all feeding though?Power n Glory wrote:Angelito wrote:Marsbar100 wrote:Cesc has more assists than ozil from 14 onwards in the pl, put into perspective he was in a defensive team under maureen, he played deeper than ozil with less flexibility m
If you take ozils great half a season out he was as getting out assisted and scored by Ramsey and Cazorla times.
Ozil has a total of 60 assists and 36 goals since 14/15.
Cesc had a total of 59 assists and 22 goals.
Using your logic, Ozil played for an inferior side, under inferior managers. Do you want me to bring Ozil's assist record when they were at Spain or for their national teams on the table too?
Regardless, this isn't a Ozil vs Cesc issue. I was afraid it would turn into one once the argument commenced.
This also pretty much counters Power's argument.
That said, the original argument was about Cesc being done by his late 20s. I haven't seen a point against that argument yet. I don't think anyone can deny that. It's fine to appreciate the man. But he was pretty much on his last legs by 2015; by 2016 at the latest.
Much ado about nothing.
I've answered this but you've either missed or ignored it.He didn't play a significant role in Conte's side. He played a mere ~ 1400 minutes.It still doesn't address the fact that he was still capable of scoring and assisting. It's not easy to ignore the numbers and it definitely kills any argument of him not contributing to that second title win. He finished the season with the most assists in the league for Chelsea so it's pretty silly to downplay his contribution.
Cesc was 29 when he lead Chelsea in assists the last time Chelsea won a title. That's more assists than Sanchez and Ozil that same year.
by Angelito » Sun Apr 05, 2020 3:57 pm
Power n Glory wrote:Angelito wrote:Marsbar100 wrote:Cesc has more assists than ozil from 14 onwards in the pl, put into perspective he was in a defensive team under maureen, he played deeper than ozil with less flexibility m
If you take ozils great half a season out he was as getting out assisted and scored by Ramsey and Cazorla times.
Ozil has a total of 60 assists and 36 goals since 14/15.
Cesc had a total of 59 assists and 22 goals.
Using your logic, Ozil played for an inferior side, under inferior managers. Do you want me to bring Ozil's assist record when they were at Spain or for their national teams on the table too?
Regardless, this isn't a Ozil vs Cesc issue. I was afraid it would turn into one once the argument commenced.
This also pretty much counters Power's argument.
That said, the original argument was about Cesc being done by his late 20s. I haven't seen a point against that argument yet. I don't think anyone can deny that. It's fine to appreciate the man. But he was pretty much on his last legs by 2015; by 2016 at the latest.
Much ado about nothing.
I've answered this but you've either missed or ignored it.He didn't play a significant role in Conte's side. He played a mere ~ 1400 minutes.It still doesn't address the fact that he was still capable of scoring and assisting. It's not easy to ignore the numbers and it definitely kills any argument of him not contributing to that second title win. He finished the season with the most assists in the league for Chelsea so it's pretty silly to downplay his contribution.
Cesc was 29 when he lead Chelsea in assists the last time Chelsea won a title. That's more assists than Sanchez and Ozil that same year.
by Power n Glory » Sun Apr 05, 2020 4:18 pm