Cesc Fàbregas

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Re: Cesc Fabregas

Postby Power n Glory » Sun Apr 05, 2020 4:36 pm

Angelito wrote:
Power n Glory wrote:
Angelito wrote:
Marsbar100 wrote:Cesc has more assists than ozil from 14 onwards in the pl, put into perspective he was in a defensive team under maureen, he played deeper than ozil with less flexibility m

If you take ozils great half a season out he was as getting out assisted and scored by Ramsey and Cazorla times.


Ozil has a total of 60 assists and 36 goals since 14/15.

Cesc had a total of 59 assists and 22 goals.

Using your logic, Ozil played for an inferior side, under inferior managers. Do you want me to bring Ozil's assist record when they were at Spain or for their national teams on the table too? ;)

Regardless, this isn't a Ozil vs Cesc issue. I was afraid it would turn into one once the argument commenced.

This also pretty much counters Power's argument.

That said, the original argument was about Cesc being done by his late 20s. I haven't seen a point against that argument yet.
I don't think anyone can deny that. It's fine to appreciate the man. But he was pretty much on his last legs by 2015; by 2016 at the latest.

Much ado about nothing.


I've answered this but you've either missed or ignored it.

He didn't play a significant role in Conte's side. He played a mere ~ 1400 minutes.


It still doesn't address the fact that he was still capable of scoring and assisting. It's not easy to ignore the numbers and it definitely kills any argument of him not contributing to that second title win. He finished the season with the most assists in the league for Chelsea so it's pretty silly to downplay his contribution.


Cesc was 29 when he lead Chelsea in assists the last time Chelsea won a title. That's more assists than Sanchez and Ozil that same year.


Cesc was 26 when 14/15 started. That was his final season as a top performer.

In Conte's first season, where he played less than 1,400 mins, Cesc was 28.

In the same season, Ozil scored and created 17 goals in the Prem. I won't even talk about Alexis because it'd be shameful.

Even by that standard, he was done by 28.. That still counts. The whole debate is about Cesc being done by his late-20s because he peaked early. That still stands. Like many who peak early, Cesc was done by his late 20s.

Ronaldo is on the same boat. The Brazilian Ronaldo. Some peak early and for various reasons fade early. Cesc was part of the who's who when he was at Arsenal. Since then, he was never part of any such list.

It's obvious. We can go round and round until we can't.


Again, ignoring the obvious about him being their top creative player. Also Cesc was 29 in Conte's first season. He turned 30 in May 2017.

He only played around 1,400 mins for Conte in his first season but played around 3,650 the following season. Still bagged 9 assists that year.

If that's your assessment of done. Take a closer look at Ozil at 29/30. 3 assists in 2018/19. Another 3 assists this season.

No need to go around in circles on this one. These are the facts.
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Re: Cesc Fabregas

Postby Marsbar100 » Sun Apr 05, 2020 4:41 pm

Angelito wrote:
Marsbar100 wrote:Cesc has more assists than ozil from 14 onwards in the pl, put into perspective he was in a defensive team under maureen, he played deeper than ozil with less flexibility m

If you take ozils great half a season out he was as getting out assisted and scored by Ramsey and Cazorla times.


Ozil has a total of 60 assists and 36 goals since 14/15.

Cesc had a total of 59 assists and 22 goals.

Using your logic, Ozil played for an inferior side, under inferior managers. Do you want me to bring Ozil's assist record when they were at Spain or for their national teams on the table too? ;)

Regardless, this isn't a Ozil vs Cesc issue. I was afraid it would turn into one once the argument commenced.

This also pretty much counters Power's argument.

That said, the original argument was about Cesc being done by his late 20s. I haven't seen a point against that argument yet. I don't think anyone can deny that. It's fine to appreciate the man. But he was pretty much on his last legs by 2015; by 2016 at the latest.

Much ado about nothing.

So ozil has 1 more assist than fabregas whilst fabregas barely played in the pl the last couple of seasons?

He was still good for Chelsea in his last season there he won an fa cup and started the final, he doesn't have legs but he still can control a game, the likes of him and Cazorla would still be our best midfielders imo
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Re: Cesc Fabregas

Postby elkanofan » Tue Apr 07, 2020 1:25 am

Cesc, Kluivert, Rooney and Owen are examples of how players only last about 13-15 years at the top level from when they start and always hit their peak level after 4-6 years of full time pro football! Only players who seem to buck that trend are 1 club legends like Totti, Giggs and the old freak like CR7, Cafu

Jamie Vardy is older than Cesc and is still in his prime. Because he didn't start playing professional full time football until 2012 when Fleetwood finally made it to the football league. Cesc had already been playing 8 years of top level elite football by then. Forget about players ages, its about when they start and how much their body can take.

Top level football along with injuries takes a large amount out of your body, especially with these deceptive, profit driven diets everyone has. The other major factor is injuries, even if they don't get one big severe injury, its the accumulation of these injuries which destroys players over time. Shearer for example struggle to walk on concrete thanks to all the injuries he suffered.

Also agree 100% with Phil. Cesc gave up the passion for the game after Barca ad you can tell this in his interview. Chelsea was all about him wining the Premier League so he can tell his grandchildren what he won as a player, its so he could retire winning it all without many regrets.

No idea how this turned into Ozil vs Cesc but while Ozil has had a better career and reached a peak level than Cesc didn't quite reach with us unlike Ozil at Madrid/Bremen Cesc has been a much better player for our team than Ozil has and will forever have a bigger legacy with us than Ozil.

Cesc was quality for us every single year, never ever had a bad season for us! Ozil, 2 assists, 1 goal this year!
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Re: Cesc Fabregas

Postby Marsbar100 » Tue Apr 07, 2020 1:40 am

I think Rooney, cesc and owen they were overplayed on Injuries as well as starting young,

I think with Ronaldo whilst he is a freak with his discipline, he did not get overplayed on any injury and moving to Spain in a slower whilst still young must have helped.
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Re: Cesc Fabregas

Postby Angelito » Tue Apr 07, 2020 2:06 pm

Cesc played 46 games for us in 04/05. He was 17 at the start of 04/05. By the time Cesc was 20, in 07/08, he was already among the top-5 midfielders in the world.

As Elka stated, a player's prime lasts for 4-6 years generally. I tend to think the cream years are actually 3-5 years depending on the player. We have exceptions but they're that—exception to the rule.

Cesc hit his peak years in 2006 and was, "past his prime," by 2012. That's around 6 years. 14/15 was his swan song as a top class player.

It's the nature of the beast.

Ozil hit his peak in 2008, or 2009. And faded after that 15/16 season. Of course, he remained a top competitor even beyond that but Ozil was past his prime.

The difference is Ozil became a regular at the age of 20, whilst Cesc was already a regular by the time he was 17.

If Wilshere hadn't picked up that tragic injury, he'd have gone on to have a world class career. But he'd also have been finished by 15/16 more or less. He was 18 when he bossed Barca.

With the exception of legendary players, a player is at his 100% for 3-5 years. For some, it's a season/a year. For others, it might be 5-6 years. Those who start early, fade early.
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Re: Cesc Fabregas

Postby Ach » Wed Jul 08, 2020 1:55 pm

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/53206731

Barely mentions us. The club he was longest at.
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Re: Cesc Fàbregas

Postby Ach » Thu Jul 28, 2022 7:42 pm

https://twitter.com/itvfootball/status/ ... wFOiTnzOLw

Who the hell would want to watch this c***?

The face of failure in the early Emirates era
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Re: Cesc Fàbregas

Postby swipe right » Fri Jul 29, 2022 12:30 pm

Ach wrote:https://twitter.com/itvfootball/status/1552690547504062464?s=20&t=dLbTmwqZhBFiwFOiTnzOLw

Who the hell would want to watch this c***?

The face of failure in the early Emirates era

He’s responsible for us not buying players?
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Re: Cesc Fàbregas

Postby 22-0 » Fri Jul 29, 2022 2:09 pm

Yep always few signings away from really making it.
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Re: Cesc Fàbregas

Postby Reiss » Sun Jul 31, 2022 7:43 am

Footballers really don't know when to quit do they? Like a boxer that goes on way too long. Sad to see.
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Re: Cesc Fàbregas

Postby Ach » Tue Mar 07, 2023 7:31 pm

https://talksport.com/football/1353726/ ... 1678194506

Wtf

Should be nowhere near our kids. What's he going to teach them? How to cry and get a move to Barca and flop there?
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Re: Cesc Fàbregas

Postby Ach » Sat Jul 01, 2023 5:55 pm

Officially retires. Could've been a legend but just another run of the mill player
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Re: Cesc Fàbregas

Postby swipe right » Sat Jul 01, 2023 9:23 pm

Best player of the emirates era. Farewell sweet prince.
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Re: Cesc Fàbregas

Postby Nuggets » Sun Jul 02, 2023 6:40 am

Ach wrote:Officially retires. Could've been a legend but just another run of the mill player


Yup I agree, his tactics to leave the club were meh.
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Re: Cesc Fàbregas

Postby VCC » Sun Jul 02, 2023 6:51 am

Nuggets wrote:
Ach wrote:Officially retires. Could've been a legend but just another run of the mill player


Yup I agree, his tactics to leave the club were meh.

Personally believe having cesc and the way AW played every single thing through him basicly become easy to defend
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