William Saliba (2)

[Zenith]

Put Sambi Lokonga in ligue 1 for a season and watch his stock rise too!

Well, yeah.

Belgian league is nothing. Belgian players move to Ligue 1 for a bigger challenge. PL clubs almost never buy directly from Belgium because the league isn't rigorous enough, there isn't a single world class player that chooses to play there. Even has-beens like Mario Gotze will pick Eredivisie over Belgium.

Belgian league is nothing. Belgian players move to Ligue 1 for a bigger challenge.

Not by any stretch a Pro League-exclusive. Young Eredivisie players move to Ligue 1 all the time: Kasper Dollberg, Myron Boadu, Calvin Stengs, Anwar El Ghazi, Pablo Rosario, Marco Bizot, Kenny Tete, Gabriel Gudmundsson, etc. And that's in the last couple of seasons alone.

Even has-beens like Mario Gotze will pick Eredivisie over Belgium.

That's also not true. To use your terminology, 'has-beens' like Mignolet, Defour, Lombaerts, and Nainggolan all picked the Pro League over the Eredivisie or leagues of a similar level. All recent transfers.

PL clubs almost never buy directly from Belgium because the league isn't rigorous enough

Again, false. Premier League clubs buy Pro League players pretty much every season. Since the 2015/16 season, Premier League clubs have bought 27 Pro League players. Over the same period, Premier League clubs have bought 30 players from the Eredivisie. A whopping difference of 3 players. But almost never, hu?

It's strange how you put the Dutch first tier on a pedestal whilst simultaneously playing down the level of the Belgian first tier, when in reality the overall level is pretty much the same (and has been for a long time). Players who've played in both leagues mention that the Eredivisie is more polished and technical, but they also mention that the intensity and speed of the Pro League is higher. As are the physical demands: more combative end-to-end style of football; more matches; no winter break etc. The style of football is much more similar to that of the Premier League. Again: the style, not the level.

The Dutch first tier has a powerhouse in Ajax, and although several Belgian teams such as Club Brugge and KV Mechelen have since won European trophies, the Belgian top tier hasn't had a Ajaxesque powerhouse since Anderlecht in the late '70s, early '80s. That aside, PSV and Club Brugge are currently of a similar level. Below that there's Feyenoord, Twente and occasionally Vitesse or Heerenveen, which could be compared to Standard, Gent or Genk. For example this season Feyenoord loaned Genk striker Cyriel Dessers. He's helped Feyenoord reach the conference league final, but in the season before that he struggled at Pro League level.

Anderlecht are usually up there with PSV and Club Brugge but are currently recovering from financial turmoil. They'll be back. Historically, the Pro League has a stronger core of mid-table teams which generally are a slightly stronger to their Eredivisie counterparts. (It's been that way for as long as I can remember.)

Let's compare notable recent transfers between both leagues and the Premier League.


Notable transfers: Dutch first tier to Premier League (2015-22)

Davinson Sánchez - FLOP
€42m - Was given 5 seasons to prove his worth at Spurs, but he's never managed to live up to his price tag. Now 4th choice CB who's been told he can leave.

Hakim Ziyech - OKAY
€40m - Has blown blow hot and cold at Chelsea. Consistently inconsistent.

Donny van de Beek - FLOP
€39m - Never made it past 5th choice CM at Man United. Sent on loan to Everton where he failed to impress.

Memphis Depay - FLOP
€34m -

Steven Bergwijn - OKAY (At best.)
€30m - Hasn't been trusted by any Spurs manager. Perennial bench-warmer, season after season.

Davy Klaassen - FLOP
€27m - Flopped at Everton and subsequently couldn't hack it in the Bundesliga. Now spends his prime years playing football in the Eredivisie.

Vincent Janssen - FLOP
€22m - Scored for fun in the Dutch first tier, but joined the lengthy list of Eredivisie top scorers who ended up flopping hard at Premier Leauge level. Found his level in Mexico.

Gini Wijnaldum - SUCCESS
€20m - Needed a season or two to adapt to the Premier League. Moved to LFC following NUFC's relegation. Tailor-made for Klopp-ball and moved from strength to strength.

Alireza Jahanbakhsh - FLOP
€19m - Another prolific Eredivisie forward. Produced just 2 goals in 50 appearances for Brighton.

Jürgen Locadia - FLOP
€17m - A forward who was given 4 seasons to prove himself, but he just wasn't up to the level. Just like Jahanakhsh he's proved to be a rather big waste of money for a club like Brighton.

Jordy Clasie - FLOP
€15m - Too lightweight/slow for the Premier League. Wasn't able to establish himself at Southampton following his move from Feyenoord. Spent a season in the Pro League, but again the intensity and physicality proved to be too high for him.



Notable transfers: Belgian first tier to Premier League (2015-22)

Sander Berge - SUCCESS
€22m - Industrious, mobile, and tall midfielder with many strings to his bow. Did well, despite playing for a team that ended up being relegated. Now linked with several Premier League and Serie A clubs.

Wesley - FLOP
€20m - Started off well at Villa, but his performances went from bad to worse. Personally, I never really rated this player. Whilst he's a strong physical specimen, he just doesn't have the speed of thought and execution that's required to make it at Premier League level.

Leander Dendoncker - SUCCESS
€17m - Solid, no-nonsense midfielder. Has been a Wolves regular for several seasons.

Leandro Trossard - SUCCESS
€16m - Overall, a great signing for Brighton.

Moussa Djenepo - OKAY
€15m - Started off well, but lost his place. Fans seem to like him more than the manager.

José Izquierdo - FLOP
€14m - Regular goalscorer for Club Brugge, who couldn't establish himself at Brighton. His career has nose-dived since.

Arnaut Danjuma SUCCESS
€12m - Inconsistent for Brugge, but did well for Bournemouth despite their battle against relegation. He now plays for Villarreal, and his market value is estimated at €50m.

Aleksandar Mitrović - OKAY
€11m - Was decent in his first season with Newcastle. Scored regularly, despite the team's relegation. Just got promoted with Fullham after scoring 43 league goals for them in The EFL Championsip.

Steven Defour - SUCCESS
€9m - Transformed Burnley's midfield, but his injuries meant that they were only able to use him for 1 season. Still decent value.

Wilfred Ndidi - SUCCESS
€8m - One of the very best out-and-out defensive midfielders in the Premier League since his arrival.

Data sources:
https://www.transfermarkt.com/eredivisi ... 0&intern=1
https://www.transfermarkt.com/jupiler-p ... 0&intern=1

[Highbury Hillbilly]

Put Sambi Lokonga in ligue 1 for a season and watch his stock rise too!

Well, yeah.

Belgian league is nothing. Belgian players move to Ligue 1 for a bigger challenge. PL clubs almost never buy directly from Belgium because the league isn't rigorous enough, there isn't a single world class player that chooses to play there. Even has-beens like Mario Gotze will pick Eredivisie over Belgium.

Belgian league is nothing. Belgian players move to Ligue 1 for a bigger challenge.

Not by any stretch a Pro League-exclusive. Young Eredivisie players move to Ligue 1 all the time: Kasper Dollberg, Myron Boadu, Calvin Stengs, Anwar El Ghazi, Pablo Rosario, Marco Bizot, Kenny Tete, Gabriel Gudmundsson, etc. And that's in the last couple of seasons alone.

Even has-beens like Mario Gotze will pick Eredivisie over Belgium.

That's also not true. To use your terminology, 'has-beens' like Mignolet, Defour, Lombaerts, and Nainggolan all picked the Pro League over the Eredivisie or leagues of a similar level. All recent transfers.

PL clubs almost never buy directly from Belgium because the league isn't rigorous enough

Again, false. Premier League clubs buy Pro League players pretty much every season. Since the 2015/16 season, Premier League clubs have bought 27 Pro League players. Over the same period, Premier League clubs have bought 30 players from the Eredivisie. A whopping difference of 3 players. But almost never, hu?

It's strange how you put the Dutch first tier on a pedestal whilst simultaneously playing down the level of the Belgian first tier, when in reality the overall level is pretty much the same (and has been for a long time). Players who've played in both leagues mention that the Eredivisie is more polished and technical, but they also mention that the intensity and speed of the Pro League is higher. As are the physical demands: more combative end-to-end style of football; more matches; no winter break etc. The style of football is much more similar to that of the Premier League. Again: the style, not the level.

The Dutch first tier has a powerhouse in Ajax, and although several Belgian teams such as Club Brugge and KV Mechelen have since won European trophies, the Belgian top tier hasn't had a Ajaxesque powerhouse since Anderlecht in the late '70s, early '80s. That aside, PSV and Club Brugge are currently of a similar level. Below that there's Feyenoord, Twente and occasionally Vitesse or Heerenveen, which could be compared to Standard, Gent or Genk. For example this season Feyenoord loaned Genk striker Cyriel Dessers. He's helped Feyenoord reach the conference league final, but in the season before that he struggled at Pro League level.

Anderlecht are usually up there with PSV and Club Brugge but are currently recovering from financial turmoil. They'll be back. Historically, the Pro League has a stronger core of mid-table teams which generally are a slightly stronger to their Eredivisie counterparts. (It's been that way for as long as I can remember.)

I didn't mean to insult the Belgian league. We're talking about whether ASL or Saliba were better prepared for the PL. My stance is that a Ligue 1 player is better prepared because PL teams already recruit heavily from L1 already, so players have an idea of where they need to be quality-wise to do well in the PL.

[Zenith]

Put Sambi Lokonga in ligue 1 for a season and watch his stock rise too!

Well, yeah.

Belgian league is nothing. Belgian players move to Ligue 1 for a bigger challenge. PL clubs almost never buy directly from Belgium because the league isn't rigorous enough, there isn't a single world class player that chooses to play there. Even has-beens like Mario Gotze will pick Eredivisie over Belgium.

Belgian league is nothing. Belgian players move to Ligue 1 for a bigger challenge.

Not by any stretch a Pro League-exclusive. Young Eredivisie players move to Ligue 1 all the time: Kasper Dollberg, Myron Boadu, Calvin Stengs, Anwar El Ghazi, Pablo Rosario, Marco Bizot, Kenny Tete, Gabriel Gudmundsson, etc. And that's in the last couple of seasons alone.

Even has-beens like Mario Gotze will pick Eredivisie over Belgium.

That's also not true. To use your terminology, 'has-beens' like Mignolet, Defour, Lombaerts, and Nainggolan all picked the Pro League over the Eredivisie or leagues of a similar level. All recent transfers.

PL clubs almost never buy directly from Belgium because the league isn't rigorous enough

Again, false. Premier League clubs buy Pro League players pretty much every season. Since the 2015/16 season, Premier League clubs have bought 27 Pro League players. Over the same period, Premier League clubs have bought 30 players from the Eredivisie. A whopping difference of 3 players. But almost never, hu?

It's strange how you put the Dutch first tier on a pedestal whilst simultaneously playing down the level of the Belgian first tier, when in reality the overall level is pretty much the same (and has been for a long time). Players who've played in both leagues mention that the Eredivisie is more polished and technical, but they also mention that the intensity and speed of the Pro League is higher. As are the physical demands: more combative end-to-end style of football; more matches; no winter break etc. The style of football is much more similar to that of the Premier League. Again: the style, not the level.

The Dutch first tier has a powerhouse in Ajax, and although several Belgian teams such as Club Brugge and KV Mechelen have since won European trophies, the Belgian top tier hasn't had a Ajaxesque powerhouse since Anderlecht in the late '70s, early '80s. That aside, PSV and Club Brugge are currently of a similar level. Below that there's Feyenoord, Twente and occasionally Vitesse or Heerenveen, which could be compared to Standard, Gent or Genk. For example this season Feyenoord loaned Genk striker Cyriel Dessers. He's helped Feyenoord reach the conference league final, but in the season before that he struggled at Pro League level.

Anderlecht are usually up there with PSV and Club Brugge but are currently recovering from financial turmoil. They'll be back. Historically, the Pro League has a stronger core of mid-table teams which generally are a slightly stronger to their Eredivisie counterparts. (It's been that way for as long as I can remember.)

I didn't mean to insult the Belgian league. We're talking about whether ASL or Saliba were better prepared for the PL. My stance is that a Ligue 1 player is better prepared because PL teams already recruit heavily from L1 already, so players have an idea of where they need to be quality-wise to do well in the PL.

I agree with your stance, but not with the analogy you used. Just wanted to point out a few things, that's all.

[Highbury Hillbilly]

I agree with your stance, but not with the analogy you used. Just wanted to point out a few things, that's all.

That's fair, I went too far saying no WC players come from that league. It's hard not to talk in absolutes on this forum because sometimes people act like Ligue 1 is total shit compared to the PL, so you have to win every medal possible to be worthy of playing for Arsenal.

[Zenith]

Speaking to Telefoot, the France international defender said: ‘I belong to Arsenal, I still have two years left.

‘I will be back with Arsenal. I have played zero matches and I still want to show them my true face and have the chance to play for these fans and this great club.

‘But it doesn’t just depend on me. In any case, to leave like this, would be a shame.’

Saliba confessed he was somewhat apprehensive about joining Marseille but insists he has matured during his 12 months at one of France’s biggest clubs and revealed they will always have a special place in his heart.

‘Surprising.. or magical,’ he said when asked to use one word to describe his spell as Marseille.

‘It’s my first full season. I was keen to show who I really am. It’s a very positive assessment and really I’m very happy with my season.

https://metro.co.uk/2022/06/05/i-belong ... -16771764/

[BexleyGooner]

Legohead will probably still sell him

[theHotHead]

Probably will loan him out again and give Holding game time instead

[Arsenal Tone]

'it doesn't just depend on me' wtf does that mean?

[Ach]

'it doesn't just depend on me' wtf does that mean?

If the club want him or not I guess.

Shown no sign of wanting him in Arteta reign

[Angelito]

'it doesn't just depend on me' wtf does that mean?

It depends on Arsenal?

If our current administration decides to sell him, or loan him out again, he can't just brawl his way into staying.

[Highbury Hillbilly]

He also wants to make the France squad for Qatar, so he can't rely on a handful of Europa fixtures to be considered.

[theHotHead]

Arteta would have to be a grade 1 f***ing idiot if he calls Saliba back to play 2nd rate matches only!

Saliba will go on strike, probably

[EliteKiller]

Saliba MUST sign a new contract - if not he will go for free when this one runs down - we've seen it all before

[theHotHead]

Someone said Saliba doesn't have leverage, on the contrary, I think he has all the leverage he needs

[Est83]

"I belong to Arsenal, I still have two years left. I will be back with Arsenal," Saliba told Telefoot. "I have played zero matches and I still want to show them my true face and have the chance to play for these fans and this great club."

His latest quote.

I know it's miserable being Arsenal fans guys, I know its natural to expect the worst, but you all need to chill the f**k out. Just go to the pub and vent, or ask the missus for 5 minutes "you know how I always listen to you talking shit about your girls, and about your dick head boss.... Well, I really need 5 minutes to talk about Arsenal, I think I've earnt this".

My girlfriend knows the deal, and once I get it off my chest it's done. All very healthy.

Anyway, Junior Don Saliba returns next season. Our Van Dyk?