North London Powershift

[EliteKiller]

I literally cannot be bothered to waste my time responding to this EK, even though I could destroy your post on so many levels. What I will say is, considering Arsenal don't get past the round of the last 16 in the CL there is no point talking about earnings for winning the thing because Arsenal won't, so being realistic the CL money we miss out on is the round 16 money - as I stated in a previous post. And as I stated that money hasn't changed much over the past 5 years, as I also showed.

So to sum up what you're saying is let's give up on the CL because we're no good, and there's no money in it ...

money hasn't changed much over the past 5 years

That is beyond incredible .... in the last five years football has seen the largest increase in income in it's history. CL total prize money last year alone went up by 54% it's more than doubled in the last five years.... just what the f**k are you smokin' ???????

[CaptGooner]

Imagine caring about another club’s success more than your own’s..

If you’re scared of the songs that might be sung if they win then wear ear muffs.

[LMAO]

Both win their finals or both lose their finals.

Pick one.

Genuinely think I'd rather go with the 2nd option.

wtf, even disregarding how it doesn't have to be an either-or, how is this even up for debate?

∞x the former.

Arsenal doesn't have enough of a European pedigree for us to afford turning our noses up at a trophy, especially one that gets us back into the CL and allows us to bring in a higher quality of player, thus making our rebuild that much quicker.

[theHotHead]

I literally cannot be bothered to waste my time responding to this EK, even though I could destroy your post on so many levels. What I will say is, considering Arsenal don't get past the round of the last 16 in the CL there is no point talking about earnings for winning the thing because Arsenal won't, so being realistic the CL money we miss out on is the round 16 money - as I stated in a previous post. And as I stated that money hasn't changed much over the past 5 years, as I also showed.

So to sum up what you're saying is let's give up on the CL because we're no good, and there's no money in it ...

money hasn't changed much over the past 5 years

That is beyond incredible .... in the last five years football has seen the largest increase in income in it's history. CL total prize money last year alone went up by 54% it's more than doubled in the last five years.... just what the f**k are you smokin' ???????

Dude for f**k's sake, learn to f***ing read! I am saying that your argument of mass growth in CL revenue is bullshit as I proved with the figures for the winners in 2014 and by the money Arsenal would get for their typical round 16 elimination. That and that alone is my f***ing point! I made it crystal clear.

You got buried the last time I argued with you, I take no pleasure in making you look silly. Stop twisting things and moving goalposts. Read the full distribution report to clubs:
https://www.uefa.com/uefachampionsleague/news/newsid=2294532.html

Thats the 2014/15 report. In it, it states that the winners, Barcelona earned €61m. Juventus the runner up earned €89m. Barca earned €10.5m for winning, Juve earned €6.5m for losing the final. Now, if we fast forward to the last set of UEFA figures published, 2017/18:
https://www.uefa.com/insideuefa/about-uefa/news/newsid=2578222.html

This report shows that the winners Real Madrid earned €88.6m and the runners up Liverpool earned €81.2m. Real earned €15.5m for winning the final, Liverpool earned €11m for losing.

If we go back exactly 5 years from the latest report to the 2012/13 season it shows:
The winners Bayern earned €55m total and €10.5m for the final. Runners up B Dortmund earned €54m total and €6.5m for the final. Don't believe me?? Well check UEFA's financial distribution document for 2012/13:
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.uefa.com/MultimediaFiles/Download/uefaorg/Finance/01/97/52/97/1975297_DOWNLOAD.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwiF2O-FtaniAhXKZt4KHbxlApgQFjANegQIAxAH&usg=AOvVaw3jVZcBLX26XKy_OzXxCx4L

What that shows is your figures are nonsense so your arguments are equally nonsense.1) you said CL money went up by 54% from last year. WRONG!
The winner of the final this year will earn €19m, the runner up €15m. The winner is up by €3.5m on last year which is approx 22%. €3.5m is f**k all! On top of that you have no idea how much clubs will earn in total because the TV money (market pool) for each country's market is different so we won't know until UEFA publish the official report, so you either made the figures up or you lied. Either way they are bullshit figures.

2) you said CL money has more than doubled in the last 5 years. WRONG!
In 2012 the winner earned €55m total and €10.5m for the final. If you take last season's figures the winner earned €88.6m total and €15.5m for the final. What maths are you using to therefore deduce that CL money has more than doubled???

Flawed stats = flawed argument. Why you keep trying it with me is a mystery. I predict another week of you keeping a low profile after this.

[EliteKiller]

Dude for f**k's sake, learn to f***ing read! I am saying that your argument of mass growth in CL revenue is bullshit as I proved with the figures for the winners in 2014 and by the money Arsenal would get for their typical round 16 elimination. That and that alone is my f***ing point! I made it crystal clear.

You got buried the last time I argued with you, I take no pleasure in making you look silly. Stop twisting things and moving goalposts. Read the full distribution report to clubs:
https://www.uefa.com/uefachampionsleague/news/newsid=2294532.html

Thats the 2014/15 report. In it, it states that the winners, Barcelona earned €61m. Juventus the runner up earned €89m. Barca earned €10.5m for winning, Juve earned €6.5m for losing the final. Now, if we fast forward to the last set of UEFA figures published, 2017/18:
https://www.uefa.com/insideuefa/about-uefa/news/newsid=2578222.html

This report shows that the winners Real Madrid earned €88.6m and the runners up Liverpool earned €81.2m. Real earned €15.5m for winning the final, Liverpool earned €11m for losing.

If we go back exactly 5 years from the latest report to the 2012/13 season it shows:
The winners Bayern earned €55m total and €10.5m for the final. Runners up B Dortmund earned €54m total and €6.5m for the final. Don't believe me?? Well check UEFA's financial distribution document for 2012/13:
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.uefa.com/MultimediaFiles/Download/uefaorg/Finance/01/97/52/97/1975297_DOWNLOAD.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwiF2O-FtaniAhXKZt4KHbxlApgQFjANegQIAxAH&usg=AOvVaw3jVZcBLX26XKy_OzXxCx4L

What that shows is your figures are nonsense so your arguments are equally nonsense.1) you said CL money went up by 54% from last year. WRONG!
The winner of the final this year will earn €19m, the runner up €15m. The winner is up by €3.5m on last year which is approx 22%. €3.5m is f**k all! On top of that you have no idea how much clubs will earn in total because the TV money (market pool) for each country's market is different so we won't know until UEFA publish the official report, so you either made the figures up or you lied. Either way they are bullshit figures.

2) you said CL money has more than doubled in the last 5 years. WRONG!
In 2012 the winner earned €55m total and €10.5m for the final. If you take last season's figures the winner earned €88.6m total and €15.5m for the final. What maths are you using to therefore deduce that CL money has more than doubled???

Flawed stats = flawed argument. Why you keep trying it with me is a mystery. I predict another week of you keeping a low profile after this.

More utter bollocks .... we get it you think we're shit and being in the CL ain't worth the effort .... I think you're an idiot and that CL is vital .... you have your view I have mine, let's just leave it at that ...

FYI - Don't quote 2014/15 and 2017/18 when 2018/19 are readily available ... just makes you look a complete dick. Why?

Because UEFA have changed the distribution system for the 2018-19 season

So here you go ... an idiot's guide ... which is quite appropriate for you ....

https://www.totalsportek.com/money/uefa-champions-league-prize-money/

You couldn't bury a bone ... the whole forum knows it ... stop arguing bullshit

THE CHAMPIONS LEAGUE IS VERY f***ing IMPORTANT

[UFGN]

Football fans arguing about money

Theyve got you good

[jayramfootball]

Dude for f**k's sake, learn to f***ing read! I am saying that your argument of mass growth in CL revenue is bullshit as I proved with the figures for the winners in 2014 and by the money Arsenal would get for their typical round 16 elimination. That and that alone is my f***ing point! I made it crystal clear.

You got buried the last time I argued with you, I take no pleasure in making you look silly. Stop twisting things and moving goalposts. Read the full distribution report to clubs:
https://www.uefa.com/uefachampionsleague/news/newsid=2294532.html

Thats the 2014/15 report. In it, it states that the winners, Barcelona earned €61m. Juventus the runner up earned €89m. Barca earned €10.5m for winning, Juve earned €6.5m for losing the final. Now, if we fast forward to the last set of UEFA figures published, 2017/18:
https://www.uefa.com/insideuefa/about-uefa/news/newsid=2578222.html

This report shows that the winners Real Madrid earned €88.6m and the runners up Liverpool earned €81.2m. Real earned €15.5m for winning the final, Liverpool earned €11m for losing.

If we go back exactly 5 years from the latest report to the 2012/13 season it shows:
The winners Bayern earned €55m total and €10.5m for the final. Runners up B Dortmund earned €54m total and €6.5m for the final. Don't believe me?? Well check UEFA's financial distribution document for 2012/13:
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.uefa.com/MultimediaFiles/Download/uefaorg/Finance/01/97/52/97/1975297_DOWNLOAD.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwiF2O-FtaniAhXKZt4KHbxlApgQFjANegQIAxAH&usg=AOvVaw3jVZcBLX26XKy_OzXxCx4L

What that shows is your figures are nonsense so your arguments are equally nonsense.1) you said CL money went up by 54% from last year. WRONG!
The winner of the final this year will earn €19m, the runner up €15m. The winner is up by €3.5m on last year which is approx 22%. €3.5m is f**k all! On top of that you have no idea how much clubs will earn in total because the TV money (market pool) for each country's market is different so we won't know until UEFA publish the official report, so you either made the figures up or you lied. Either way they are bullshit figures.

2) you said CL money has more than doubled in the last 5 years. WRONG!
In 2012 the winner earned €55m total and €10.5m for the final. If you take last season's figures the winner earned €88.6m total and €15.5m for the final. What maths are you using to therefore deduce that CL money has more than doubled???

Flawed stats = flawed argument. Why you keep trying it with me is a mystery. I predict another week of you keeping a low profile after this.

More utter bollocks .... we get it you think we're shit and being in the CL ain't worth the effort .... I think you're an idiot and that CL is vital .... you have your view I have mine, let's just leave it at that ...

FYI - Don't quote 2014/15 and 2017/18 when 2018/19 are readily available ... just makes you look a complete dick. Why?

Because UEFA have changed the distribution system for the 2018-19 season

So here you go ... an idiot's guide ... which is quite appropriate for you ....

https://www.totalsportek.com/money/uefa-champions-league-prize-money/

You couldn't bury a bone ... the whole forum knows it ... stop arguing bullshit

THE CHAMPIONS LEAGUE IS VERY f***ing IMPORTANT

We have a ton of money, more of it is not as important as using it wisely.
As a competition the CL is not really important to us as we have zero chance of winning. though it may be a good thing in terms of attracting better players - even then, the best players will go to the top teams who are in the CL and even if we make it, we're not one of those.
Our focus right now should be on building a team of players who want to give 100% effort, mixed with good quality, who work for each other and don't make silly mistakes game in game out.
Just getting in the CL is not going to cure our ills - it could even hurt us if we bring in average players with big names who are not wanted by the big clubs. We need younger players who don't yet have dollar signs in their eyes. Plenty of examples of other teams who have done this.

Bottom line is that getting in the CL is not going to shift power back to us from Spurs.

[theHotHead]

That is the sound of the grim reaper coming for EK again. Another of his arguments crushed like an ant underfoot.

[Phil71]

If we want to progress we need the money that being in the CL brings. Not only being in it, but getting as far as we can. The money involved is huge.

Each of the 32 clubs that qualify for the group stage can expect to receive a group stage allocation of €15.25m.

Group stage performance bonuses will be paid for each match: €2.7m per win and €900,000 per draw. Undistributed amounts (€900,000 per draw) will be pooled and redistributed among the clubs playing in the group stage in amounts proportionate to their number of wins.

Clubs that qualify for the knockout stage can expect to receive the following amounts:
• qualification for the round of 16: €9.5m per club
• qualification for the quarter-finals: €10.5m per club
• qualification for the semi-finals: €12m per club
• qualification for the final: €15m per club
• The UEFA Champions League winners can expect to pick up an additional €4m.
• The two clubs that qualify for the 2018 UEFA Super Cup can each expect to receive €3.5m, with the winners collecting an additional €1m.

So if we get three wins in the group stage and then get to the QF that's an additional €50m! And with all of the commercial bonuses and add-ons - plus all of the additional global revenue generated from merchandise due to the raised profile and success of the club that could easily be doubled.

No club baulks at an extra €100m every year.

[EliteKiller]

That is the sound of the grim reaper coming for EK again. Another of his arguments crushed like an ant underfoot.

Give it up d***head .... the CL matters everyone knows that, you just got burned yet again .... go play with your toys until you come up with another daft argument as to why Arsenal are shit and should never try and do better .... me I'll just keep supporting them regardless.

As for "the CL is not really important to us as we have zero chance of winning" ... if you truly believe that why bother with the EPL ? let's be fair we have zero chance of winning that either, why bother with top four? if we make it then we're to shit for the CL so what's the point?

f***ing wank fans who write our club off at every opportunity ... f**k off and go suck Spurs dick on their website ....

We are good enough, we can win the EPL, and the CL as well .... bit of loyal f***ing support might help .....

[jayramfootball]

If we want to progress we need the money that being in the CL brings. Not only being in it, but getting as far as we can. The money involved is huge.

Each of the 32 clubs that qualify for the group stage can expect to receive a group stage allocation of €15.25m.

Group stage performance bonuses will be paid for each match: €2.7m per win and €900,000 per draw. Undistributed amounts (€900,000 per draw) will be pooled and redistributed among the clubs playing in the group stage in amounts proportionate to their number of wins.

Clubs that qualify for the knockout stage can expect to receive the following amounts:
• qualification for the round of 16: €9.5m per club
• qualification for the quarter-finals: €10.5m per club
• qualification for the semi-finals: €12m per club
• qualification for the final: €15m per club
• The UEFA Champions League winners can expect to pick up an additional €4m.
• The two clubs that qualify for the 2018 UEFA Super Cup can each expect to receive €3.5m, with the winners collecting an additional €1m.

So if we get three wins in the group stage and then get to the QF that's an additional €50m! And with all of the commercial bonuses and add-ons - plus all of the additional global revenue generated from merchandise due to the raised profile and success of the club that could easily be doubled.

No club baulks at an extra €100m every year.

Money used to be more important than it is now. The bubble in transfer fees and wages now means that quite poor players are getting huge salaries and moving for huge fees based on marketing, PR and agents. A few good games and highlight reels go a long way. Money is no longer a good way to judge players. Plenty of top quality players fly under the radar. Take Mahrez - Leicester signed him for £650k. Look at Spurs - they are in a CL final having spent almost zero net over the last 5 years and with a wage bill half of ours. In fact, look no further than us to see how money can be wasted. We're 3rd in net spend in the PL over the last 5 years. We paid £35m for Mustafi. Enough said.

Stop getting hung up on money. Winning games breeds confidence. Team play, focus and guts is more important than signing the next alleged superstar. There are very few players in the world who are talented enough to lift a team on their own. Maybe 2. The rest are overpaid, overhyped decent players, no better than a player that could be bought for a quarter of the money.

For us scraping into the CL, splashing out on a 'superstar' and getting knocked out in the group stage or last 16 is not as good as getting to the EL final and winning it after adding a couple of £20m signings hungry for success in key positions.

[Phil71]

If we want to progress we need the money that being in the CL brings. Not only being in it, but getting as far as we can. The money involved is huge.

Each of the 32 clubs that qualify for the group stage can expect to receive a group stage allocation of €15.25m.

Group stage performance bonuses will be paid for each match: €2.7m per win and €900,000 per draw. Undistributed amounts (€900,000 per draw) will be pooled and redistributed among the clubs playing in the group stage in amounts proportionate to their number of wins.

Clubs that qualify for the knockout stage can expect to receive the following amounts:
• qualification for the round of 16: €9.5m per club
• qualification for the quarter-finals: €10.5m per club
• qualification for the semi-finals: €12m per club
• qualification for the final: €15m per club
• The UEFA Champions League winners can expect to pick up an additional €4m.
• The two clubs that qualify for the 2018 UEFA Super Cup can each expect to receive €3.5m, with the winners collecting an additional €1m.

So if we get three wins in the group stage and then get to the QF that's an additional €50m! And with all of the commercial bonuses and add-ons - plus all of the additional global revenue generated from merchandise due to the raised profile and success of the club that could easily be doubled.

No club baulks at an extra €100m every year.

Money used to be more important than it is now. The bubble in transfer fees and wages now means that quite poor players are getting huge salaries and moving for huge fees based on marketing, PR and agents. A few good games and highlight reels go a long way. Money is no longer a good way to judge players. Plenty of top quality players fly under the radar. Take Mahrez - Leicester signed him for £650k. Look at Spurs - they are in a CL final having spent almost zero net over the last 5 years and with a wage bill half of ours. In fact, look no further than us to see how money can be wasted. We're 3rd in net spend in the PL over the last 5 years. We paid £35m for Mustafi. Enough said.

Stop getting hung up on money. Winning games breeds confidence. Team play, focus and guts is more important than signing the next alleged superstar. There are very few players in the world who are talented enough to lift a team on their own. Maybe 2. The rest are overpaid, overhyped decent players, no better than a player that could be bought for a quarter of the money.

For us scraping into the CL, splashing out on a 'superstar' and getting knocked out in the group stage or last 16 is not as good as getting to the EL final and winning it after adding a couple of £20m signings hungry for success in key positions.

It needs to be combination of all of the factors.

But you need the money or it won't happen.

[Rockape]

This is ridiculous! How anyone can argue that’s it’s not in our best interests to qualify for the CL and rake in the money accordingly is deluded.

Regardless of whether we spend money wisely, we actually need it to buy players to revitalize our squad. Phil’s post explained that in great detail. If we even want to think about competing for the top honours, we need money to spend.

[jayramfootball]

That is the sound of the grim reaper coming for EK again. Another of his arguments crushed like an ant underfoot.

Give it up d***head .... the CL matters everyone knows that, you just got burned yet again .... go play with your toys until you come up with another daft argument as to why Arsenal are shit and should never try and do better .... me I'll just keep supporting them regardless.

As for "the CL is not really important to us as we have zero chance of winning" ... if you truly believe that why bother with the EPL ? let's be fair we have zero chance of winning that either, why bother with top four? if we make it then we're to shit for the CL so what's the point?

f***ing wank fans who write our club off at every opportunity ... f**k off and go suck Spurs dick on their website ....

We are good enough, we can win the EPL, and the CL as well .... bit of loyal f***ing support might help .....

You are deluded if you think we can win the CL. Being blind to reality is not being a fan. Quite the opposite. It's that blindness that kept Wenger at the club 5-8 years too long. Spitting your dummy out an telling fans to go support Spurs just because you want your delusion to be bought by others is really rather pathetic.

It's not about thinking we're shit. We're not. We're just not as good as the top teams and have a lot of work to do to improve.

The reason it's not the be all and end all to get into the CL is because we have the alternative of the EL - a competition we can actually win. That will do far more for team confidence and will help us build more than getting spanked in the CL knockout stages.

[jayramfootball]

This is ridiculous! How anyone can argue that’s it’s not in our best interests to qualify for the CL and rake in the money accordingly is deluded.

Regardless of whether we spend money wisely, we actually need it to buy players to revitalize our squad. Phil’s post explained that in great detail. If we even want to think about competing for the top honours, we need money to spend.

We don't need CL money to revitalise our squad. Reality tells you this. We've brought in big money signings regularly whilst being out of the CL. We signed Lacazette and Aubamayang for a combined £120m. We didn't get in the top 4. How much do you want to spend? £300m on two players? Who?
The difference between a £10m player and a £60m player is far less than the difference between a team playing as a team with focus and courage than one that makes the kind of silly errors our players do week in week out.

Sure, it would be nice for the owners to swell the bank balance, but progressing as a team? No, the CL is not a must. Why don't you take a look at his years Champions League FINALISTS. Both were out of the CL for years and managed to build teams despite that - teams that are now looking to WIN the damn thing.