Merci Arsène

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Re: Merci Arsène

Postby theHotHead » Tue Feb 26, 2019 5:12 pm

Firstly the 5 players Angelito listed have all been regular starters in the same team in 2019


Would you like to re-evaluate your last post? Think you missed the quote above.
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Re: Merci Arsène

Postby Suprnova » Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:24 pm

This has probably been posted a million times here, but i think without the stadium move and more money to spend, and without him having the pressure of hiding everything that was really going on (which he was great at) I think we would have continued our success.

Emery is less shy about exposing the money issues so it shows what Wenger was dealing with the whole time.

One deal stands out in particular, Signing Xhaka over Kante and another in Gervinho over Hazard or even the 40,000,001 bid for Suarez, he was always going for the player that was cheaper in fees and wages, and it showed, was this his doing, or the boards?

I'm on the fence with it, it could be either, but i'd like to see him at a club that gives him money to spend, to see if he woudl actually spend it, and if he did spend it what he could still achieve.

Until then, I'll never judge either way with Wenger, the guy was a revelation and turned mediocre as soon as we moved to the Emirates, with his best players already aging and nothing to replace them with.
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Re: Merci Arsène

Postby StLGooner » Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:37 pm

Suprnova wrote:This has probably been posted a million times here, but i think without the stadium move and more money to spend, and without him having the pressure of hiding everything that was really going on (which he was great at) I think we would have continued our success.

Emery is less shy about exposing the money issues so it shows what Wenger was dealing with the whole time.

One deal stands out in particular, Signing Xhaka over Kante and another in Gervinho over Hazard or even the 40,000,001 bid for Suarez, he was always going for the player that was cheaper in fees and wages, and it showed, was this his doing, or the boards?

I'm on the fence with it, it could be either, but i'd like to see him at a club that gives him money to spend, to see if he woudl actually spend it, and if he did spend it what he could still achieve.

Until then, I'll never judge either way with Wenger, the guy was a revelation and turned mediocre as soon as we moved to the Emirates, with his best players already aging and nothing to replace them with.



Very unbiased and well said. Rare on here.
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Re: Merci Arsène

Postby swipe right » Tue Feb 26, 2019 8:20 pm

Suprnova wrote:This has probably been posted a million times here, but i think without the stadium move and more money to spend, and without him having the pressure of hiding everything that was really going on (which he was great at) I think we would have continued our success.

Emery is less shy about exposing the money issues so it shows what Wenger was dealing with the whole time.

One deal stands out in particular, Signing Xhaka over Kante and another in Gervinho over Hazard or even the 40,000,001 bid for Suarez, he was always going for the player that was cheaper in fees and wages, and it showed, was this his doing, or the boards?

I'm on the fence with it, it could be either, but i'd like to see him at a club that gives him money to spend, to see if he woudl actually spend it, and if he did spend it what he could still achieve.

Until then, I'll never judge either way with Wenger, the guy was a revelation and turned mediocre as soon as we moved to the Emirates, with his best players already aging and nothing to replace them with.

Eh? So after he left why did we sign Leno and not Alison or Ederson? Why did we sign Sokratis and not a Kolabaliy?
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Re: Merci Arsène

Postby Suprnova » Wed Feb 27, 2019 4:19 am

swipe right wrote:
Suprnova wrote:This has probably been posted a million times here, but i think without the stadium move and more money to spend, and without him having the pressure of hiding everything that was really going on (which he was great at) I think we would have continued our success.

Emery is less shy about exposing the money issues so it shows what Wenger was dealing with the whole time.

One deal stands out in particular, Signing Xhaka over Kante and another in Gervinho over Hazard or even the 40,000,001 bid for Suarez, he was always going for the player that was cheaper in fees and wages, and it showed, was this his doing, or the boards?

I'm on the fence with it, it could be either, but i'd like to see him at a club that gives him money to spend, to see if he woudl actually spend it, and if he did spend it what he could still achieve.

Until then, I'll never judge either way with Wenger, the guy was a revelation and turned mediocre as soon as we moved to the Emirates, with his best players already aging and nothing to replace them with.

Eh? So after he left why did we sign Leno and not Alison or Ederson? Why did we sign Sokratis and not a Kolabaliy?


I don't follow? i'm saying he couldn't and neither could Emery.
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Re: Merci Arsène

Postby CrimsonGunner11 » Wed Feb 27, 2019 4:33 am

Suprnova wrote:This has probably been posted a million times here, but i think without the stadium move and more money to spend, and without him having the pressure of hiding everything that was really going on (which he was great at) I think we would have continued our success.

Emery is less shy about exposing the money issues so it shows what Wenger was dealing with the whole time.

One deal stands out in particular, Signing Xhaka over Kante and another in Gervinho over Hazard or even the 40,000,001 bid for Suarez, he was always going for the player that was cheaper in fees and wages, and it showed, was this his doing, or the boards?

I'm on the fence with it, it could be either, but i'd like to see him at a club that gives him money to spend, to see if he woudl actually spend it, and if he did spend it what he could still achieve.

Until then, I'll never judge either way with Wenger, the guy was a revelation and turned mediocre as soon as we moved to the Emirates, with his best players already aging and nothing to replace them with.


Good post.

If it’s a battle between the board and Wenger, then anyone who’s been following my posts in this forum will know where my allegiance has always been. I only gave up on Wenger because it became clear that he could no longer work with all the handicaps as much as he (and I) probably thought he could.

It will take a special man to get this club back where it belongs, all things remaining equal.
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Re: Merci Arsène

Postby Suprnova » Wed Feb 27, 2019 4:54 am

CrimsonGunner11 wrote:
Suprnova wrote:This has probably been posted a million times here, but i think without the stadium move and more money to spend, and without him having the pressure of hiding everything that was really going on (which he was great at) I think we would have continued our success.

Emery is less shy about exposing the money issues so it shows what Wenger was dealing with the whole time.

One deal stands out in particular, Signing Xhaka over Kante and another in Gervinho over Hazard or even the 40,000,001 bid for Suarez, he was always going for the player that was cheaper in fees and wages, and it showed, was this his doing, or the boards?

I'm on the fence with it, it could be either, but i'd like to see him at a club that gives him money to spend, to see if he woudl actually spend it, and if he did spend it what he could still achieve.

Until then, I'll never judge either way with Wenger, the guy was a revelation and turned mediocre as soon as we moved to the Emirates, with his best players already aging and nothing to replace them with.


Good post.

If it’s a battle between the board and Wenger, then anyone who’s been following my posts in this forum will know where my allegiance has always been. I only gave up on Wenger because it became clear that he could no longer work with all the handicaps as much as he (and I) probably thought he could.

It will take a special man to get this club back where it belongs, all things remaining equal.


Thanks, I always thought this way, the uncomfortable cheeky smiles when asked questions about transfers etc season after season, since the Stadium move, it kinda confirmed it to me when he was asked why he did not get Kante, when he said 'the other team were offering more financially', which basically confirmed he had to cheap it out with Xhaka, who was not really a lot less.

He always looked like a guy covering things up etc, and a guy who was coasting doing the best he could with what he had available.

He did say years ago the stadium would not be paid off until 2017? (something like that, going off memory) and i think Tottenham are about to be put in the same position we were (i hope anyway :P )

I could be way off, but that's how it looked to me, if this is right, then he is one of the best managers of all time to be still consistently getting top 4 finishes and cups with a bargain basement team of players barely worth West Ham's time, let alone ours, a team of kids and cheapy alternatives, with the amount of shockers we have had, Wenger could actually be super efficient, i suppose we will never know because Wenger is not the type to 'reveal all'.

But at least we know where we stand now because Emery tells us, if there is no money, there is no money.
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Re: Merci Arsène

Postby theHotHead » Wed Feb 27, 2019 7:01 am

Suprnova wrote:This has probably been posted a million times here, but i think without the stadium move and more money to spend, and without him having the pressure of hiding everything that was really going on (which he was great at) I think we would have continued our success.

Emery is less shy about exposing the money issues so it shows what Wenger was dealing with the whole time.

One deal stands out in particular, Signing Xhaka over Kante and another in Gervinho over Hazard or even the 40,000,001 bid for Suarez, he was always going for the player that was cheaper in fees and wages, and it showed, was this his doing, or the boards?

I'm on the fence with it, it could be either, but i'd like to see him at a club that gives him money to spend, to see if he woudl actually spend it, and if he did spend it what he could still achieve.

Until then, I'll never judge either way with Wenger, the guy was a revelation and turned mediocre as soon as we moved to the Emirates, with his best players already aging and nothing to replace them with.

Its a falsehood. Arsenal have never been the biggest spenders but have been able to compete. The stadium move was not the reason we played players out of position and brought in the likes of potato head Silvestre and Sanogo. It was not the reason Wenger stuck with Almunia and Flappyhandski in goal. It was not the reason he didn't want to spend £4m on Schwarzer.

No, it was Wenger's stubbornness and arrogance that prevented us from winning the league again. Buying a million little frail technical midfielders and no men, no leaders on the pitch.

The stadium didn't prevent us from getting a spiralling wage bill did it!!! Its a non-argument and one that Wenger apologists like to hide behind.
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Re: Merci Arsène

Postby Tony_Adams » Wed Feb 27, 2019 7:03 am

theHotHead wrote:
Suprnova wrote:This has probably been posted a million times here, but i think without the stadium move and more money to spend, and without him having the pressure of hiding everything that was really going on (which he was great at) I think we would have continued our success.

Emery is less shy about exposing the money issues so it shows what Wenger was dealing with the whole time.

One deal stands out in particular, Signing Xhaka over Kante and another in Gervinho over Hazard or even the 40,000,001 bid for Suarez, he was always going for the player that was cheaper in fees and wages, and it showed, was this his doing, or the boards?

I'm on the fence with it, it could be either, but i'd like to see him at a club that gives him money to spend, to see if he woudl actually spend it, and if he did spend it what he could still achieve.

Until then, I'll never judge either way with Wenger, the guy was a revelation and turned mediocre as soon as we moved to the Emirates, with his best players already aging and nothing to replace them with.

Its a falsehood. Arsenal have never been the biggest spenders but have been able to compete. The stadium move was not the reason we played players out of position and brought in the likes of potato head Silvestre and Sanogo. It was not the reason Wenger stuck with Almunia and Flappyhandski in goal. It was not the reason he didn't want to spend £4m on Schwarzer.

No, it was Wenger's stubbornness and arrogance that prevented us from winning the league again. Buying a million little frail technical midfielders and no men, no leaders on the pitch.

The stadium didn't prevent us from getting a spiralling wage bill did it!!! Its a non-argument and one that Wenger apologists like to hide behind.

:hail:
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Re: Merci Arsène

Postby Suprnova » Wed Feb 27, 2019 9:08 am

Within Wengers first few years he was throwing money around, at decent prices, but still pretty up there for that time, that stopped dead with the stadium move.

Thats all i'm saying, he created the Invincibles, all but Bergkamp, who was also a big money signing.
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Re: Merci Arsène

Postby CrimsonGunner11 » Wed Feb 27, 2019 11:07 am

theHotHead wrote:
Suprnova wrote:This has probably been posted a million times here, but i think without the stadium move and more money to spend, and without him having the pressure of hiding everything that was really going on (which he was great at) I think we would have continued our success.

Emery is less shy about exposing the money issues so it shows what Wenger was dealing with the whole time.

One deal stands out in particular, Signing Xhaka over Kante and another in Gervinho over Hazard or even the 40,000,001 bid for Suarez, he was always going for the player that was cheaper in fees and wages, and it showed, was this his doing, or the boards?

I'm on the fence with it, it could be either, but i'd like to see him at a club that gives him money to spend, to see if he woudl actually spend it, and if he did spend it what he could still achieve.

Until then, I'll never judge either way with Wenger, the guy was a revelation and turned mediocre as soon as we moved to the Emirates, with his best players already aging and nothing to replace them with.

Its a falsehood. Arsenal have never been the biggest spenders but have been able to compete. The stadium move was not the reason we played players out of position and brought in the likes of potato head Silvestre and Sanogo. It was not the reason Wenger stuck with Almunia and Flappyhandski in goal. It was not the reason he didn't want to spend £4m on Schwarzer.

No, it was Wenger's stubbornness and arrogance that prevented us from winning the league again. Buying a million little frail technical midfielders and no men, no leaders on the pitch.

The stadium didn't prevent us from getting a spiralling wage bill did it!!! Its a non-argument and one that Wenger apologists like to hide behind.


Although I was not a fan of how he handled some things, you cannot argue that it was these decisions that consistently gave him top 4 finishes and a couple of trophies; an objective that was most likely set by those above him.

His stubbornness was a hindrance, that I do agree, and it is probably what prevented him from doing more than he did. Wenger most likely believed he could do a madness with the likes of Sanogo and immortalize himself in the history books forever, I don’t know. It’s either that or became senile with age as a few members have suggested. What I do know is that not only did he have no right to achieve a lot of what he did with some of these decisions, he came pretty close to achieving what certainly would have serialized his name as the greatest manager ever.

Emery deserves to have his “moment of madness” and no Ozil appears to be part of his own agenda. As far as I’m concerned, I will entertain Emery the way I entertained Wenger. That is he will have my support until it’s clear his assanine decisions are no longer healthy for the club. It’s only fair
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Re: Merci Arsène

Postby StLGooner » Wed Feb 27, 2019 1:12 pm

And why don't we have any money now then? Can't blame Wenger anymore. I'm not a Wenger fan or apologist, but its seem pretty clear that it wasn't all his fault. And Wenger protected the board all while making himself look bad.
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Re: Merci Arsène

Postby EliteKiller » Wed Feb 27, 2019 1:32 pm

StLGooner wrote:And why don't we have any money now then? Can't blame Wenger anymore. I'm not a Wenger fan or apologist, but its seem pretty clear that it wasn't all his fault. And Wenger protected the board all while making himself look bad.


Probably because we've recently spent a huge amount ...

18/19 - 73m
17/18 - 137m
16/17 - 101m
15/16 - 24m
14/15 - 107m

That's 442m in five years the vast majority by Wenger, during that same period we sold just 182m ... that means we've spent net 260m in five years ... some 200m of that has come straight out of our cash reserves, claiming we don't spend money? Before he left Arsene spent a bloody fortune, and somehow we got worse.
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Re: Merci Arsène

Postby StLGooner » Wed Feb 27, 2019 1:35 pm

EliteKiller wrote:
StLGooner wrote:And why don't we have any money now then? Can't blame Wenger anymore. I'm not a Wenger fan or apologist, but its seem pretty clear that it wasn't all his fault. And Wenger protected the board all while making himself look bad.


Probably because we've recently spent a huge amount ...

18/19 - 73m
17/18 - 137m
16/17 - 101m
15/16 - 24m
14/15 - 107m

That's 442m in five years the vast majority by Wenger, during that same period we sold just 182m ... that means we've spent net 260m in five years ... some 200m of that has come straight out of our cash reserves, claiming we don't spend money? Before he left Arsene spent a bloody fortune, and somehow we got worse.




But we were supposed to be self sustaining and better off at the new stadium.
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Re: Merci Arsène

Postby theHotHead » Wed Feb 27, 2019 2:50 pm

EliteKiller wrote:
StLGooner wrote:And why don't we have any money now then? Can't blame Wenger anymore. I'm not a Wenger fan or apologist, but its seem pretty clear that it wasn't all his fault. And Wenger protected the board all while making himself look bad.


Probably because we've recently spent a huge amount ...

18/19 - 73m
17/18 - 137m
16/17 - 101m
15/16 - 24m
14/15 - 107m

That's 442m in five years the vast majority by Wenger, during that same period we sold just 182m ... that means we've spent net 260m in five years ... some 200m of that has come straight out of our cash reserves, claiming we don't spend money? Before he left Arsene spent a bloody fortune, and somehow we got worse.

But but but, we haven't spent any money!!
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