Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby VCC » Mon Mar 18, 2024 11:54 pm

I think I almost ALMOST watched Ozil make a tackle once
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby jayramfootball » Tue Mar 19, 2024 7:35 am

theHotHead wrote:
jayramfootball wrote:Ozil was a fantastic talent.
Loved him as a player.
But he’s not the kind of player that works in all systems and didn’t fit Arteta’s vision.
I disagreed with that at the time, but once again Arteta proved to be right.
Sometimes you have to just let your favourite players go and move on.

To be clear, I am not talking about keeping Ozil past the last season he played for us, I wasn't actually even upset when Arteta dropped him in the first place. But to drop him and then produce the worst football I have ever seen any Arsenal team play was a step too far. He could've played a part in that season for us.


I don’t disagree about the balls up at that time, TBH
The club completely wasted a year in Arteta’s first year.
The clear out of players should have started happening the moment Arteta walked in the door.
I remember saying that only some of the young players like ESR, Saka , Martinelli should be spared the axe. 20-25 players had to go. That’s what ended up happening but it was a year late.

I think Ozil just stands out because he was the first whilst the rest of the deadwood who were a disgrace to the club with their performances stayed.
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby ag6789 » Tue Mar 19, 2024 8:23 am

How can you have mass clear out in the beginning of the season w/o the new manager assessing them? Besides, the amount of money that needs to be invested would probably sink a club. Also, the uncertainty in bedding the newcomers.
It never happens that way. It is always in phases.
Most often in the first season, the new manager operates with the existing crew ( players) with minor changes ( tactics, trying out squad players).
That's the reason why I guess, Ozil was brought back into the fold, in case his form could be revived. Younger players Torreira, Guandouzi, Ceballos also needed to be thoroughly looked into, and then slowly started rebuilding the defense.
Three seasons is minimum for building from ground up.
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby Nuggets » Tue Mar 19, 2024 8:40 am

VCC wrote:I think I almost ALMOST watched Ozil make a tackle once


A rare sight indeed lol :arse fan:
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby theHotHead » Tue Mar 19, 2024 10:10 am

ag6789 wrote:How can you have mass clear out in the beginning of the season w/o the new manager assessing them? Besides, the amount of money that needs to be invested would probably sink a club. Also, the uncertainty in bedding the newcomers.
It never happens that way. It is always in phases.
Most often in the first season, the new manager operates with the existing crew ( players) with minor changes ( tactics, trying out squad players).
That's the reason why I guess, Ozil was brought back into the fold, in case his form could be revived. Younger players Torreira, Guandouzi, Ceballos also needed to be thoroughly looked into, and then slowly started rebuilding the defense.
Three seasons is minimum for building from ground up.

If you think about what Jay is saying he (Arteta) totally could have. We are talking about the 2020/21 season, right ?!

Arteta came to the club in Dec 2019, he had the players up until the Covid break in March 2020. Then they had a second pre-season prior to the resumption of the season, 13 games until August 2020 and the 2020/21 season started at the end of August. He had plenty of time up to the end of the 2019/20 season to evaluate the players he had.

Had he done it then (summer of 2020) he would've reduced or removed in its entirety the loss of value of many players. We wouldn't have had the Ozil vs Arteta saga so could've clawed back some money from selling him. In fact, if you look at our list of transfers/loans you can se that actually Arteta probably did want to do it in a big bang. Here is a list of those players that departed:
Martinez (sold), Guendouzi (loan), Mavropanos (loan), Kolasinac (loan), Sokratis (free), Ozil (free), Mustafi (free), Mkhi (free), Saliba (loan), AMN (loan), Willock (loan), Torreira (loan)

Thats 12 players from a full squad of 38 players, and when you consider 10 of them were used regularly in the first team up until and including the season before thats 10 from a matchday squad of 20 players, a significant number !!!
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby jayramfootball » Tue Mar 19, 2024 11:01 am

theHotHead wrote:
ag6789 wrote:How can you have mass clear out in the beginning of the season w/o the new manager assessing them? Besides, the amount of money that needs to be invested would probably sink a club. Also, the uncertainty in bedding the newcomers.
It never happens that way. It is always in phases.
Most often in the first season, the new manager operates with the existing crew ( players) with minor changes ( tactics, trying out squad players).
That's the reason why I guess, Ozil was brought back into the fold, in case his form could be revived. Younger players Torreira, Guandouzi, Ceballos also needed to be thoroughly looked into, and then slowly started rebuilding the defense.
Three seasons is minimum for building from ground up.

If you think about what Jay is saying he (Arteta) totally could have. We are talking about the 2020/21 season, right ?!

Arteta came to the club in Dec 2019, he had the players up until the Covid break in March 2020. Then they had a second pre-season prior to the resumption of the season, 13 games until August 2020 and the 2020/21 season started at the end of August. He had plenty of time up to the end of the 2019/20 season to evaluate the players he had.

Had he done it then (summer of 2020) he would've reduced or removed in its entirety the loss of value of many players. We wouldn't have had the Ozil vs Arteta saga so could've clawed back some money from selling him. In fact, if you look at our list of transfers/loans you can se that actually Arteta probably did want to do it in a big bang. Here is a list of those players that departed:
Martinez (sold), Guendouzi (loan), Mavropanos (loan), Kolasinac (loan), Sokratis (free), Ozil (free), Mustafi (free), Mkhi (free), Saliba (loan), AMN (loan), Willock (loan), Torreira (loan)

Thats 12 players from a full squad of 38 players, and when you consider 10 of them were used regularly in the first team up until and including the season before thats 10 from a matchday squad of 20 players, a significant number !!!



Personally, think he should have started in Jan 20, pretty much as soon as he walked in the door.
The players didn't deserve another chance - they had already proved that they were never going to be at the level of City and Liverpool.
Yes, it may have meant we didn't win an FA Cup, but i would be happier if we were one year ahead of where we are now, but without that FA Cup win.

I still blame Arteta for taking a full year in the job to realise that what he had as a squad was never going to be good enough.
Take away that first year and it's been a steady march towards City/Liverpool level.
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby swipe right » Tue Mar 19, 2024 2:29 pm

jayramfootball wrote:
theHotHead wrote:
ag6789 wrote:How can you have mass clear out in the beginning of the season w/o the new manager assessing them? Besides, the amount of money that needs to be invested would probably sink a club. Also, the uncertainty in bedding the newcomers.
It never happens that way. It is always in phases.
Most often in the first season, the new manager operates with the existing crew ( players) with minor changes ( tactics, trying out squad players).
That's the reason why I guess, Ozil was brought back into the fold, in case his form could be revived. Younger players Torreira, Guandouzi, Ceballos also needed to be thoroughly looked into, and then slowly started rebuilding the defense.
Three seasons is minimum for building from ground up.

If you think about what Jay is saying he (Arteta) totally could have. We are talking about the 2020/21 season, right ?!

Arteta came to the club in Dec 2019, he had the players up until the Covid break in March 2020. Then they had a second pre-season prior to the resumption of the season, 13 games until August 2020 and the 2020/21 season started at the end of August. He had plenty of time up to the end of the 2019/20 season to evaluate the players he had.

Had he done it then (summer of 2020) he would've reduced or removed in its entirety the loss of value of many players. We wouldn't have had the Ozil vs Arteta saga so could've clawed back some money from selling him. In fact, if you look at our list of transfers/loans you can se that actually Arteta probably did want to do it in a big bang. Here is a list of those players that departed:
Martinez (sold), Guendouzi (loan), Mavropanos (loan), Kolasinac (loan), Sokratis (free), Ozil (free), Mustafi (free), Mkhi (free), Saliba (loan), AMN (loan), Willock (loan), Torreira (loan)

Thats 12 players from a full squad of 38 players, and when you consider 10 of them were used regularly in the first team up until and including the season before thats 10 from a matchday squad of 20 players, a significant number !!!



Personally, think he should have started in Jan 20, pretty much as soon as he walked in the door.
The players didn't deserve another chance - they had already proved that they were never going to be at the level of City and Liverpool.
Yes, it may have meant we didn't win an FA Cup, but i would be happier if we were one year ahead of where we are now, but without that FA Cup win.

I still blame Arteta for taking a full year in the job to realise that what he had as a squad was never going to be good enough.
Take away that first year and it's been a steady march towards City/Liverpool level.

City and Liverpool are PL and CL winning level. A flukey FA Cup does not get them to that level. You can big up Arteta if he hits those milestones at the end of this season. Till then he's a chancer.
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby Nuggets » Tue Mar 19, 2024 4:51 pm

swipe right wrote:
jayramfootball wrote:
theHotHead wrote:
ag6789 wrote:How can you have mass clear out in the beginning of the season w/o the new manager assessing them? Besides, the amount of money that needs to be invested would probably sink a club. Also, the uncertainty in bedding the newcomers.
It never happens that way. It is always in phases.
Most often in the first season, the new manager operates with the existing crew ( players) with minor changes ( tactics, trying out squad players).
That's the reason why I guess, Ozil was brought back into the fold, in case his form could be revived. Younger players Torreira, Guandouzi, Ceballos also needed to be thoroughly looked into, and then slowly started rebuilding the defense.
Three seasons is minimum for building from ground up.

If you think about what Jay is saying he (Arteta) totally could have. We are talking about the 2020/21 season, right ?!

Arteta came to the club in Dec 2019, he had the players up until the Covid break in March 2020. Then they had a second pre-season prior to the resumption of the season, 13 games until August 2020 and the 2020/21 season started at the end of August. He had plenty of time up to the end of the 2019/20 season to evaluate the players he had.

Had he done it then (summer of 2020) he would've reduced or removed in its entirety the loss of value of many players. We wouldn't have had the Ozil vs Arteta saga so could've clawed back some money from selling him. In fact, if you look at our list of transfers/loans you can se that actually Arteta probably did want to do it in a big bang. Here is a list of those players that departed:
Martinez (sold), Guendouzi (loan), Mavropanos (loan), Kolasinac (loan), Sokratis (free), Ozil (free), Mustafi (free), Mkhi (free), Saliba (loan), AMN (loan), Willock (loan), Torreira (loan)

Thats 12 players from a full squad of 38 players, and when you consider 10 of them were used regularly in the first team up until and including the season before thats 10 from a matchday squad of 20 players, a significant number !!!



Personally, think he should have started in Jan 20, pretty much as soon as he walked in the door.
The players didn't deserve another chance - they had already proved that they were never going to be at the level of City and Liverpool.
Yes, it may have meant we didn't win an FA Cup, but i would be happier if we were one year ahead of where we are now, but without that FA Cup win.

I still blame Arteta for taking a full year in the job to realise that what he had as a squad was never going to be good enough.
Take away that first year and it's been a steady march towards City/Liverpool level.

City and Liverpool are PL and CL winning level. A flukey FA Cup does not get them to that level. You can big up Arteta if he hits those milestones at the end of this season. Till then he's a chancer.

True, I hope he reaches those rights as it is good for the club but ?????>?
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby Zenith » Wed Mar 27, 2024 5:54 pm


Whilst we've done well at home this season our away record against the stronger teams has got to improve:


    Oct 21
    Chelsea 2-2 Arsenal
    Nov 4
    Newcastle 1-0 Arsenal
    Dec 9
    Villa 1-0 Arsenal
    Dec 23
    Liverpool 1-1 Arsenal

    P4 D2 L2 = 2/12



Assuming we don't drop points against the so-called weaker teams, a draw at City followed by P4 W3 L1 is the bare minium we need, I feel.


    Mar 31
    Man City v Arsenal
    Apr 5
    Brighton v Arsenal
    Apr 20
    Wolves v Arsenal
    Apr 28
    Spurs v Arsenal
    May 11
    Man United v Arsenal

    P5 W3 D1 L1 = 10/15
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby KG3 » Fri Mar 29, 2024 2:42 pm

The remainder of this season will be a tough test for Arteta, both CL and BPL to play for and little rest time between each game. He needs to start subbing of the likes of Martinelli, Saka and Odegaard when we are winning by 2+ goals at least by 60th minute, it will not only stop them from being burnt out/possibly injured but it will help us bring players like ESR/Nelson/Vieira back into form so we can use them as starters in certain games.

If our key attacking players are on for 80+ minutes of every game I guarantee you we are not going to win anything, a tired Martinelli would be no use against Walker in potential CL semi final for example.
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby swipe right » Fri Mar 29, 2024 2:46 pm

Biggest weekend of his fledgling career.
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby ag6789 » Fri Mar 29, 2024 4:05 pm

All weekends are critical for him. Can slip up against any team in PL.
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby swipe right » Fri Mar 29, 2024 5:43 pm

ag6789 wrote:All weekends are critical for him. Can slip up against any team in PL.

Last season when we went to Anfield, I warned that slip up here and the league is gone. The trolls attacked me but I was right. Same again this time. Bottle Etihad and the league is gone.
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby Nuggets » Fri Mar 29, 2024 5:44 pm

It's brown trousers time now, let's see how he does, I hope he shocks us and does the business as it's good for the club irrespective of what the likes and dislikes of the guy are.
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby jayramfootball » Fri Mar 29, 2024 5:53 pm

swipe right wrote:
ag6789 wrote:All weekends are critical for him. Can slip up against any team in PL.

Last season when we went to Anfield, I warned that slip up here and the league is gone. The trolls attacked me but I was right. Same again this time. Bottle Etihad and the league is gone.


We don't win the league 92% of time.
Quite easy to predict we'll not win the league TBH.
For clarity - losing means we sit 2 pts behind City with 9 matches to go.
Some of us will continue to support the team even if we do lose away against City, rather than crying that the sky has fallen.
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