Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

[Santi]

Then there’s the fact that Arteta hasn’t managed to improve one player since he started here, they may be playing well as individuals but they’re still they same level they were when Emery left.

A bit harsh, as both Saka and ESR are playing better and more consistently, as well as the team playing much more for each other than earlier in the season. Its obviously disappointing to see our progress stall recently, but those stupid sending offs haven't helped and frankly, we were all a bit shocked at reaching 4th place so quickly anyway!

We need to regroup and go again.

Good post bud, completely agree.

[Santi]

Saka was already this good under Emery. ESR was this good from his first games under Arteta, in the EL, he was scoring goals. Arteta has not turned a shit player into a decent player or a decent player into an amazing player.

That's absolute rubbish.
ESR is way way ahead of where he was and Saka is significantly further ahead.
For Saka, his first touch and ability to hold off defenders is light years ahead of where he was.

Yep, fair argument to say they've naturally progressed due to age and more game time as well but as fans we can't distinguish so have to give credit to both player and manager.

Arteta is the one utilising them and have to assume he's helping drive their development.

[theHotHead]

Saka was already this good under Emery. ESR was this good from his first games under Arteta, in the EL, he was scoring goals. Arteta has not turned a shit player into a decent player or a decent player into an amazing player.

That's absolute rubbish.
ESR is way way ahead of where he was and Saka is significantly further ahead.
For Saka, his first touch and ability to hold off defenders is light years ahead of where he was.

I already dealt with this matter, Jay, I am happy to deal with it again.

Saka was a marvel under Emery, he started wide left and his trickery was fantastic but he was dropped back to cover Tierney/Kola when they were injured and he was brilliant. when he pushed forward again he was already one of our best players. So Arteta didn't develop Saka.

ESR didn't play any league games under Arteta initially, he started the 2020/21 season injured, his only run outs in the first team were in the Europa League in November and he scored 2 and got an assist in 3 games !! Are you gonna tell me Arteta developed him too Jay ?? He was at Huddersfield the season before.

[jayramfootball]

Saka was already this good under Emery. ESR was this good from his first games under Arteta, in the EL, he was scoring goals. Arteta has not turned a shit player into a decent player or a decent player into an amazing player.

That's absolute rubbish.
ESR is way way ahead of where he was and Saka is significantly further ahead.
For Saka, his first touch and ability to hold off defenders is light years ahead of where he was.

I already dealt with this matter, Jay, I am happy to deal with it again.

Saka was a marvel under Emery, he started wide left and his trickery was fantastic but he was dropped back to cover Tierney/Kola when they were injured and he was brilliant. when he pushed forward again he was already one of our best players. So Arteta didn't develop Saka.

ESR didn't play any league games under Arteta initially, he started the 2020/21 season injured, his only run outs in the first team were in the Europa League in November and he scored 2 and got an assist in 3 games !! Are you gonna tell me Arteta developed him too Jay ?? He was at Huddersfield the season before.

Sorry dude, you’ve lost the plot.
Both ESR and Saka have clearly progressed in the last 2 years.
We could debate why and what influences helped them, but to pretend they haven’t developed is just silly.

[DiamondGooner]

That is a dead conversation anyway.

You can't compare a 17 yr old Saka to a 20 yr old Saka and be talking about improving.

Players get better as they age, its that simple, the discussion about the manager is irrelevant because an improvement would of happened naturally anyway.

[jayramfootball]

That is a dead conversation anyway.

You can't compare a 17 yr old Saka to a 20 yr old Saka and be talking about improving.

Players get better as they age, its that simple, the discussion about the manager is irrelevant because an improvement would of happened naturally anyway.

Would it have happened anyway? To the same extent?
Players are coached on and off the field in their development years, no?
We simply can't say whether ESR or Saka would have developed the same way under a different coaching staff... not as good - or better, in fact.

We do know some things, like ESR being coached in terms of diet and lifestyle. Also given specific instruction to get into the box more to score goals.
There are a multitude of things that can go differently, but I do agree the vast majority of the credit for anything a player achieves goes to the player. It's odd though that in some of these debates, the manager is accountable and responsible for everything ... until something goes well.

[theHotHead]

Saka was already this good under Emery. ESR was this good from his first games under Arteta, in the EL, he was scoring goals. Arteta has not turned a shit player into a decent player or a decent player into an amazing player.

That's absolute rubbish.
ESR is way way ahead of where he was and Saka is significantly further ahead.
For Saka, his first touch and ability to hold off defenders is light years ahead of where he was.

I already dealt with this matter, Jay, I am happy to deal with it again.

Saka was a marvel under Emery, he started wide left and his trickery was fantastic but he was dropped back to cover Tierney/Kola when they were injured and he was brilliant. when he pushed forward again he was already one of our best players. So Arteta didn't develop Saka.

ESR didn't play any league games under Arteta initially, he started the 2020/21 season injured, his only run outs in the first team were in the Europa League in November and he scored 2 and got an assist in 3 games !! Are you gonna tell me Arteta developed him too Jay ?? He was at Huddersfield the season before.

Sorry dude, you’ve lost the plot.
Both ESR and Saka have clearly progressed in the last 2 years.
We could debate why and what influences helped them, but to pretend they haven’t developed is just silly.

Bullcrap. I proved that Arteta had no time to develop anyone. You're not winning this one Jay.

[jayramfootball]

Saka was already this good under Emery. ESR was this good from his first games under Arteta, in the EL, he was scoring goals. Arteta has not turned a shit player into a decent player or a decent player into an amazing player.

That's absolute rubbish.
ESR is way way ahead of where he was and Saka is significantly further ahead.
For Saka, his first touch and ability to hold off defenders is light years ahead of where he was.

I already dealt with this matter, Jay, I am happy to deal with it again.

Saka was a marvel under Emery, he started wide left and his trickery was fantastic but he was dropped back to cover Tierney/Kola when they were injured and he was brilliant. when he pushed forward again he was already one of our best players. So Arteta didn't develop Saka.

ESR didn't play any league games under Arteta initially, he started the 2020/21 season injured, his only run outs in the first team were in the Europa League in November and he scored 2 and got an assist in 3 games !! Are you gonna tell me Arteta developed him too Jay ?? He was at Huddersfield the season before.

Sorry dude, you’ve lost the plot.
Both ESR and Saka have clearly progressed in the last 2 years.
We could debate why and what influences helped them, but to pretend they haven’t developed is just silly.

Bullcrap. I proved that Arteta had no time to develop anyone. You're not winning this one Jay.

You already beat yourself.
You claimed the manager is the person accountable for players performances.
You made that very clear as your view.

[theHotHead]

Saka was already this good under Emery. ESR was this good from his first games under Arteta, in the EL, he was scoring goals. Arteta has not turned a shit player into a decent player or a decent player into an amazing player.

That's absolute rubbish.
ESR is way way ahead of where he was and Saka is significantly further ahead.
For Saka, his first touch and ability to hold off defenders is light years ahead of where he was.

I already dealt with this matter, Jay, I am happy to deal with it again.

Saka was a marvel under Emery, he started wide left and his trickery was fantastic but he was dropped back to cover Tierney/Kola when they were injured and he was brilliant. when he pushed forward again he was already one of our best players. So Arteta didn't develop Saka.

ESR didn't play any league games under Arteta initially, he started the 2020/21 season injured, his only run outs in the first team were in the Europa League in November and he scored 2 and got an assist in 3 games !! Are you gonna tell me Arteta developed him too Jay ?? He was at Huddersfield the season before.

Sorry dude, you’ve lost the plot.
Both ESR and Saka have clearly progressed in the last 2 years.
We could debate why and what influences helped them, but to pretend they haven’t developed is just silly.

Bullcrap. I proved that Arteta had no time to develop anyone. You're not winning this one Jay.

You already beat yourself.
You claimed the manager is the person accountable for players performances.
You made that very clear as your view.

No I didn't, I said the team, when we win its the manager, when we lose, its the manager, don't try to twist it.

Arteta has developed NOBODY thus far.

[jayramfootball]

Saka was already this good under Emery. ESR was this good from his first games under Arteta, in the EL, he was scoring goals. Arteta has not turned a shit player into a decent player or a decent player into an amazing player.

That's absolute rubbish.
ESR is way way ahead of where he was and Saka is significantly further ahead.
For Saka, his first touch and ability to hold off defenders is light years ahead of where he was.

I already dealt with this matter, Jay, I am happy to deal with it again.

Saka was a marvel under Emery, he started wide left and his trickery was fantastic but he was dropped back to cover Tierney/Kola when they were injured and he was brilliant. when he pushed forward again he was already one of our best players. So Arteta didn't develop Saka.

ESR didn't play any league games under Arteta initially, he started the 2020/21 season injured, his only run outs in the first team were in the Europa League in November and he scored 2 and got an assist in 3 games !! Are you gonna tell me Arteta developed him too Jay ?? He was at Huddersfield the season before.

Sorry dude, you’ve lost the plot.
Both ESR and Saka have clearly progressed in the last 2 years.
We could debate why and what influences helped them, but to pretend they haven’t developed is just silly.

Bullcrap. I proved that Arteta had no time to develop anyone. You're not winning this one Jay.

You already beat yourself.
You claimed the manager is the person accountable for players performances.
You made that very clear as your view.

No I didn't, I said the team, when we win its the manager, when we lose, its the manager, don't try to twist it.

Arteta has developed NOBODY thus far.

Oh, so if we play well and win, we won because of the manager, but our players playing well to get the win is not because of the manager?
But, if our players play poorly, we've heard its because of the manager - from you.
Confusing stuff.
So many caveats it's hard to keep up!

[Angelito]

Interesting piece by Ornstein for the Athletic.

So, accto him, Edu and Arteta's segregation of responsibilities seems to be raising eyebrows. He questioned their synchronicity. Nothing outlandish, however.

Ornstein also mentioned that this Jan transfer window "strategy" falls on Arteta and Edu. Nothing about the Kroenkes here. It's a risk driven by the duo's will.

The Athletic has been Arsenal's mouthpiece for a while now. Interesting to note the minor criticism directed towards Arteta and Edu, not Josh or Stan.

My person opinion is that Arteta will be offered an extension. That was the reason behind his recent American excursion. I'd speculate that if one of the two were to be "released," it'd be Edu first. I feel Arteta is gunning for a Wenger-esque control of Arsenal. Different circumstances though.

Wenger was the head honcho during a time of boardroom drama at Arsenal, and during the austerity years. Even with Edu out of the picture, Arteta will have to deal with Josh, and he can't bully Josh out of the club.

From the outside, it seems like Arteta is acting like a know-it-all teenager who most likely presumes to have a deeper understanding of the world just because he has the technological edge over his parents.

Purely speculative from my part. I do hope that's not the case. That said, as of now, I have no evidence to believe otherwise.

Another important aspect, it's my calculated hunch that the super league is happening. The Kroenkes are simply waiting for that. From a business standpoint, it makes sense to make-do with the existing hierarchy until further confirmation.

[Power n Glory]

Interesting piece by Ornstein for the Athletic.

So, accto him, Edu and Arteta's segregation of responsibilities seems to be raising eyebrows. He questioned their synchronicity. Nothing outlandish, however.

Ornstein also mentioned that this Jan transfer window "strategy" falls on Arteta and Edu. Nothing about the Kroenkes here. It's a risk driven by the duo's will.

The Athletic has been Arsenal's mouthpiece for a while now. Interesting to note the minor criticism directed towards Arteta and Edu, not Josh or Stan.

My person opinion is that Arteta will be offered an extension. That was the reason behind his recent American excursion. I'd speculate that if one of the two were to be "released," it'd be Edu first. I feel Arteta is gunning for a Wenger-esque control of Arsenal. Different circumstances though.

Wenger was the head honcho during a time of boardroom drama at Arsenal, and during the austerity years. Even with Edu out of the picture, Arteta will have to deal with Josh, and he can't bully Josh out of the club.

From the outside, it seems like Arteta is acting like a know-it-all teenager who most likely presumes to have a deeper understanding of the world just because he has the technological edge over his parents.

Purely speculative from my part. I do hope that's not the case. That said, as of now, I have no evidence to believe otherwise.

Another important aspect, it's my calculated hunch that the super league is happening. The Kroenkes are simply waiting for that. From a business standpoint, it makes sense to make-do with the existing hierarchy until further confirmation.

Was anything mentioned about KSE blocking the Melo deal?

It would be a massive mistake to hand Arteta more control. We'd be making the same mistake made under Wenger once Dein left. They definitely have to get rid of Edu but will need a more experienced replacement to support the coach. We can't have a one man band situation again.

[Highbury Hillbilly]

Interesting piece by Ornstein for the Athletic.

So, accto him, Edu and Arteta's segregation of responsibilities seems to be raising eyebrows. He questioned their synchronicity. Nothing outlandish, however.

Ornstein also mentioned that this Jan transfer window "strategy" falls on Arteta and Edu. Nothing about the Kroenkes here. It's a risk driven by the duo's will.

The Athletic has been Arsenal's mouthpiece for a while now. Interesting to note the minor criticism directed towards Arteta and Edu, not Josh or Stan.

My person opinion is that Arteta will be offered an extension. That was the reason behind his recent American excursion. I'd speculate that if one of the two were to be "released," it'd be Edu first. I feel Arteta is gunning for a Wenger-esque control of Arsenal. Different circumstances though.

Wenger was the head honcho during a time of boardroom drama at Arsenal, and during the austerity years. Even with Edu out of the picture, Arteta will have to deal with Josh, and he can't bully Josh out of the club.

From the outside, it seems like Arteta is acting like a know-it-all teenager who most likely presumes to have a deeper understanding of the world just because he has the technological edge over his parents.

Purely speculative from my part. I do hope that's not the case. That said, as of now, I have no evidence to believe otherwise.

Another important aspect, it's my calculated hunch that the super league is happening. The Kroenkes are simply waiting for that. From a business standpoint, it makes sense to make-do with the existing hierarchy until further confirmation.

I think all media outlets, Athetic included were surprised by our inactivity, especially as Edu + Arteta have brought in a lot of new faces in past windows. For them to take their foot off the gas in a season where Top 4 is possible is puzzling. The only reason they wouldn't do it is if they've received assurances about their jobs.

As for the Super League, I agree, Stan is waiting for that to make a comeback. From a footballing perspective though, I don't see the likes of Saka, Gabriel and ESR sticking around to be a punching bag for Europe's biggest teams.

[theHotHead]

Thanks for ruining my day Angelito.

How depressing is that

[Angelito]

Interesting piece by Ornstein for the Athletic.

So, accto him, Edu and Arteta's segregation of responsibilities seems to be raising eyebrows. He questioned their synchronicity. Nothing outlandish, however.

Ornstein also mentioned that this Jan transfer window "strategy" falls on Arteta and Edu. Nothing about the Kroenkes here. It's a risk driven by the duo's will.

The Athletic has been Arsenal's mouthpiece for a while now. Interesting to note the minor criticism directed towards Arteta and Edu, not Josh or Stan.

My person opinion is that Arteta will be offered an extension. That was the reason behind his recent American excursion. I'd speculate that if one of the two were to be "released," it'd be Edu first. I feel Arteta is gunning for a Wenger-esque control of Arsenal. Different circumstances though.

Wenger was the head honcho during a time of boardroom drama at Arsenal, and during the austerity years. Even with Edu out of the picture, Arteta will have to deal with Josh, and he can't bully Josh out of the club.

From the outside, it seems like Arteta is acting like a know-it-all teenager who most likely presumes to have a deeper understanding of the world just because he has the technological edge over his parents.

Purely speculative from my part. I do hope that's not the case. That said, as of now, I have no evidence to believe otherwise.

Another important aspect, it's my calculated hunch that the super league is happening. The Kroenkes are simply waiting for that. From a business standpoint, it makes sense to make-do with the existing hierarchy until further confirmation.

Was anything mentioned about KSE blocking the Melo deal?

It would be a massive mistake to hand Arteta more control. We'd be making the same mistake made under Wenger once Dein left. They definitely have to get rid of Edu but will need a more experienced replacement to support the coach. We can't have a one man band situation again.

It was Vlahovic or nothing. Then, we moved too late for Isak. Funds were available. Article was mostly about Auba and the striker situation at Arsenal.

The Arthur deal fell through as Arsenal didn't want to acquire him as a long-term option and Juve weren't interested in a short-term loan. It was a mismatch of objectives.