Summer Transfer Window

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Re: Summer Transfer Window

Postby UFGN » Wed Jul 10, 2024 5:01 pm

Maiso wrote:Matteo Guendouzi – Released by Marseille to Lazio (loan made permanent).

Nicolas Pepe – released by Trabzonspor.

Shkodran Mustafi – retired.

Couldn’t we have put in little cheeky bids?


You are asking why we didn't use up a squad place plus pay wages to players who were literally given away by smaller clubs in worse leagues?

Can I just confirm that is what you are saying?
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Re: Summer Transfer Window

Postby Maiso » Wed Jul 10, 2024 5:10 pm

firfi wrote:Actually Arteta deserved to be sacked after that losing streak , but it just so happened to be a good decision to keep him.
Objectively speaking he showed that he didn't have the required experience to manage a club of that size at that stage of his career ,but hes improved alot since then and im glad they gave him time.Ultilately i don't think anyone should be sacked without viable replacement just to be sacked.This is what happened to Wenger he was sacked just to be sacked and we didn't have replacement lined up just happened to stumble on Emery and obviously we all know what happened.
Football is results business and sometimes u might be great at ur job ,but after poor run of form its better to change the manager.

He did not deserve to be sacked. I do feel like some of our fans were absolutely oblivious to the route the club had chosen by hiring a novice / rookie like Arteta back then. This was a long term tryout. They got burnt with the whole Emery saga and decided to go back to their comfort zone (Patience). They were always going to give him enough time to build his own squad and then see how he got on.

I think the disconnect between the fans that wanted him sacked at the end of 2020 and the 2021/22 season and the Club was that both had completely different visions / expectations for Arteta at that time. The club clearly were thinking LONG TERM (Wenger type of route) while the “Get rid of Arteta” fans were thinking “SHORT TERM” vision. Some fans had gotten brainwashed into the modern “HIRE and FIRE” at any slight discomfort culture.

The club hiring a novice, amateur, rookie and inexperienced Arteta clearly showed the direction they were willing to take (Long Haul / Long Term) while some of our fans did not realise it. They were in fully “Short Termism” mode.. That’s the disconnect I came to notice through it all..

If the club wanted the Short Term (Hire and Fire) approach then they would have gone for the likes of Mourinho, Ancelotti, Conte, Tuchel, Pochettino etc after they sacked Emery. But they went a completely different route by appointing a novice manager (Arteta). That should have been obvious enough to some fans as to what route the club had decided to go (Long term).

And the majority of the fans had clocked it back then. That’s why the ones calling for Arteta to be sacked have always been the minority. I think Arteta has had the vast majority of our fanbase (I would say about 80%) on his side from the moment he was hired. But it dropped to about 60% in 2020 due to the whole Ozil vs Arteta / Arsenal FC and the Covid stuff. But then it went back up in the 2021/22 season and has not wavered ever since..
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Re: Summer Transfer Window

Postby Ach » Wed Jul 10, 2024 5:14 pm

Maiso wrote:
firfi wrote:Actually Arteta deserved to be sacked after that losing streak , but it just so happened to be a good decision to keep him.
Objectively speaking he showed that he didn't have the required experience to manage a club of that size at that stage of his career ,but hes improved alot since then and im glad they gave him time.Ultilately i don't think anyone should be sacked without viable replacement just to be sacked.This is what happened to Wenger he was sacked just to be sacked and we didn't have replacement lined up just happened to stumble on Emery and obviously we all know what happened.
Football is results business and sometimes u might be great at ur job ,but after poor run of form its better to change the manager.

He did not deserve to be sacked. I do feel like some of our fans were absolutely oblivious to the route the club had chosen by hiring a novice / rookie like Arteta back then. This was a long term tryout. They got burnt with the whole Emery saga and decided to go back to their comfort zone (Patience). They were always going to give him enough time to build his own squad and then see how he got on.

I think the disconnect between the fans that wanted him sacked at the end of 2020 and the 2021/22 season and the Club was that both had completely different visions / expectations for Arteta at that time. The club clearly were thinking LONG TERM (Wenger type of route) while the “Get rid of Arteta” fans were thinking “SHORT TERM” vision. Some fans had gotten brainwashed into the modern “HIRE and FIRE” at any slight discomfort culture.

The club hiring a novice, amateur, rookie and inexperienced Arteta clearly showed the direction they were willing to take (Long Haul / Long Term) while some of our fans did not realise it. They were in fully “Short Termism” mode.. That’s the disconnect I came to notice through it all..

If the club wanted the Short Term (Hire and Fire) approach then they would have gone for the likes of Mourinho, Ancelotti, Conte, Tuchel, Pochettino etc after they sacked Emery. But they went a completely different route by appointing a novice manager (Arteta). That should have been obvious enough to some fans as to what route the club had decided to go (Long term).

And the majority of the fans had clocked it back then. That’s why the ones calling for Arteta to be sacked have always been the minority. I think Arteta has had the vast majority of our fanbase (I would say about 80%) on his side from the moment he was hired. But it dropped to about 60% in 2020 due to the whole Ozil vs Arteta / Arsenal FC and the Covid stuff. But then it went back up in the 2021/22 season and has not wavered ever since..

Not seen much of Arteta Arsenal this past 4 and a half years?
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Re: Summer Transfer Window

Postby Maiso » Wed Jul 10, 2024 5:18 pm

firfi wrote:
jayramfootball wrote:
Ach wrote:There have been plenty of occasions Arteta should've been sacked but we have a shit board for a reason



Nah - never been a consideration for anyone serious since 21.
He's long since proven his doubters wrong.
The dredges of unserious people remain.



Btw if he finishes outside top3 and fails in 1/8 finals in the CL he should be sacked on the spot.

That happens then I think he wouldn’t have much to complain about. I myself wouldn’t mind him being fired if he finished outside of the Top 3 and fails in the 1/8 finals. He would have been given enough time in my opinion. Can’t be going backwards. That would clearly show that there us no more progress.
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Re: Summer Transfer Window

Postby jayramfootball » Wed Jul 10, 2024 5:37 pm

Maiso wrote:
firfi wrote:
jayramfootball wrote:
Ach wrote:There have been plenty of occasions Arteta should've been sacked but we have a shit board for a reason



Nah - never been a consideration for anyone serious since 21.
He's long since proven his doubters wrong.
The dredges of unserious people remain.



Btw if he finishes outside top3 and fails in 1/8 finals in the CL he should be sacked on the spot.

That happens then I think he wouldn’t have much to complain about. I myself wouldn’t mind him being fired if he finished outside of the Top 3 and fails in the 1/8 finals. He would have been given enough time in my opinion. Can’t be going backwards. That would clearly show that there us no more progress.



It's never that simple.
In truth top 4 is still a major inflection point for clubs and owner decisions.
I will be looking more at how we play and how close we are on points to the Champions if it is not us.
CL QF stage min is needed - we have to get in the habit of winning knockout games.
CL is now easier for big clubs to qualify - 24 of 32 teams are going through to the next round - top 8 in the league get a buy from the playoff round, the next 16 playoff.
Then it's the last 16.
I would say we need to be in the last 8 again and go from there.
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Re: Summer Transfer Window

Postby Marsbar100 » Wed Jul 10, 2024 5:53 pm

I just want us to have a really good window and go for it, if we don’t win but at least tried hard in the window at least we did all we could
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Re: Summer Transfer Window

Postby firfi » Wed Jul 10, 2024 5:59 pm

Maiso wrote:
firfi wrote:Actually Arteta deserved to be sacked after that losing streak , but it just so happened to be a good decision to keep him.
Objectively speaking he showed that he didn't have the required experience to manage a club of that size at that stage of his career ,but hes improved alot since then and im glad they gave him time.Ultilately i don't think anyone should be sacked without viable replacement just to be sacked.This is what happened to Wenger he was sacked just to be sacked and we didn't have replacement lined up just happened to stumble on Emery and obviously we all know what happened.
Football is results business and sometimes u might be great at ur job ,but after poor run of form its better to change the manager.

He did not deserve to be sacked. I do feel like some of our fans were absolutely oblivious to the route the club had chosen by hiring a novice / rookie like Arteta back then. This was a long term tryout. They got burnt with the whole Emery saga and decided to go back to their comfort zone (Patience). They were always going to give him enough time to build his own squad and then see how he got on.

I think the disconnect between the fans that wanted him sacked at the end of 2020 and the 2021/22 season and the Club was that both had completely different visions / expectations for Arteta at that time. The club clearly were thinking LONG TERM (Wenger type of route) while the “Get rid of Arteta” fans were thinking “SHORT TERM” vision. Some fans had gotten brainwashed into the modern “HIRE and FIRE” at any slight discomfort culture.

The club hiring a novice, amateur, rookie and inexperienced Arteta clearly showed the direction they were willing to take (Long Haul / Long Term) while some of our fans did not realise it. They were in fully “Short Termism” mode.. That’s the disconnect I came to notice through it all..

If the club wanted the Short Term (Hire and Fire) approach then they would have gone for the likes of Mourinho, Ancelotti, Conte, Tuchel, Pochettino etc after they sacked Emery. But they went a completely different route by appointing a novice manager (Arteta). That should have been obvious enough to some fans as to what route the club had decided to go (Long term).

And the majority of the fans had clocked it back then. That’s why the ones calling for Arteta to be sacked have always been the minority. I think Arteta has had the vast majority of our fanbase (I would say about 80%) on his side from the moment he was hired. But it dropped to about 60% in 2020 due to the whole Ozil vs Arteta / Arsenal FC and the Covid stuff. But then it went back up in the 2021/22 season and has not wavered ever since..



Yea but there is difference between allowing failure and giving time to someone.Club should never allow losses to mount up ,because its slippery slope and can bring losing mentality.Biggest Wenger failure was allowing that mentality to build up and up.Players that keep losing in their career see that as something normal and its really difficult to change later on even with new manager etc.
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Re: Summer Transfer Window

Postby jayramfootball » Wed Jul 10, 2024 6:02 pm

Marsbar100 wrote:I just want us to have a really good window and go for it, if we don’t win but at least tried hard in the window at least we did all we could


I don't think the window is that relevant to our ambition.
We are already close and the plan was always to let a young team grow together and improve. It was spelled out clearly in 2021.
We also have Timber coming back.
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Re: Summer Transfer Window

Postby jayramfootball » Wed Jul 10, 2024 6:04 pm

firfi wrote:
Maiso wrote:
firfi wrote:Actually Arteta deserved to be sacked after that losing streak , but it just so happened to be a good decision to keep him.
Objectively speaking he showed that he didn't have the required experience to manage a club of that size at that stage of his career ,but hes improved alot since then and im glad they gave him time.Ultilately i don't think anyone should be sacked without viable replacement just to be sacked.This is what happened to Wenger he was sacked just to be sacked and we didn't have replacement lined up just happened to stumble on Emery and obviously we all know what happened.
Football is results business and sometimes u might be great at ur job ,but after poor run of form its better to change the manager.

He did not deserve to be sacked. I do feel like some of our fans were absolutely oblivious to the route the club had chosen by hiring a novice / rookie like Arteta back then. This was a long term tryout. They got burnt with the whole Emery saga and decided to go back to their comfort zone (Patience). They were always going to give him enough time to build his own squad and then see how he got on.

I think the disconnect between the fans that wanted him sacked at the end of 2020 and the 2021/22 season and the Club was that both had completely different visions / expectations for Arteta at that time. The club clearly were thinking LONG TERM (Wenger type of route) while the “Get rid of Arteta” fans were thinking “SHORT TERM” vision. Some fans had gotten brainwashed into the modern “HIRE and FIRE” at any slight discomfort culture.

The club hiring a novice, amateur, rookie and inexperienced Arteta clearly showed the direction they were willing to take (Long Haul / Long Term) while some of our fans did not realise it. They were in fully “Short Termism” mode.. That’s the disconnect I came to notice through it all..

If the club wanted the Short Term (Hire and Fire) approach then they would have gone for the likes of Mourinho, Ancelotti, Conte, Tuchel, Pochettino etc after they sacked Emery. But they went a completely different route by appointing a novice manager (Arteta). That should have been obvious enough to some fans as to what route the club had decided to go (Long term).

And the majority of the fans had clocked it back then. That’s why the ones calling for Arteta to be sacked have always been the minority. I think Arteta has had the vast majority of our fanbase (I would say about 80%) on his side from the moment he was hired. But it dropped to about 60% in 2020 due to the whole Ozil vs Arteta / Arsenal FC and the Covid stuff. But then it went back up in the 2021/22 season and has not wavered ever since..



Yea but there is difference between allowing failure and giving time to someone.Club should never allow losses to mount up ,because its slippery slope and can bring losing mentality.Biggest Wenger failure was allowing that mentality to build up and up.Players that keep losing in their career see that as something normal and its really difficult to change later on even with new manager etc.


I think most managers would have been sacked in Dec 2020 given the position Arteta had us in.
In truth, probably because he was new to management, he completely wasted that first year trying to get a tune out of a dead team. It was not until after 12 months that he actually started the doing the job he should have done the day he joined.
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Re: Summer Transfer Window

Postby Marsbar100 » Wed Jul 10, 2024 6:15 pm

jayramfootball wrote:
Marsbar100 wrote:I just want us to have a really good window and go for it, if we don’t win but at least tried hard in the window at least we did all we could


I don't think the window is that relevant to our ambition.
We are already close and the plan was always to let a young team grow together and improve. It was spelled out clearly in 2021.
We also have Timber coming back.

I still feel we need 3-4 real quality players
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Re: Summer Transfer Window

Postby ag6789 » Wed Jul 10, 2024 6:17 pm

What's the point in speculating extremes?
We have assembled a good team ready to challenge for PL and go far( ultimately win) the CL.
Probably need another quality midfielder, that's about it.
Only unfathomable are the injuries. If our critical players suffer injuries then all bets are of. Can't afford long term injuries to Saka, Saliba, Odegaard, Rice, etc. They are irreplaceable.
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Re: Summer Transfer Window

Postby jayramfootball » Wed Jul 10, 2024 6:28 pm

Marsbar100 wrote:
jayramfootball wrote:
Marsbar100 wrote:I just want us to have a really good window and go for it, if we don’t win but at least tried hard in the window at least we did all we could


I don't think the window is that relevant to our ambition.
We are already close and the plan was always to let a young team grow together and improve. It was spelled out clearly in 2021.
We also have Timber coming back.

I still feel we need 3-4 real quality players



No, don't think so - we have a squad full of quality players that are a fraction away as it stands.
We might lose some players and have to replace them.
TBH whatever we do in the window is fine. Edu and Arteta have earned the trust to get behind any decisions they make as long as we keep on this trajectory.
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Re: Summer Transfer Window

Postby Marsbar100 » Wed Jul 10, 2024 6:33 pm

jayramfootball wrote:
Marsbar100 wrote:
jayramfootball wrote:
Marsbar100 wrote:I just want us to have a really good window and go for it, if we don’t win but at least tried hard in the window at least we did all we could


I don't think the window is that relevant to our ambition.
We are already close and the plan was always to let a young team grow together and improve. It was spelled out clearly in 2021.
We also have Timber coming back.

I still feel we need 3-4 real quality players



No, don't think so - we have a squad full of quality players that are a fraction away as it stands.
WE might lose some players and have to replace them.

We need a cf to compete with havertz, jesus is injury prone and not clinical, Eddie isn’t trusted.

Dm needed, partey is brilliant but can’t be relied on.

A back up for ode, vieira and esr are either injury prone and not good enough.

A cb, we need a really good back up for Gabriel and saliba imo, I don’t really trust kiwor for that, white is class at rb, we don’t know how timber will be after his injury.

A good back up for Saka wouldn’t hurt either.
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Re: Summer Transfer Window

Postby swipe right » Wed Jul 10, 2024 6:41 pm

jayramfootball wrote:
Marsbar100 wrote:I just want us to have a really good window and go for it, if we don’t win but at least tried hard in the window at least we did all we could


I don't think the window is that relevant to our ambition.
We are already close and the plan was always to let a young team grow together and improve. It was spelled out clearly in 2021.
We also have Timber coming back.

Were you not a fan in the 2006-2014 timeframe? We built a young team and gave them time. Won nothing and every one of them was poached for small sums. They all ended up winning the league elsewhere. Why do we want to go through that again? Specially after spending hundreds of millions.
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Re: Summer Transfer Window

Postby alexafc12 » Wed Jul 10, 2024 8:02 pm

Zenith wrote:
TedLasso wrote:
Zenith wrote:
alexafc12 wrote:Nuno Tavares loan agreed

Obligation to buy for £6m

Has Edu ever sold a player he signed for a profit ?

If we ignore wages/inflation:

• Auston Trusty signed for £1.5, sold for £5m
• Matt Turner bought £5.7m, sold for £10m (incl. add-ons)
• Nuno Tavares bought for €8m, sold for roughly the same amount. (Small profit if we include the £1.5m loan fee we received from Forest.)

Unless I'm missing someone, that's about it.


I believe there's a sell on clause with Nuno's as well. Plus, the pure profit from Hutchinson's move to Ipswich in his sell on clause.

You're right! Biereth also has a sell-on clause if reports are to be believed. He joined on a free transfer from Fulham's academy back in 2021 and was recently sold for £4m (incl. add-ons).


Turner and Trusty then.

Counting academy players is clutching at straws too especially in the case of Hutchinson who was already at the club , both sold way below their market value.

£700m spent
£8m profit

Good lord.
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