2023/24 Premier League Arsenal Season

Discuss anything Arsenal-related. Tune in to get the latest news, and discuss results, performances, tactics, etc.

Re: 2023/24 Premier League Arsenal Season

Postby Nuggets » Sat May 11, 2024 8:06 am

VCC wrote:1-1 my guess


That will do for me :arse fan:
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Re: 2023/24 Premier League Arsenal Season

Postby ag6789 » Sun May 12, 2024 5:50 pm

86 pts( so far) is third highest for us in the PL era. Great run in the 2nd half of the season. Looks like Fulham screw up, controversial losses at Geordies and Villa( first one) might come to bite us.
Margin is so thin w/ this machine like City. Seems unreal how other teams just bend over and let themselves bulldozed.
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Re: 2023/24 Premier League Arsenal Season

Postby alexis2015finalgoal » Tue May 14, 2024 5:27 pm

[tweet]https://x.com/M10/status/1790316622705545375[/tweet]
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Re: 2023/24 Premier League Arsenal Season

Postby Nuggets » Tue May 14, 2024 5:56 pm

It could be all over tonight :hiding:
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Re: 2023/24 Premier League Arsenal Season

Postby alexis2015finalgoal » Tue May 14, 2024 6:05 pm

slim chance of winning the league.

only have ourselves to blame if we don't.

Home games against Fulham, West Ham, Villa and Spurs cost us.
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Re: 2023/24 Premier League Arsenal Season

Postby ag6789 » Tue May 14, 2024 8:52 pm

Looks like have to start fresh again in August.
This one is done and dusted. Spuds fell flat.
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Re: 2023/24 Premier League Arsenal Season

Postby theHotHead » Tue May 14, 2024 8:53 pm

Dammit!!

Looking good if a little fortunate at half time. Now we hope for a West Ham miracle!
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Re: 2023/24 Premier League Arsenal Season

Postby Roycck » Tue May 14, 2024 9:03 pm

Season is over. I look forward to the transfers with much more excitement than the last game.
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Re: 2023/24 Premier League Arsenal Season

Postby alexis2015finalgoal » Tue May 14, 2024 9:05 pm

Title's gone.

Spurs were more lively than one might have expected.

An exceedingly big long shot that West Ham beat Man City at the Etihad.
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Re: 2023/24 Premier League Arsenal Season

Postby Salibatelli » Tue May 14, 2024 9:08 pm

If Arteta doesn’t win the title this season, he’s never winning the title with us.

Think this will be a body blow and there will be doubts that we can get over the line.

Would be several seasons of failing to achieve the goal.
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Re: 2023/24 Premier League Arsenal Season

Postby alexis2015finalgoal » Tue May 14, 2024 9:10 pm

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Chances of West Ham drawing or beating City are slim!
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Re: 2023/24 Premier League Arsenal Season

Postby StockGooner » Tue May 14, 2024 9:52 pm

Jurgen Klopp seasons in charge, compared to Arteta's

8th - 60 points - 21 points behind winners
4th - 76 points - 17 points behind winners
4th - 75 points - 25 points behind winners
2nd - 97 points - 1 point behind winners - Champions League Winners
1st - 99 points - 18 points ahead of 2nd
3rd - 69 points - 17 points behind winners
2nd - 92 points - 1 point behind winners
5th - 67 points - 22 points behind winners

8th - 56 points - 43 points behind winners
8th - 61 points - 25 points behind winners
5th - 69 points - 24 points behind winners
2nd - 84 points - 5 points behind winners
2nd/1st - 86-89 points - 2-5 points behind winners or Winners

Agree or disagree on certain elements of his management, but I don't see how anyone could say wiht almost certainty he won't win the title with us? Or that it's multiple seasons of failing to achieve the goal.

What exactly was the goal for us? Was it Champions League football? Was it a title challenge? Or was it a title and anything less is failure?

I personally would say his second and third seasons were failures without a doubt. Compared to Klopp's 2nd season, 4 places and 16 points is a lot but Klopp was a better manager on day one of his job than Arteta was. Arteta's 2nd full season was also a failure, throwing 4th place away with losses to Tottenham and Newcastle.

But since then, we had a title challenge where quite frankly we threw the opportunity away badly, naively. This year has been more sustained and solid, but we're losing the title through one, just one bad result across a season. We have to be near perfect to win the title, and we havent been, but we're getting closer and closer. What can there be to suggest we won't win a title?
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Re: 2023/24 Premier League Arsenal Season

Postby Salibatelli » Tue May 14, 2024 10:06 pm

Easy, he never gets us over the line.

SL semis, Emery beat him.
Top 4 battle blew it and came 5th
Clear at the top, blew it and came 2nd
Top and in control of our destiny, lose at home to Villa.

This season we’ve had everything going our way too, long breaks and rest, vert few injuries, whilst rivals had loads, we’ve also faced teams at the right times when they have a huge list of players out and recently had a fair few decisions go our way.

Next season no winter break and Arteta doesn’t do so well when he doesn’t get those long breaks.

In the end he’s a manager that never gets over the line, do it often enough and it becomes a chain round your neck.

I think he’s one of those managers who doesn’t have in him to win, in many ways we’ve seen it in our overall performance, in others words all competitions.

Klopp had won before, was taking Liverpool to finals and won the CL. He had proved he could win, but I will say he also has a reputation for not quite getting over the line much of the time and that’s what happened at Liverpool.

Compare that to the likes of Ancelotti or Mourinho in his prime, those guys win all the time.

I think Arteta has taken the team as far as he can now, he’s had the perfect conditions for success in his 4 1/2 years, you couldn’t ask for a more perfect environment and yet his tale is one of failure so far.

People will say he’s challenged and come 2nd twice, trouble is 2nd doesn’t get you any medals and ultimately it failure just as it was in the early days of Wenger, we were never happy when we came 2nd.

Thing is Wenger delivered a title quickly against the juggernaut that was Man U, he didn’t have to make excuses that he couldn’t win because Man U were so good and he carried on pushing them year after year and won more titles, that is truly competing, not coming 2nd all the time.
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Re: 2023/24 Premier League Arsenal Season

Postby StockGooner » Tue May 14, 2024 10:50 pm

Never gets us over the line suggests it is a repeating cycle or pattern. I would say he's soon going to have had three seasons where we could make judgement on performance, and I don't think a sample of three is enough to call something a pattern.

The 5th place finish and last season could arguably be 'not getting us over the line' I will agree there. But this season isn't that at all. We've sustained a title challenge through to the final day against a City team who have possibly one of the greatest league coaches of all time, backed by a bottomless pit of money when they want a player. Last year, were ANY of us expecting a title challenge? I would suggest no, so we can't move goalposts entirely. I will allow us to be disappointed we didn't win it based on where we were going into Matchday 28, since I myself was disappointed/devastated. So yes we couldn't get over the line, but realistically we couldn't see that line on Matchday 1 so to say it's 'not getting us over the line' would be to ignore our original expectations.

You make so many excuses for us when we do well, repeatedly. We've had injured players this year as well, all teams have, so I'm not having that and tbh I'm not even going into it since it's a silly argument.

Arteta is 4 and a half years into management. You say 'he's a manager that never gets it over the line' but equally 'he's a manager that sustained two title challenges and is getting closer to winning it'. You're not right, neither is the other sentiment, but you're so damn certain he's failing whereas the other statement allows flexibility which is why when you're wrong you never admit to it since you're so staunch in your stance. What were you expecting 4 years ago exactly? If you say a title and anything less is failure, then I don't really know what to say back.

Personally, I would have said 4 years ago I would like us competing for big name signings, back in the Champions League, a comfortable 3rd position, vying for 2nd and withing touching distance of (Inevitably) Manchester City and not being embarassed in games against the top 6 like we used to. We got into the Champions League a year too late for my liking, but two title challenges has kept me happy, albeit disappointed last year.

I like your argument on Wenger, I think it's really telling. I would say Wenger came in with a philosophy so alien to English football that it really took the league and United by surprise. You had new science, nutrition, young energetic players in Vieira and extending the legs of the back four another year or two. That Unique Selling Point that Wenger had, was eventually caught up by every team as they saw the impact and then eventually the league came into money. Very few teams now can find that niche. Klopp had the Gegenpress which is good for a season or two then it shows. Mourinho seemed to push and push his teams and treat certain players terribly, then it would all come crashing down one season, hence the repeated sackings. Brighton have a great scouting network, but they are eternally a selling club. Barcelona can maybe say they have La Masia, but these are all few and far between. Arteta might not have that individualistic item that he can say is his defining characteristic like Wenger did, but not everyone does.

Also, we also forget that in the years following 1997/98 we lost the league title by 1 point, then 18 and then by 10. So if last year was a failure for Arteta what was finishing 2nd 18 points behind the winner?
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Re: 2023/24 Premier League Arsenal Season

Postby UFGN » Tue May 14, 2024 11:13 pm

And all of the above while shitting our cup runs out like a bad curry.

Is is a mehnager rather than a manager
Corinthians 15:57; But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus

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