Arteta Out

[ag6789]

Arsenal can't be compared w/Villa or West Ham. Their objective is to stay up in the PL whereas Arsenal has been a winning club.
So the outlooks will always be different even when we are in doldrums . 'pool went through this phase , but their objective was always winning things.
Besides, West Ham and Villa have always been developing players who make a name elsewhere. Grealish and Rice are only a few who have stayed on for a while, whereas there have plenty others who've left for better things

[Hypergooner]

We need to rebuild/ refresh every 2-3 years because players grow older, get injured, lose form. The best option is build from within ,i.e, have a strong supply line from the Academy. Otherwise, have to face the risk of being duped by super agents and buy average players at exorbitant prices ( Partey, Pepe).
There are only handful of quality players available at a time, and they'll be quickly cornered by mega rich clubs, all others would be mediocres hyped up by their agents.
So pick your poison...I would trust the academy and be a bit patient.

A strong academy supply line only works if you have quality experience pros to be mixed with and to learn from. Otherwise you become a feeder club.
It's really quite simple. Football is nothing but a sped up version of the real world (with eyes constantly on it). This is because it's played and managed by people!

When I started my apprenticeship, I was taught by 20 year men who knew the tricks, had pride in their work and served their time.
(George Graham Arsenal)

I developed, had more enthusiasm for the work and took over as the old guard retired and moved on
(Wenger first 10 years)

New apprentices came in, had a modern attitude and were more interested in social media and were less patient with changes. Banking crisis stripped the perks of the business away), quality of engineers dropped in the business
(Wenger last 10 years)

I got fed up and felt things weren't like they used to be and left for new challenges to better myself
(Invincibles)

The business along with most others in my industry now struggle for quality staff and struggle to keep the good ones they have. The quality ones that are left have their pick of companies and can charge a lot for their time. Any quality young engineer sees the high wages and perks elsewhere and moves on every 2 - 4 years.
(Modern day in the prem)

[theHotHead]

We def have worse players now... we're spending crazy amounts on average players.

Worse than Mustafi, Sokratis, Iwobi and Welbeck? That team made 5th place barely 2 years ago.

The current administration are making Emerys’ 5th place (should have got 4th) like some sort of miracle, I mean we have a much better squad and are forever stuck in midtable and never anywhere near 4th.

We spent 160 million on the summer, I think it was poorly spent, not because we signed players who aren’t any good but because we really should have signed some world class players as well, these young players may or may not make it but they’re not ready now.

The one that bugs me the most of the 50 million on White, he’s clearly not worth that and we could have used that money so much more wisely, especially given we had 2 decent CBS we could have brought back in who were on loan.

I’d have chosen Aouar over Odegaard as well, he was cheaper but also we had Odegaard last season and he didn’t really impress much.

He may come good under a different manager and I hope he does but he’s not just not done enough since he arrived here. We had a bit of that with Ceballos, luckily he didn’t want to stay any longer and we sent him back.

Bang on! We didn't need wholesale changes and especially not all young players for the future. This building for the future we won't get really bugs me. We were within touching distance of building for the now when Wenger left! We only needed to organise at the back and buy a world class winger and CM.
Now we look miles off top 4 and £160m down

Exactly, we didn't need wholesale changes. When Emery came in and bought Leno, Sokratis, Torreira and Guendouzi I was thinking "at last, someone has identified our problem nd has come to solve them straight off the bat". Little did I know Emery would go off script and decide defending wasn't important - and give us an even worse defence. Its been a succession of abject failure ever since. We were not far away to begin with.

[ag6789]

The Wenger players were getting old and new blood was needed. But we bought poorly during the chaotic Raul/Mislinstat era and ended up with an hodgepodge we are still trying to sort through.

[Hypergooner]

The Wenger players were getting old and new blood was needed. But we bought poorly during the chaotic Raul/Mislinstat era and ended up with an hodgepodge we are still trying to sort through.

Such a common mistake in my opinion. When a formula works, why change it for changing sake!

If Wenger had replaced the invincibles gradually, like for like, we could have stayed at the top. Fergie always kept the same formula and didn't stop winning. We went weak and technical in CM, lost our pace on the wing and ended up a mess

[Highbury Hillbilly]

The Wenger players were getting old and new blood was needed. But we bought poorly during the chaotic Raul/Mislinstat era and ended up with an hodgepodge we are still trying to sort through.

Such a common mistake in my opinion. When a formula works, why change it for changing sake!

If Wenger had replaced the invincibles gradually, like for like, we could have stayed at the top. Fergie always kept the same formula and didn't stop winning. We went weak and technical in CM, lost our pace on the wing and ended up a mess

It doesn't work like that. Players you want aren't always available when you want them. The new stadium killed any flexibility we had financially.

Also, many Utd fans hold Fergie responsible for not revamping the 2008 CL winning squad fast enough, which ultimately cost them when he retired. Players like Vidic, Rio, Evra, Ronaldo, Tevez, Giggs and Carrick needed to be replaced, but were not, and most were still around when Moyes arrived.

[jayramfootball]

We def have worse players now... we're spending crazy amounts on average players.

Worse than Mustafi, Sokratis, Iwobi and Welbeck? That team made 5th place barely 2 years ago.

The current administration are making Emerys’ 5th place (should have got 4th) like some sort of miracle, I mean we have a much better squad and are forever stuck in midtable and never anywhere near 4th.

We spent 160 million on the summer, I think it was poorly spent, not because we signed players who aren’t any good but because we really should have signed some world class players as well, these young players may or may not make it but they’re not ready now.

The one that bugs me the most of the 50 million on White, he’s clearly not worth that and we could have used that money so much more wisely, especially given we had 2 decent CBS we could have brought back in who were on loan.

I’d have chosen Aouar over Odegaard as well, he was cheaper but also we had Odegaard last season and he didn’t really impress much.

He may come good under a different manager and I hope he does but he’s not just not done enough since he arrived here. We had a bit of that with Ceballos, luckily he didn’t want to stay any longer and we sent him back.

Bang on! We didn't need wholesale changes and especially not all young players for the future. This building for the future we won't get really bugs me. We were within touching distance of building for the now when Wenger left! We only needed to organise at the back and buy a world class winger and CM.
Now we look miles off top 4 and £160m down

Exactly, we didn't need wholesale changes. When Emery came in and bought Leno, Sokratis, Torreira and Guendouzi I was thinking "at last, someone has identified our problem nd has come to solve them straight off the bat". Little did I know Emery would go off script and decide defending wasn't important - and give us an even worse defence. Its been a succession of abject failure ever since. We were not far away to begin with.

JHC. Those players you listed you think are top 4 quality? Get away with you.

The ONLY route we had was to make wholesale changes and we still have a lot more to do.

[DiamondGooner]

The Wenger players were getting old and new blood was needed. But we bought poorly during the chaotic Raul/Mislinstat era and ended up with an hodgepodge we are still trying to sort through.

Such a common mistake in my opinion. When a formula works, why change it for changing sake!

If Wenger had replaced the invincibles gradually, like for like, we could have stayed at the top. Fergie always kept the same formula and didn't stop winning. We went weak and technical in CM, lost our pace on the wing and ended up a mess

Your missing out one detail.

The reason we didn't replace the Invincibles was for a number of reasons.

1 - We built the new stadium and the club stated we were cash strapped, Wenger also took this as an opportunity to become the clubs new accountant and became possessed with not splashing money.

2 - He supplementented not over spending by training up youths and introducing going from a 4-4-2 / 4-4-1-1 as in Bergkamps day to a 5 man midfield of 4-5-1 where he envisaged we could play Barca-lite keepy ball and so wouldn't have to buy the power house expensive players like Utd were doing which cost a bomb.

That is why we completely changed from the Invincibles 4-4-2 to the Denilson, Fabregas, Song, Wilshere era of 4-5-1.
Wenger looked for cheap players who had high technical ability, relative unknowns like Rosicky, Cazorla, Hleb etc but these players had tekkers and when they were all in the same starting 11 those combined tekkers looked great on a lot of occasions tbf.

[VCC]

The Wenger players were getting old and new blood was needed. But we bought poorly during the chaotic Raul/Mislinstat era and ended up with an hodgepodge we are still trying to sort through.

Such a common mistake in my opinion. When a formula works, why change it for changing sake!

If Wenger had replaced the invincibles gradually, like for like, we could have stayed at the top. Fergie always kept the same formula and didn't stop winning. We went weak and technical in CM, lost our pace on the wing and ended up a mess

Your missing out one detail.

The reason we didn't replace the Invincibles was for a number of reasons.

1 - We built the new stadium and the club stated we were cash strapped, Wenger also took this as an opportunity to become the clubs new accountant and became possessed with not splashing money.

2 - He supplementented not over spending by training up youths and introducing going from a 4-4-2 / 4-4-1-1 as in Bergkamps day to a 5 man midfield of 4-5-1 where he envisaged we could play Barca-lite keepy ball and so wouldn't have to buy the power house expensive players like Utd were doing which cost a bomb.

That is why we completely changed from the Invincibles 4-4-2 to the Denilson, Fabregas, Song, Wilshere era of 4-5-1.
Wenger looked for cheap players who had high technical ability, relative unknowns like Rosicky, Cazorla, Hleb etc but these players had tekkers and when they were all in the same starting 11 those combined tekkers looked great on a lot of occasions tbf.

I think had Ferguson had Arsenal with the same players as AW they would have been more successful.
Fergy would never had accepted the selling of his best assets
Fergy would would never had accepted some of the performances AW did over his years, jesus he definitely would never had accepted the Diaby fiasco.
At one time AW had Walcott Sanchez ox rvp I doubt fergy would have played tippy tappy with that pace.

[Hypergooner]

The Wenger players were getting old and new blood was needed. But we bought poorly during the chaotic Raul/Mislinstat era and ended up with an hodgepodge we are still trying to sort through.

Such a common mistake in my opinion. When a formula works, why change it for changing sake!

If Wenger had replaced the invincibles gradually, like for like, we could have stayed at the top. Fergie always kept the same formula and didn't stop winning. We went weak and technical in CM, lost our pace on the wing and ended up a mess

Your missing out one detail.

The reason we didn't replace the Invincibles was for a number of reasons.

1 - We built the new stadium and the club stated we were cash strapped, Wenger also took this as an opportunity to become the clubs new accountant and became possessed with not splashing money.

2 - He supplementented not over spending by training up youths and introducing going from a 4-4-2 / 4-4-1-1 as in Bergkamps day to a 5 man midfield of 4-5-1 where he envisaged we could play Barca-lite keepy ball and so wouldn't have to buy the power house expensive players like Utd were doing which cost a bomb.

That is why we completely changed from the Invincibles 4-4-2 to the Denilson, Fabregas, Song, Wilshere era of 4-5-1.
Wenger looked for cheap players who had high technical ability, relative unknowns like Rosicky, Cazorla, Hleb etc but these players had tekkers and when they were all in the same starting 11 those combined tekkers looked great on a lot of occasions tbf.

We didn't have the money to buy world class players but could have bought bigger stronger players in key positions and kept the same structure. It was just that Wenger marveled at what Barca was doing and wanted to be like them.
Remember pundits kept going on about lack of leaders. We were crying out for a big strong box to box CM to play next to Fabregas. Didn't need to be technical, just hard in a tackle and have desire to win. Every professional can pass 5 yards to Fabregas to create things

[Arsenal Tone]

100% agree with hyper's comments in this thread

[swipe right]

Saliba and Guendozi both in Ligue 1 team of the week.

[jayramfootball]

Saliba and Guendozi both in Ligue 1 team of the week.

https://twitter.com/SkyBetChamp/status/ ... elected%2F


Skybet Championship team of the week.
We should go shopping.

[Salibatelli]

Saliba and Guendozi both in Ligue 1 team of the week.

Another solid display by them. Clearly both performing very well as they’re in and around things like this regularly (particularly Saliba).

[swipe right]

Saliba and Guendozi both in Ligue 1 team of the week.

https://twitter.com/SkyBetChamp/status/ ... elected%2F


Skybet Championship team of the week.
We should go shopping.

If 11th is top four form, is 12th top five form? People want to know.