Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby theHotHead » Sat May 08, 2021 10:30 pm

Slick wrote:If Arsenal were to move on from Arteta at the end of this season, I’d bet any new manager coming in would take one look at this squad and realize that to get where you’re competing for PL titles and European football, half of these guys have got to go.

Most of these veteran players best days are long behind them. Frankly, Arteta should have been playing even more of the young players. Especially after those veterans shat the bed for two months this winter. That was the time to go full youth movement. He kind of half assed it.

I guess I’m in the minority here but I agree with Jay’s points.

Thats NOT what ANY of us are saying. Nobody ever said this lot could win league titles or the CL. We said we are much better than the crock of shit we are seeing, we are saying we are much better than midtable.
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby Godlop » Sat May 08, 2021 10:34 pm

This constant "the squad needs changes and investments" talk will surely motivate the current players.
These are Just excuses from Arteta and Edu for their failures.
Let's be real the current squad is largely build by new signings made by Arteta and Edu and players Arteta decided to keep despite offers from other clubs.

Just take the 0:0 against Villareal as an example.

Leno - Arteta decided to keep Leno over Martinez --> Arteta player
Bellerin - Arteta convinced Bellerin to stay for another season --> Arteta player
Holding - Arteta told Holding he won't be allowed to leave --> Arteta player
Mari - bought by Arteta and Edu --> Arteta player
Tierney - not bought by Arteta
Partey - bought by Arteta and Edu --> Arteta player
Pepe - not bought by Arteta
Rowe - not bought by Arteta
Odegaard - loaned by Arteta and Edu --> Arteta player
Saka - not bought by Arteta
Auba - Arteta pushed very hard to keep Auba --> Arteta player


So from the 11 players that started in our most important match of the season 7 players were basically Arteta players.
Weirdly the non-Arteta players are the ones I would consider our best.

So much for the "he needs more investments and time" crap. I was a big Arteta fan last season, but he has been utter shit this season and it's time to accept this.
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby Slick » Sat May 08, 2021 10:53 pm

theHotHead wrote:
Slick wrote:If Arsenal were to move on from Arteta at the end of this season, I’d bet any new manager coming in would take one look at this squad and realize that to get where you’re competing for PL titles and European football, half of these guys have got to go.

Most of these veteran players best days are long behind them. Frankly, Arteta should have been playing even more of the young players. Especially after those veterans shat the bed for two months this winter. That was the time to go full youth movement. He kind of half assed it.

I guess I’m in the minority here but I agree with Jay’s points.

Thats NOT what ANY of us are saying. Nobody ever said this lot could win league titles or the CL. We said we are much better than the crock of shit we are seeing, we are saying we are much better than midtable.


I’m not trying to put words in your mouth but I also don’t look at that squad and see “much better than mid table”.

I just happen to agree with Jay in that the squad needs a massive overhaul and it’s going to take a while to get there.

Arteta is skating on the thinnest of ice IMO. I’m not sure I’d trust him to be the one to do it.
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby jayramfootball » Sun May 09, 2021 12:36 am

Godlop wrote:This constant "the squad needs changes and investments" talk will surely motivate the current players.
These are Just excuses from Arteta and Edu for their failures.
Let's be real the current squad is largely build by new signings made by Arteta and Edu and players Arteta decided to keep despite offers from other clubs.

Just take the 0:0 against Villareal as an example.

Leno - Arteta decided to keep Leno over Martinez --> Arteta player
Bellerin - Arteta convinced Bellerin to stay for another season --> Arteta player
Holding - Arteta told Holding he won't be allowed to leave --> Arteta player
Mari - bought by Arteta and Edu --> Arteta player
Tierney - not bought by Arteta
Partey - bought by Arteta and Edu --> Arteta player
Pepe - not bought by Arteta
Rowe - not bought by Arteta
Odegaard - loaned by Arteta and Edu --> Arteta player
Saka - not bought by Arteta
Auba - Arteta pushed very hard to keep Auba --> Arteta player


So from the 11 players that started in our most important match of the season 7 players were basically Arteta players.
Weirdly the non-Arteta players are the ones I would consider our best.

So much for the "he needs more investments and time" crap. I was a big Arteta fan last season, but he has been utter shit this season and it's time to accept this.


Being too afraid to change the team from top to bottom does not make the players Arteta players.
I mean seriously, players that were signed under Wenger are now Arteta players????

Your rationale above is basically..."right , I hate Arteta... so how can I word this to make the decent players not his and the disappointments all his"

We know that many of these players need to be moved on.
Does he know that?
Time will tell.
Certainly, he's made mistakes already - like Auba, Bellerin, Leno.
We'll see if he gets the chance to learn from those mistakes.
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby DiamondGooner » Sun May 09, 2021 12:40 am

Paddy wrote:Another chelsea win against City

Tuchel doing bits

Us :rofll:


............ and when I said we should of got Tuchel, I was told "Nah he's not that great, don't rate him".

I know a good manager when I see one.

Completely turned Chelsea's entire season around, WITH THE SAME group of players,
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby jayramfootball » Sun May 09, 2021 1:02 am

DiamondGooner wrote:
Paddy wrote:Another chelsea win against City

Tuchel doing bits

Us :rofll:


............ and when I said we should of got Tuchel, I was told "Nah he's not that great, don't rate him".

I know a good manager when I see one.

Completely turned Chelsea's entire season around, WITH THE SAME group of players,


When a team has a run of form it doesn't mean the manager is genius.
Let's not forget Chelsea were slaughtered by WBA and drew with Brighton recently.
Suggest you wait a little longer.

Emery went 20 games unbeaten at Arsenal.
Want him back?
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby Ach » Sun May 09, 2021 2:02 am

DiamondGooner wrote:
Paddy wrote:Another chelsea win against City

Tuchel doing bits

Us :rofll:


............ and when I said we should of got Tuchel, I was told "Nah he's not that great, don't rate him".

I know a good manager when I see one.

Completely turned Chelsea's entire season around, WITH THE SAME group of players,
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby swipe right » Sun May 09, 2021 2:34 am

Poor chap thinks he’s at city where the owners will drop 200 mil just on the defense. His job is to coach the players we have, not scout the ones we don’t. Wasn’t he brought in on the reputation of being a top coach? We were told Raheem Sterling owed his career to Arteta. Not by the looks of it.
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby Nuggets » Sun May 09, 2021 5:32 am

jayramfootball wrote:
DiamondGooner wrote:
Paddy wrote:Another chelsea win against City

Tuchel doing bits

Us :rofll:


............ and when I said we should of got Tuchel, I was told "Nah he's not that great, don't rate him".

I know a good manager when I see one.

Completely turned Chelsea's entire season around, WITH THE SAME group of players,


When a team has a run of form it doesn't mean the manager is genius.
Let's not forget Chelsea were slaughtered by WBA and drew with Brighton recently.
Suggest you wait a little longer.

Emery went 20 games unbeaten at Arsenal.
Want him back?


He is a better manager than the clown we have now.
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby Salibatelli » Sun May 09, 2021 6:13 am

jayramfootball wrote:
ag6789 wrote:I agree to Arteta's shortcomings but the players and recruiters have to share the blame for the disastrous season we are having.
What I wonder is why we couldn't get a run going even when we beat some good teams convincingly. Why the senior players couldn't keep their focus and kept making silliest of mistakes time and again? Is it the coaches fault entirely when seasoned professionals make repeatedly poor decisions and do they have to be babysitted at every occasion they take the field?
Is it the current culture of Arsenal club to be laid back and enjoy the hospitality? The way Xhakha, Luiz, Willian, Auba, Ozil have carried themselves, it seems there's little accountability nowadays, and a novice coach like Arteta was out of his depth trying to deal w/them.


It's really quite amazing that ANYONE would disagree that the players have played a role - and a huge role - in our form this year.
The people who actually play the damn games.
I think too many fans have played too much Fifa.


If we break it down Arteta either signed or decided he rated these players:

Leno, he chose him over Martinez
Holding, he signed him up on a new contract
Luiz he chose to renew his contract
Mari he signed him
Bellerin he played week in week out for months so clearly trusted
Soares he signed
Partey he signed
Odergaard he signed
Xhaka he kept and has played in almost every game
Gabriel he signed
Aubameyang he chose to sign up on a new contract again.

The above were all choices he made, no one forced him to, so he’s responsible for these players and their performances as he chose to use them.


Martinelli he hardly plays
Saliba he shipped out without giving him a chance
Mavropanos he shipped out on loan
Nelson he won’t play

ESR up until he stumbled across him at Christmas and he performed he would t play at all.

Then there’s the style of play, playing out from the back doesn’t suit the players which is clear, he’s also had Lacazette chasing back making him less effective.

There’s also Pepe that he has kept chopping and changing.

At some point he has to be responsible, yes players make mistakes but he picks them regardless and chose them over others in the 1st place, this is by in large his team.

A better manager wouldn’t have made these poor choices, if a manager can’t do better with this amount of input and control then clearly he’s not up to the job, his decisions (and he’s had a lot of input in the squad) have had a big impact on our season, the players don’t sign or pick themselves therefore ultimately Arteta is responsible.

His job is to put a team together and get them to perform by making sure they’re the right players, the system suits them and he picks the right blend, he’s failed in on all scores.

Let’s not forget Emery got 5th with an inferior group and a lot less backing of players, so to say a better manager can’t do a lot better than midtable is off the mark. Ok f Arteta wants a whole new squad to do better than midtable he better find a club like Chelsea or Liverpool to give him a job, trouble is they’d never consider him, and even if they had he’d have been sacked for his lack of success.
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby KG3 » Sun May 09, 2021 9:04 am

If Arteta isn’t sacked this season after going trophy-less and failing to finish top 6, then you have to wonder what would it take get him sacked and just how low our standards now?

Because even teams like Everton and Spurs these days would sack managers for less
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby Arsenal Tone » Sun May 09, 2021 10:02 am

KG3 wrote:If Arteta isn’t sacked this season after going trophy-less and failing to finish top 6, then you have to wonder what would it take get him sacked and just how low our standards now?

Because even teams like Everton and Spurs these days would sack managers for less
I think they had a clearout in January when they realised the squad wasn't good enough and wrote the season off. Don't think they even expected the europa league run. There will have been a plan when ozil, mustafi, kolasinac and co left and I think Arteta will be given the summer to finish that job. But if we're way off the pace in November I expect him to suffer the same fate as Emery. I don't expect him to go anywhere before then.

Jut my opinion, could be wrong, but this is what I think. January was massive for offloading deadwood and making room for summer signings.
Raya/Ramsdale
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???/Jorginho
Odegaard/Smith Rowe----Rice/???
Saka/Jesus-------------------Martinelli/Trossard
???/Havertz
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby Goonerred » Sun May 09, 2021 10:30 am

Tony Adams wrote:
KG3 wrote:If Arteta isn’t sacked this season after going trophy-less and failing to finish top 6, then you have to wonder what would it take get him sacked and just how low our standards now?

Because even teams like Everton and Spurs these days would sack managers for less
I think they had a clearout in January when they realised the squad wasn't good enough and wrote the season off. Don't think they even expected the europa league run. There will have been a plan when ozil, mustafi, kolasinac and co left and I think Arteta will be given the summer to finish that job. But if we're way off the pace in November I expect him to suffer the same fate as Emery. I don't expect him to go anywhere before then.

Jut my opinion, could be wrong, but this is what I think. January was massive for offloading deadwood and making room for summer signings.

That could make some sense. He's still signed and kept players that we would have not wanted, but he can't get rid of them all in one go. We need to see a lot of activity in the summer transfer window to see if this is the case.
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby Highbury Hillbilly » Sun May 09, 2021 1:29 pm

jayramfootball wrote:
When a team has a run of form it doesn't mean the manager is genius.
Let's not forget Chelsea were slaughtered by WBA and drew with Brighton recently.
Suggest you wait a little longer.

Emery went 20 games unbeaten at Arsenal.
Want him back?


You can have a run like Tuchel has had, and lose to WBA embarrassingly AND still come out as a major net improvement.

Emery's 22 games unbeaten run was crucial in terms of figuring out what our strongest XI was. We stuck to a front line of Auba, Laca and Iwobi for the rest of the season, resulting in 73 league goals. It ultimately also kept us in European places, given that our league form collapsed after injuries to Holding, Bellerin and Ramsey.

The complete lack of any kind of momentum under Arteta means he chopped and changed the formations and squads constantly all season. Unsurprisingly we haven't even scored 50 league goals yet. We never had a points buffer to help us deal with a bad run of form, which is why we're 11th in the table and heading lower.
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Re: Mikel Arteta, First-Team Manager

Postby jayramfootball » Sun May 09, 2021 2:39 pm

aniym wrote:
jayramfootball wrote:
When a team has a run of form it doesn't mean the manager is genius.
Let's not forget Chelsea were slaughtered by WBA and drew with Brighton recently.
Suggest you wait a little longer.

Emery went 20 games unbeaten at Arsenal.
Want him back?


You can have a run like Tuchel has had, and lose to WBA embarrassingly AND still come out as a major net improvement.

Emery's 22 games unbeaten run was crucial in terms of figuring out what our strongest XI was. We stuck to a front line of Auba, Laca and Iwobi for the rest of the season, resulting in 73 league goals. It ultimately also kept us in European places, given that our league form collapsed after injuries to Holding, Bellerin and Ramsey.

The complete lack of any kind of momentum under Arteta means he chopped and changed the formations and squads constantly all season. Unsurprisingly we haven't even scored 50 league goals yet. We never had a points buffer to help us deal with a bad run of form, which is why we're 11th in the table and heading lower.


We had momentum under Arteta last season, I believe it was 15 wins, 6 draws and 5 losses over 26 matches, including an FA Cup win.
Is anyone going to deny we went into the season this year in high spirits?
Didn't take long for people to think Arteta was the worst manager that ever lived.

I doubt Tuchel will last more than a couple of seasons, but we'll see. Way too early to tell.
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