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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby theHotHead » Fri Jan 11, 2019 8:51 am

Goonerz wrote:
theHotHead wrote:
Goonerz wrote:
aniym wrote:
Power n Glory wrote:We really have to stop dealing in hypotheticals with this Ozil debate. I still can't understand why he isn't getting more assists for Lacazette and Aubameyang. I always thought he'd flourish once we had taken Giroud out of the starting line and put pacey strikers up front.


Majority of Ozil assists in his best ever season for us came from passes to Giroud.

It’s a myth about how Ozil would destroy the assist record if he was in the City team with Aguero.
The guy had one of the greatest players / goal machine to ever grace the world of football (C.Ronaldo), he also had the likes of Bezema and Higuain etc. But I cannot recall him ever hitting 19 or 20 assists in the La Liga. But he had 19 assist with the so called donkey / lamppost Giroud in the EPL. And most of those assists were from free kicks and corners that were always very dependent on the likes of Giroud or our defenders convert. They were 50/50 chances and the moment the luck ran out it all dried up.

You clown!! In his 3 seasons at Real he got 19, 19 and 16 assists in La Liga

Ozil has never gotten 19 assists a season in la liga.
That is why 19 assists at Arsenal is the best assist season he has ever had in a league season.

His best was 17 assists in 2010/11 and then again 17 assists in 2011/12.

I don’t know what dodgy sites you are getting your information from.
Smh

Transfermarkt.com. I use it for 95% of my stats and its pretty much spot on. Looks like they may not be in this instance
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby Sims » Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:08 am

Assists on Transfrmarkt are dodgy and unreliable
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby Power n Glory » Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:37 am

Anyone know a good Android app for checking stats?
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby Power n Glory » Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:42 am

Anyone know a good Android app for checking stats?
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby Byron Gomez » Fri Jan 11, 2019 2:51 pm

Flat track bully
"I've play against him, what? 12, 15, 18 times? , I dunno". "And only once he didn't moan and on that day we lost!" - Jose Mourinho
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby theHotHead » Fri Jan 11, 2019 3:22 pm

Byron Gomez wrote:Flat track bully

Well thats a load of old cobblers !! Flat track bully ? Lets see. I just looked at the breakdown of all of Ozil's league goals and assists and split them between the so-called top 6 (Man U, Man City, Liverpool, Spurs, Chelsea) and the rest of the league. the breakdown is as follows:

Goals/assists v top 6 - 16.
Goals/assists v rest - 70.

Doing some basic maths, 10 games are played against so-called top 6 teams in a season (26% of games) and 28 against the rest (74% of games)
Ozil has therefore scored or assisted 19% against top 6 sides and 81% against the rest. Considering it should be harder to score against top 6 sides it is clear that Ozil's numbers are almost spot on for what you would expect. A flat track bully would surely have his numbers skewed far more than they are.

For a comparison I'll do Eden Hazard and David Silva.
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby Dynamite » Fri Jan 11, 2019 3:23 pm

Sims wrote:Assists on Transfrmarkt are dodgy and unreliable


Based on what?
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby Sims » Fri Jan 11, 2019 3:31 pm

Dynamite wrote:
Sims wrote:Assists on Transfrmarkt are dodgy and unreliable


Based on what?


They tend to be generous with their assist giving, it’s usually the one stat which is categorically wrong - alongside transfer value, obvs

Understat, Squawka & WhoScored are the most accurate
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby Dynamite » Fri Jan 11, 2019 3:33 pm

Sims wrote:
Dynamite wrote:
Sims wrote:Assists on Transfrmarkt are dodgy and unreliable


Based on what?


They tend to be generous with their assist giving, it’s usually the one stat which is categorically wrong - alongside transfer value, obvs

Understat, Squawka & WhoScored are the most accurate


They all (the three above) use Opta as their source IIRC and Opta hasn't a 100% accuracy history too.
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby theHotHead » Fri Jan 11, 2019 3:57 pm

So, lets look at David Silva and Eden Hazard.

Silva
Goals/assists v top 6 - 33. So 23% of goals
Goals/assists v rest - 111. So 77% of goals

Hazard
Goals/assists v top 6 - 27. So 20% of goals
Goals assists v rest - 107. So 80% of goals

Ozil
Goals/assists v top 6 - 16. So 19% of goals
Goals/assists v rest - 70. So 81% of goals

Now consider, Ozil has been playing for a team that doesn't challenge for league titles and a team that typically has less squad quality than both Chelsea and Man City. A reminder, 26% of games are against top 6 teams, 74% are against the rest.

Another argument napalmed !
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby Dejan » Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:11 pm

theHotHead wrote:So, lets look at David Silva and Eden Hazard.

Silva
Goals/assists v top 6 - 33. So 23% of goals
Goals/assists v rest - 111. So 77% of goals

Hazard
Goals/assists v top 6 - 27. So 20% of goals
Goals assists v rest - 107. So 80% of goals

Ozil
Goals/assists v top 6 - 16. So 19% of goals
Goals/assists v rest - 70. So 81% of goals

Now consider, Ozil has been playing for a team that doesn't challenge for league titles and a team that typically has less squad quality than both Chelsea and Man City. A reminder, 26% of games are against top 6 teams, 74% are against the rest.

Another argument napalmed !
Percentage of assists within your own total assists isnt a very good measure to compare them is it. Should of compared these players with assists/goals per 90(against top 6). Far more accurate.

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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby StLGooner » Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:16 pm

Ahh the enigma that is Mesut Ozil!!

This thread may never die, even after he's done playing.
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby theHotHead » Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:45 pm

Dejan wrote:
theHotHead wrote:So, lets look at David Silva and Eden Hazard.

Silva
Goals/assists v top 6 - 33. So 23% of goals
Goals/assists v rest - 111. So 77% of goals

Hazard
Goals/assists v top 6 - 27. So 20% of goals
Goals assists v rest - 107. So 80% of goals

Ozil
Goals/assists v top 6 - 16. So 19% of goals
Goals/assists v rest - 70. So 81% of goals

Now consider, Ozil has been playing for a team that doesn't challenge for league titles and a team that typically has less squad quality than both Chelsea and Man City. A reminder, 26% of games are against top 6 teams, 74% are against the rest.

Another argument napalmed !
Percentage of assists within your own total assists isnt a very good measure to compare them is it. Should of compared these players with assists/goals per 90(against top 6). Far more accurate.

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Huh ?? What could be more accurate than totaling the number of goals and assists and working out how many were against top teams and how many were not ? No need to over complicate this. 100% of goals/assists, how many were against the top 6 ? Does it match proportionally the number of games vs the top 6. Is Ozil a flat track bully? Not really. If he is then so is Hazard and Silva isn't far off either.
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby Santi » Fri Jan 11, 2019 7:35 pm

Why do people still care so much? If you like him then enjoy him while he’s here and fit, if not, Fvck off.
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Re: Mesut Özil (10)

Postby Dejan » Fri Jan 11, 2019 8:51 pm

theHotHead wrote:
Dejan wrote:
theHotHead wrote:So, lets look at David Silva and Eden Hazard.

Silva
Goals/assists v top 6 - 33. So 23% of goals
Goals/assists v rest - 111. So 77% of goals

Hazard
Goals/assists v top 6 - 27. So 20% of goals
Goals assists v rest - 107. So 80% of goals

Ozil
Goals/assists v top 6 - 16. So 19% of goals
Goals/assists v rest - 70. So 81% of goals

Now consider, Ozil has been playing for a team that doesn't challenge for league titles and a team that typically has less squad quality than both Chelsea and Man City. A reminder, 26% of games are against top 6 teams, 74% are against the rest.

Another argument napalmed !
Percentage of assists within your own total assists isnt a very good measure to compare them is it. Should of compared these players with assists/goals per 90(against top 6). Far more accurate.

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Huh ?? What could be more accurate than totaling the number of goals and assists and working out how many were against top teams and how many were not ? No need to over complicate this. 100% of goals/assists, how many were against the top 6 ? Does it match proportionally the number of games vs the top 6. Is Ozil a flat track bully? Not really. If he is then so is Hazard and Silva isn't far off either.
Because your stat does not take into account how many matches he played against top 6.

For example if he played once against top 6 and scored 2 and played 38 times against other teams outside top 6 and scored 76 then using your stat would make him look like a flattrack bully meanwhile his scoring ratio is the same between top6 and non top 6.

Using assist ratio per match of 90minutes against for both would give a better comparison.

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