2015 Rugby World Cup

Re: 2015 Rugby World Cup

Postby rah » Mon Oct 19, 2015 11:56 am

There's waaaay too much being made of the gap between the sides at this tournament (as opposed to the gap that has existed from day 1).

This time last year, Ireland beat Australia and South Africa, Scotland beat Argentina, France beat Australia, Wales beat South Africa and England beat Australia. It's not as if they are incapable of beating SH sides (when they play in the NH that is).

NZ are a cut above everyone else consistently but the rest of the sides are not far from each other. They are all capable of winning and losing against each other. Most world cups have ended up in a 2-2 split of NH and SH sides in the SFs. This one could have easily done the same.
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Re: 2015 Rugby World Cup

Postby Apollo » Mon Oct 19, 2015 11:59 am

rah wrote:There's waaaay too much being made of the gap between the sides at this tournament (as opposed to the gap that has existed from day 1).

This time last year, Ireland beat Australia and South Africa, Scotland beat Argentina, France beat Australia, Wales beat South Africa and England beat Australia. It's not as if they are incapable of beating SH sides (when they play in the NH that is).

NZ are a cut above everyone else consistently but the rest of the sides are not far from each other. They are all capable of winning and losing against each other. Most world cups have ended up in a 2-2 split of NH and SH sides in the SFs. This one could have easily done the same.


NH have gone 1/8 in WC.

I think the gap is pretty sizable.
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Re: 2015 Rugby World Cup

Postby rah » Mon Oct 19, 2015 12:20 pm

Apollo wrote:
rah wrote:There's waaaay too much being made of the gap between the sides at this tournament (as opposed to the gap that has existed from day 1).

This time last year, Ireland beat Australia and South Africa, Scotland beat Argentina, France beat Australia, Wales beat South Africa and England beat Australia. It's not as if they are incapable of beating SH sides (when they play in the NH that is).

NZ are a cut above everyone else consistently but the rest of the sides are not far from each other. They are all capable of winning and losing against each other. Most world cups have ended up in a 2-2 split of NH and SH sides in the SFs. This one could have easily done the same.


NH have gone 1/8 in WC.

I think the gap is pretty sizable.


You're missing my point. I said in my first para that there is a gap between the overall records of NH and SH. Generally speaking, the better sides will win in rugby more often than not and, generally speaking, historically Australia, SA and NZ have been some of the strongest sides. Only England and France have consistently challenged them and even they don't have winning records against them.

My point was that I don't think this tournament should be regarded as some great example of the gap widening. There has always been a gap. If anything, professionalism has closed the gap, as it is doing with the Tier 2 nations. I don't particularly see one weekend of games as proof that the gap has suddenly widened.
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Re: 2015 Rugby World Cup

Postby rah » Mon Oct 19, 2015 12:30 pm

Cripps wrote:Not sure if it's been mentioned but apparently England have a couple of world class players that were left out of the World Cup squad cos they play abroad.

Seriously?


They do, but it should be pointed out that NZ have the same rule and Australia kinda do (they relaxed it slightly to get Matt Giteau and Drew Mitchell in).

I don't like the rule, but it's not like it was a new thing. The players knew it was there when they went to play in France. They chose the money over the national jersey.

It should also be pointed out that Wales do pick overseas players but have often had difficulties getting those players released for some games and it has also weakened the Welsh domestic league.
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Re: 2015 Rugby World Cup

Postby Apollo » Mon Oct 19, 2015 12:39 pm

rah wrote:
Apollo wrote:
rah wrote:There's waaaay too much being made of the gap between the sides at this tournament (as opposed to the gap that has existed from day 1).

This time last year, Ireland beat Australia and South Africa, Scotland beat Argentina, France beat Australia, Wales beat South Africa and England beat Australia. It's not as if they are incapable of beating SH sides (when they play in the NH that is).

NZ are a cut above everyone else consistently but the rest of the sides are not far from each other. They are all capable of winning and losing against each other. Most world cups have ended up in a 2-2 split of NH and SH sides in the SFs. This one could have easily done the same.


NH have gone 1/8 in WC.

I think the gap is pretty sizable.


You're missing my point. I said in my first para that there is a gap between the overall records of NH and SH. Generally speaking, the better sides will win in rugby more often than not and, generally speaking, historically Australia, SA and NZ have been some of the strongest sides. Only England and France have consistently challenged them and even they don't have winning records against them.

My point was that I don't think this tournament should be regarded as some great example of the gap widening. There has always been a gap. If anything, professionalism has closed the gap, as it is doing with the Tier 2 nations. I don't particularly see one weekend of games as proof that the gap has suddenly widened.


Im not sure about anything widening but the status quo has been maintained.
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Re: 2015 Rugby World Cup

Postby Dubs4Sam » Mon Oct 19, 2015 1:15 pm

A good point being made over here is that the Southern Hemisphere go into W/C straight off the back of their on 4 Nations - competitive edge? Where the Northern Hermisphere go into it on the back of friendlies which isnt the same - summory are they well oiled compared to us?

And of course their relucntance to kick every opportunity and go into contact is another :hiding:
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Re: 2015 Rugby World Cup

Postby greengoonerie » Mon Oct 19, 2015 1:21 pm

rah wrote:
Apollo wrote:
rah wrote:There's waaaay too much being made of the gap between the sides at this tournament (as opposed to the gap that has existed from day 1).

This time last year, Ireland beat Australia and South Africa, Scotland beat Argentina, France beat Australia, Wales beat South Africa and England beat Australia. It's not as if they are incapable of beating SH sides (when they play in the NH that is).

NZ are a cut above everyone else consistently but the rest of the sides are not far from each other. They are all capable of winning and losing against each other. Most world cups have ended up in a 2-2 split of NH and SH sides in the SFs. This one could have easily done the same.


NH have gone 1/8 in WC.

I think the gap is pretty sizable.


You're missing my point. I said in my first para that there is a gap between the overall records of NH and SH. Generally speaking, the better sides will win in rugby more often than not and, generally speaking, historically Australia, SA and NZ have been some of the strongest sides. Only England and France have consistently challenged them and even they don't have winning records against them.

My point was that I don't think this tournament should be regarded as some great example of the gap widening. There has always been a gap. If anything, professionalism has closed the gap, as it is doing with the Tier 2 nations. I don't particularly see one weekend of games as proof that the gap has suddenly widened.
TBH, we're not missing your point.

Facts and evidence point to the fact that your argument is not sustainable.

1. This is the first EVER world cup where NO NH team has made the SF.
you are suggesting bad luck - i'm pointing to the fact that the SH teams are better. Argentina are now on a par with SA and not far behind Aus and NZ and are developign year on year.

2. the host nation - England (generally regarded as the strongest of the home nations given they have 40million to choose from) didn't even make it to the last 8.

3. France hammered by NZ by almost 50 points. Frances rugby philosophy is in tatters and going backwards

4. Ireland walloped by Argentina - conceding 4 tries. Ireland don't have strength in dept - 5 injuries and that was it.

5. Wales were beaten narrowly, but again came up short in a tight game.

6. Scotland WERE unlucky and IMO robbed of a SF place - however thems the breaks when you are in competitive matches.

7. Seven of the Coaches in the QFs of 2015 are Southern Hemisphere players/coaches. The only one who isn't was the French guy - and look what happened to him and his team

So in the 4 QFs, NH teams took two hidings, Wales lost narrowly and Scotland (arguably) were robbed.

The gulf is widening on the evidence being presented. NH Unions need to address the way the game is being played and developed from underage level onwards - it's like rugby League - big guys hammering into each other all over the pitch.
Last edited by greengoonerie on Mon Oct 19, 2015 1:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2015 Rugby World Cup

Postby rah » Mon Oct 19, 2015 1:22 pm

I thought about that the other day, but I don't really buy into the friendlies being that different - you can't really play rugby at 70% like you can football.

I think it is mildly interesting that the two sides who were most impressive in the QFs were the two who had their most difficult group game almost a month ago and then have just been working their way through some hard-working but limited sides since. Compare that to Australia/France/Ireland who all looked below par having come straight out of their most taxing match.
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Re: 2015 Rugby World Cup

Postby Royal Gooner » Mon Oct 19, 2015 9:23 pm

So, who will win between the All Blacks, the All Whites, the convicts or the argie war losers?
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Re: 2015 Rugby World Cup

Postby jmiles10 » Mon Oct 19, 2015 10:23 pm

Rugby in England is private school game it will be difficult to be as good as the sh teams when that is the case although 03 proves it is possible
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Re: 2015 Rugby World Cup

Postby EvAMY-CRAIGLEEAFC » Tue Oct 20, 2015 12:59 pm

I have just had the Ireland Rugby badge tattooed on the top of my arm.
I want Carl Jenkinson back in a Arsenal shirt next season.
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Re: 2015 Rugby World Cup

Postby Cripps » Sat Oct 24, 2015 3:11 pm

New Zealand lead 7-3
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Re: 2015 Rugby World Cup

Postby Cripps » Sat Oct 24, 2015 3:56 pm

12-7 to South Africa.

Half time

Decent game
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Re: 2015 Rugby World Cup

Postby Adriatic » Sat Oct 24, 2015 4:15 pm

anyone has a decent stream? :(
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Re: 2015 Rugby World Cup

Postby Cripps » Sat Oct 24, 2015 4:24 pm

15-20 NZ.

Great game.

Shame I have to stop watching
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