In Arsène We Shall Always Trust ~ Victoria Concordia Crescit

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Re: In Arsène We Shall Always Trust ~ Victoria Concordia Cre

Postby StockGooner » Wed Mar 23, 2022 9:14 am

Phil71 wrote:
Nuggets wrote:
Goonerred wrote:
VCC wrote:Yes re-name the stadium “ Rust never sleeps’ to remind never to go down a road like that again. Amazing manager to start with but he also threw as many titles away as he won.
We need to win the CL until then our history will always have a large hole in its cabinet

Those early days were amazing, we broke so many records under Wenger. It really all fell apart after the invincibles season. We did win it!


I think the biggest disappointment for me was when we lost the final in the CL :crybaby:


Against that bunch of cheating divers.

We should have won that game.


Never forgive Almunia for not covering his near post. It was like Seaman vs Giggs in '99 as well (Except Seaman was a legend)

Yes their other goal was offside but still....
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Re: In Arsène We Shall Always Trust ~ Victoria Concordia Cre

Postby Ach » Wed Mar 23, 2022 10:37 am

VCC wrote:Yes re-name the stadium “ Rust never sleeps’ to remind never to go down a road like that again. Amazing manager to start with but he also threw as many titles away as he won.
We need to win the CL until then our history will always have a large hole in its cabinet

Probably threw away more than he won

98/99, 02/03, 07/08, 13/14 and 15/16.

That's not to mention the collapses in other seasons where we were deep in to the season with the title still a possibility and just fell away. Think 10/11 was one of those. But that was a could have won. The 5 seasons above are should haves.

And now he's come out and said he wants to manage again yet he's doing soccer aid cos no team will touch him

How the mighty have fallen

I'll never forget the invincibles and in time I hope what Wenger did to this club in the final 10 years will be put to the back of our minds and what he achieved right at the front but it's far too soon now as we are still suffering from diabolical decisions he made
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Re: In Arsène We Shall Always Trust ~ Victoria Concordia Cre

Postby Goonerred » Wed Mar 23, 2022 11:41 am

Ach wrote:
VCC wrote:Yes re-name the stadium “ Rust never sleeps’ to remind never to go down a road like that again. Amazing manager to start with but he also threw as many titles away as he won.
We need to win the CL until then our history will always have a large hole in its cabinet

Probably threw away more than he won

98/99, 02/03, 07/08, 13/14 and 15/16.

That's not to mention the collapses in other seasons where we were deep in to the season with the title still a possibility and just fell away. Think 10/11 was one of those. But that was a could have won. The 5 seasons above are should haves.

And now he's come out and said he wants to manage again yet he's doing soccer aid cos no team will touch him

How the mighty have fallen

I'll never forget the invincibles and in time I hope what Wenger did to this club in the final 10 years will be put to the back of our minds and what he achieved right at the front but it's far too soon now as we are still suffering from diabolical decisions he made

Was that the season we finished 4th in a two horse race that were were in?
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Re: In Arsène We Shall Always Trust ~ Victoria Concordia Cre

Postby Nuggets » Wed Mar 23, 2022 12:56 pm

Phil71 wrote:
Nuggets wrote:
Goonerred wrote:
VCC wrote:Yes re-name the stadium “ Rust never sleeps’ to remind never to go down a road like that again. Amazing manager to start with but he also threw as many titles away as he won.
We need to win the CL until then our history will always have a large hole in its cabinet

Those early days were amazing, we broke so many records under Wenger. It really all fell apart after the invincibles season. We did win it!


I think the biggest disappointment for me was when we lost the final in the CL :crybaby:


Against that bunch of cheating divers.

We should have won that game.

Diving bastard's got away with murder, heartbroken is not the word.
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Re: In Arsène We Shall Always Trust ~ Victoria Concordia Cre

Postby Nuggets » Wed Mar 23, 2022 12:57 pm

StockGooner wrote:
Phil71 wrote:
Nuggets wrote:
Goonerred wrote:
VCC wrote:Yes re-name the stadium “ Rust never sleeps’ to remind never to go down a road like that again. Amazing manager to start with but he also threw as many titles away as he won.
We need to win the CL until then our history will always have a large hole in its cabinet

Those early days were amazing, we broke so many records under Wenger. It really all fell apart after the invincibles season. We did win it!


I think the biggest disappointment for me was when we lost the final in the CL :crybaby:


Against that bunch of cheating divers.

We should have won that game.


Never forgive Almunia for not covering his near post. It was like Seaman vs Giggs in '99 as well (Except Seaman was a legend)

Yes their other goal was offside but still....

Almunia should have been flogged after that game the usless bastard
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Re: In Arsène We Shall Always Trust ~ Victoria Concordia Cre

Postby Ach » Wed Mar 23, 2022 1:22 pm

Goonerred wrote:
Ach wrote:
VCC wrote:Yes re-name the stadium “ Rust never sleeps’ to remind never to go down a road like that again. Amazing manager to start with but he also threw as many titles away as he won.
We need to win the CL until then our history will always have a large hole in its cabinet

Probably threw away more than he won

98/99, 02/03, 07/08, 13/14 and 15/16.

That's not to mention the collapses in other seasons where we were deep in to the season with the title still a possibility and just fell away. Think 10/11 was one of those. But that was a could have won. The 5 seasons above are should haves.

And now he's come out and said he wants to manage again yet he's doing soccer aid cos no team will touch him

How the mighty have fallen

I'll never forget the invincibles and in time I hope what Wenger did to this club in the final 10 years will be put to the back of our minds and what he achieved right at the front but it's far too soon now as we are still suffering from diabolical decisions he made

Was that the season we finished 4th in a two horse race that were were in?

I think we were a point behind man utd going in to the league cup final v Birmingham. Still in CL and fa cup as well. Don't think it was ever just a 2 horse race but can't remember where Chelsea etc were at the time

We lost the league cup final thanks to dumb and dumber. Season fell apart
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Re: Arsène Wenger statue due to be unveiled at the Emirates

Postby Zenith » Mon May 23, 2022 1:35 pm

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Re: Arsène Wenger statue due to be unveiled at the Emirates

Postby VCC » Mon May 23, 2022 6:30 pm

Zenith wrote:

Should have two statues
1st one full size up to invincibless

2nd one should be a miniture depicting always coming up short
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Re: Arsène Wenger statue due to be unveiled at the Emirates

Postby Santi » Mon May 23, 2022 6:41 pm

VCC wrote:
Zenith wrote:

Should have two statues
1st one full size up to invincibless

2nd one should be a miniture depicting always coming up short


:rofll:

As much as I can’t hate Wenger, this was hilarious. Little mini Arsene outside the north bank plz
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Re: In Arsène We Shall Always Trust ~ Victoria Concordia Cre

Postby UFGN » Mon May 23, 2022 6:43 pm

The problem with statues is they tend to lionise the subject and erase the possibility of challenging their greatness

Eg Churchill. I don't begrudge Churchill his statue near Whitehall, he did after all save our country and he was the right leader to make tough decisions to win the war. But, when you try to have a sensible conversation about some of the terrible things he did in his life, it's impossible because you get labelled a leftie nutcase for even bringing it up.

Herbert Chapman...... Bet you can't tell me a single bad thing about him ...... because only the good is remembered

Wenger...... Give him a statue. Yes he should have one for his successes at Arsenal. But don't think for a minute that it erases the bad.
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Re: In Arsène We Shall Always Trust ~ Victoria Concordia Cre

Postby Hypergooner » Mon May 23, 2022 7:14 pm

UFGN wrote:The problem with statues is they tend to lionise the subject and erase the possibility of challenging their greatness

Eg Churchill. I don't begrudge Churchill his statue near Whitehall, he did after all save our country and he was the right leader to make tough decisions to win the war. But, when you try to have a sensible conversation about some of the terrible things he did in his life, it's impossible because you get labelled a leftie nutcase for even bringing it up.

Herbert Chapman...... Bet you can't tell me a single bad thing about him ...... because only the good is remembered

Wenger...... Give him a statue. Yes he should have one for his successes at Arsenal. But don't think for a minute that it erases the bad.


People aren't perfect, everyone has something others don't like when looking back! If their good deeds out way their bad ones, they deserve credit.
Wengers good deeds far out way his bad ones. He deserves a statue! He literally changed way British football was thought about and played. Because of him, players stopped drinking when they did. They started eating correctly and trusting foreign coaches methods more. The Prem wouldn't be at the level it is now if it wasn't for him.
He also stayed 5 seasons too long and designed a stadium with no atmosphere!
Invincibility lies in the defence; the possibility of victory in the attack.

Sun Tzu


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Re: In Arsène We Shall Always Trust ~ Victoria Concordia Cre

Postby Angelito » Mon May 23, 2022 9:30 pm

Please let it be this:

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:hiding:


UFGN wrote:Wenger...... Give him a statue. Yes he should have one for his successes at Arsenal. But don't think for a minute that it erases the bad.


Look at it this way, perhaps Wenger was the one holding it all together when the board wasn't sure what to do? We had an internal tussle between Usmanov and Kroenke for years. The boardroom didn't back Wenger as they should have.

I know we will disagree, but my two cents on this is Wenger's naivety to identify himself as Arsenal, hence, he acted upon as Arsenal's custodian rather than Arsenal manager.

Look at how we've been since he left, or once the Gazidis/Wenger cold war began.

These bits from Wenger's documentary were quite revealing for me:

Once we moved into the (new) stadium, between one and two, we moved to three and four. We lost our best players... Before, we lost them at 30+. Now, we lost them at 25 plus.

To work with restricted resources and keep the club in a position where we could pay our debts back. Between 2006 and 2015, I personally think I did my best job.

I regret. I should have gone somewhere else. I identified myself with the club completely. And that was the mistake I made.

Now there is no special reason for me to go there. All the rest is purely emotional and that is less important.


I don't consider Zidane to be an elite manager. But Zidane is someone who I admire for being street smart and strategic. He knew when to leave Real Madrid. He didn't accept being belittled by the club/board. The first time around, he left because he disagreed with Perez regarding the post-Ronaldo rebuild. The second time, he left after Real board members starting planting false stories about him.

Dein does mention that Wenger wanted to leave after the boardroom drama in 2007 but he (Dein) requested Wenger to stay. After that, Wenger wanted to see the project through. Wenger should have left in 2011 instead of protecting the board. He was the best manager in the world. Yet, it ended so badly for him.

Looking at the astronomical money City, Chelsea, and United have spent... Even Liverpool under Klopp have spend loads of money, yet Wenger achieved so much with a negative net spend until 2012.

Wenger was too attached to Arsenal. Unlike many other managers.

Dixon conceded that Wenger turned down the biggest jobs to stay at Arsenal, and how Arsenal was nice to him too. Sure, Arsenal was. But Arsenal has been nicer than nice to Arteta, to Granit Xhaka. Arsenal was beyond nice to Fabregas and van Persie. So?

Ultimately, my lesson from all of this is to know when to walk away. Wenger couldn't. He acted like a fan, to his own detriment. The board did him nasty. If the Kroenkes had backed Wenger as much as they are backing Arteta, things might have turned different.

It's just sad. We had a generational manager and we wasted him. Partly because Wenger was the eternal romantic, mostly because of the circumstances.

:(

Vieira mentioned that Wenger wasn't even pushed out of the back door, he was pushed out of the back window. SAF added that Wenger kept Arsenal in Europe with a threadbare budget, yet fans (and the club) blamed him for Arsenal's "failure" to win the League.

I still don't get why Arsenal offered him that extension in 2017. Wenger signed it because he was obsessed with Arsenal. But Kroenke and Gazidis, they should have known better. They did him nasty—offering him that contract amidst so much animosity, then kicking him out mid-way.

Wenger didn't know when to walk away. He mentions that he sacrificed his family life for Arsenal. But he's glad that he has a daughter at least. Lol. He was/is a fan. I just wished he left sooner. We forced out our greatest manager. It didn't have to end like this.

Oh well.


P.S.

That documentary is awful. I mean it when I say that. From a filmmaking standpoint, it's unacceptable. But as a Gooner, we'll still enjoy it for obvious reasons.
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Re: In Arsène We Shall Always Trust ~ Victoria Concordia Cre

Postby UFGN » Mon May 23, 2022 9:43 pm

Angelito wrote:Please let it be this:

Image

:hiding:


UFGN wrote:Wenger...... Give him a statue. Yes he should have one for his successes at Arsenal. But don't think for a minute that it erases the bad.


Look at it this way, perhaps Wenger was the one holding it all together when the board wasn't sure what to do? We had an internal tussle between Usmanov and Kroenke for years. The boardroom didn't back Wenger as they should have.

I know we will disagree, but my two cents on this is Wenger's naivety to identify himself as Arsenal, hence, he acted upon as Arsenal's custodian rather than Arsenal manager.

Look at how we've been since he left, or once the Gazidis/Wenger cold war began.

These bits from Wenger's documentary were quite revealing for me:

Once we moved into the (new) stadium, between one and two, we moved to three and four. We lost our best players... Before, we lost them at 30+. Now, we lost them at 25 plus.

To work with restricted resources and keep the club in a position where we could pay our debts back. Between 2006 and 2015, I personally think I did my best job.

I regret. I should have gone somewhere else. I identified myself with the club completely. And that was the mistake I made.

Now there is no special reason for me to go there. All the rest is purely emotional and that is less important.


I don't consider Zidane to be an elite manager. But Zidane is someone who I admire for being street smart and strategic. He knew when to leave Real Madrid. He didn't accept being belittled by the club/board. The first time around, he left because he disagreed with Perez regarding the post-Ronaldo rebuild. The second time, he left after Real board members starting planting false stories about him.

Dein does mention that Wenger wanted to leave after the boardroom drama in 2007 but he (Dein) requested Wenger to stay. After that, Wenger wanted to see the project through. Wenger should have left in 2011 instead of protecting the board. He was the best manager in the world. Yet, it ended so badly for him.

Looking at the astronomical money City, Chelsea, and United have spent... Even Liverpool under Klopp have spend loads of money, yet Wenger achieved so much with a negative net spend until 2012.

Wenger was too attached to Arsenal. Unlike many other managers.

Dixon conceded that Wenger turned down the biggest jobs to stay at Arsenal, and how Arsenal was nice to him too. Sure, Arsenal was. But Arsenal has been nicer than nice to Arteta, to Granit Xhaka. Arsenal was beyond nice to Fabregas and van Persie. So?

Ultimately, my lesson from all of this is to know when to walk away. Wenger couldn't. He acted like a fan, to his own detriment. The board did him nasty. If the Kroenkes had backed Wenger as much as they are backing Arteta, things might have turned different.

It's just sad. We had a generational manager and we wasted him. Partly because Wenger was the eternal romantic, mostly because of the circumstances.

:(

Vieira mentioned that Wenger wasn't even pushed out of the back door, he was pushed out of the back window. SAF added that Wenger kept Arsenal in Europe with a threadbare budget, yet fans (and the club) blamed him for Arsenal's "failure" to win the League.

I still don't get why Arsenal offered him that extension in 2017. Wenger signed it because he was obsessed with Arsenal. But Kroenke and Gazidis, they should have known better. They did him nasty—offering him that contract amidst so much animosity, then kicking him out mid-way.

Wenger didn't know when to walk away. He mentions that he sacrificed his family life for Arsenal. But he's glad that he has a daughter at least. Lol. He was/is a fan. I just wished he left sooner. We forced out our greatest manager. It didn't have to end like this.

Oh well.


P.S.

That documentary is awful. I mean it when I say that. From a filmmaking standpoint, it's unacceptable. But as a Gooner, we'll still enjoy it for obvious reasons.



I think you paint a sympathetic picture of the second half of his term at Arsenal. I point to the power he was afforded. The reported £7.5 Million salary. The lack of demands for trophies from the directors. He was in a uniquely privileged position, and I say, for his own benefit, not really for Arsenal's, he lapped it up.
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Re: In Arsène We Shall Always Trust ~ Victoria Concordia Cre

Postby UFGN » Tue May 24, 2022 12:08 am

Here's a news report about Rioch's sacking and Wenger's imminent arrival, including an extraordinary interview with Ian Wright.

I say extraordinary because he speaks so freely. (And handles himself pretty well up against a tricky journo.) Can you imagine a serving player nowadays giving an interview like that and answering a wide range of questions about ongoing issues at the club?

https://youtu.be/qYynLXEg2WY
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Re: In Arsène We Shall Always Trust ~ Victoria Concordia Cre

Postby Zenith » Sat Jun 11, 2022 10:41 pm



Deft touch with his left foot to set up his right foot for the reverse pass. :hail:
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