Cardiff 0-3 Arsenal | Premier League 30/11/13

Re: Cardiff 0-3 Arsenal | Premier League 30/11/13

Postby Angelito » Tue Dec 03, 2013 2:20 pm

SchlandGooner wrote:Depends on the style of play from the teams.
In a counter attacking team Podolski is one of the best attacking players in the world he proved that for Germany and Köln.
In a 4-4-2 alongside another striker who can handle the ball like Klose or Novakovic he was also great for Germany and Köln.

As a single striker he doesn't play really often (quiet some times for Köln and if I remember correctly for Bayern in the CL and UEFA-Cup) in the past but if you give him some time to adapt (like van Persie had here, RVP wasn't that good from start there) I guess he could reach him. Don't see any abilities were RVP is way superior to him. RVP has maybe the better right foot but Podolski also scored with it but he prefers his left cause it is more accurate. They both have scored nearly the same amount of headers and they both scored the most times after the 75min mark sadly Podolski is mostly subbed at Arsenal at this stage of the game.

If you check out the overall stats RVP isn't much better but played most of the time for a much better team it's of course easier to score 18goals for a top team like Arsenal compared to a club like Köln in the league also I guess Podolski made more games as a winger today.


+1

And, van Persie wasn't good as a lone striker right from on go, as SchGoo mentioned. If we give Podolski the same time, he could reach the level van Persie has. People are being way too unfair to Podolski here. They're willing to give Giroud as many chances as they want, but when it comes to Podolski, he's already being written off as a striker and people don't even seem to prefer him on the left--despite Cazorla having several anonymous games there. I do hope Wenger uses Podolski more this season. I mean, he was the most subbed player last season...

Edit:

Podolski's left foot is as good as van Persie's. There's not even a doubt in that.

On the talk of BatiGOAL, LOVE that guy. Adore him. My favorite player of all time and the greatest striker of his generation. :hail:
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Re: Cardiff 0-3 Arsenal | Premier League 30/11/13

Postby DiamondGooner » Tue Dec 03, 2013 2:32 pm

Me too.

90's strikers were so much better at shooting the ball, Battistuta, Bierhoff, Bergkamp, Hasslebaink, Kluivert, Henry, Ronaldo (Brazil), Del Pierio, Vieri.

Then you had the early 2000's Wing Forward conversions like Ronaldinho, T.Henry, Messi, Ronaldo, Bale (more recent), RVP.

These are my favourite strikers, either the 90's shooting masters or the early 2000's pace and dribbling skill merchants.

I'd take them over today's lamp post's anyday of the week, Drogba and Ibra are the only target men I have real respect for.
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Re: Cardiff 0-3 Arsenal | Premier League 30/11/13

Postby Massa » Tue Dec 03, 2013 4:19 pm

SchlandGooner wrote:
Massa wrote:Finishing doesn't make you a good striker

If you can't finish as a striker you are useless and you should not be a striker, like Piszeck maybe you are a much better defender. On the other hand if they don't score regulary they are donkey like you call Giroud always :rolleyes:


I said Giroud was a donkey on the day. If someone said Ozil was shit does that make him shit? No

Of course finishing is important but finishing alone is not enough.

Massa wrote:van Persie has probably the best movement in football

Maybe it's just me but regulary the guys who doesn't play for Arsenal are the best players for you, right ?
There are several games in my mind where van Persie was "donkey" for Arsenal if our current players have 2-3 games like that they are shit and we need to buy a replacement..did you say the same as van Persie was a Gunner or Henry ?

Err no. The best players for me are the best players. Assuming my opinion on Giroud is based on 2-3 games is pretty lazy and snide, I've not been a fan for a while. Your moving on from the original point though, of which van Persie has the best movement of any striker there is.
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Re: Cardiff 0-3 Arsenal | Premier League 30/11/13

Postby Angelito » Tue Dec 03, 2013 4:22 pm

DiamondGooner wrote:Me too.

90's strikers were so much better at shooting the ball, Battistuta, Bierhoff, Bergkamp, Hasslebaink, Kluivert, Henry, Ronaldo (Brazil), Del Pierio, Vieri.

Then you had the early 2000's Wing Forward conversions like Ronaldinho, T.Henry, Messi, Ronaldo, Bale (more recent), RVP.

These are my favourite strikers, either the 90's shooting masters or the early 2000's pace and dribbling skill merchants.

I'd take them over today's lamp post's anyday of the week, Drogba and Ibra are the only target men I have real respect for.


100% agreed. The quality of strikers have starkly reduced over the last few years. There was a time when you had Batistuta, Bergkamp, Henry, Ronaldo, del Piero, Kluivert, etc. playing at the same time. Today, it's changed. Since the false #9 birth, you find many wingers turned into strikers or teams playing their CAMs as strikers.

Europe doesn't have as many great strikers as it used to. Even when you look at the likes of van Nisteelroy, Inzaghi, Vieri, Trezeguet, etc. Europe had some genuine strikers but over the years, it's come down to a handful of strikers. I'd think it's because of the whole "midfield obsession." Podolski is similar to the strikers of the 90s and early 00s, but you find Gunners slating him for not being false #9-esque... It's funny.
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Re: Cardiff 0-3 Arsenal | Premier League 30/11/13

Postby GSK_AFC » Tue Dec 03, 2013 10:36 pm

There's only one false #9 in world football and that's Messi.
If you want a limited player upfront so be it.
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Re: Cardiff 0-3 Arsenal | Premier League 30/11/13

Postby Massa » Tue Dec 03, 2013 10:56 pm

GSK_AFC wrote:There's only one false #9 in world football and that's Messi.
If you want a limited player upfront so be it.
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Re: Cardiff 0-3 Arsenal | Premier League 30/11/13

Postby DiamondGooner » Wed Dec 04, 2013 12:19 am

GSK_AFC wrote:There's only one false #9 in world football and that's Messi.
If you want a limited player upfront so be it.



We already have a limited player up front. :dontknow:

May as well have one who can shoot the ball.
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Re: Cardiff 0-3 Arsenal | Premier League 30/11/13

Postby Angelito » Wed Dec 04, 2013 1:14 am

GSK_AFC wrote:There's only one false #9 in world football and that's Messi.
If you want a limited player upfront so be it.


False #9-esque

Like a false #9...

And, what DG said. van Persie didn't play as a typical ST for us, like Giroud does.
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Re: Cardiff 0-3 Arsenal | Premier League 30/11/13

Postby Arsenal~Fanatic » Wed Dec 04, 2013 9:25 am

As a lone striker RVP is far superior to Podolski. RVP's dribbling, creativity and movement is much much better. Wenger with the signing of Ozil has made a CLEAR STATEMENT that he want to continue playing with the 4-2-3-1 formation. So if we keep the discussion simple Podolski will not be able to EFFECTIVELY perform the role of a LONE STRIKER in our system on a consistent basis. Middle of the season is not the time to experiment. We need a proven striker who can play the lone striker role in January. The discussion about him being effective in a 4-4-2 is irrelevant cos Wenger has not shown any signs of employing a 4-4-2. Podolski neither has the physical presence/hold-up play nor has the dribbling skills/fancy foot-work/creativity to play as a lone striker. He has a wonderful left foot and is a hard worker but that is not enough to be competing for a lone striker's role.

Yes Podolski played as a CF for FC Koln but majority of his time he has played as a LWF cutting in and taking the shot on. His best position in our system is as a LWF but there also Cazorla offers much more than him. If one is brutally honest Podolski is not a starter for us on merit when everybody is fit. He is a LWF imo and should be utilized in that position. So in our squad his job is to compete for a spot on the left hand side. We play plenty of games so he will get his opportunities as a LWF.
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Re: Cardiff 0-3 Arsenal | Premier League 30/11/13

Postby Massa » Wed Dec 04, 2013 4:55 pm

Angelito wrote:
GSK_AFC wrote:There's only one false #9 in world football and that's Messi.
If you want a limited player upfront so be it.


False #9-esque

Like a false #9...

And, what DG said. van Persie didn't play as a typical ST for us, like Giroud does.

Van Persie played as a #9 for us, was always poaching in the box. It's just that he had world class technique aswell
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Re: Cardiff vs Arsenal | Premier League 30/11/13

Postby starmandb » Fri Dec 06, 2013 11:11 am

ThereIsBearCüm wrote:
starmandb wrote:
ThereIsBearCüm wrote:
Callum wrote:
ThereIsBearCüm wrote:Any player on the pitch would have scored that, it's not like it was a difficult chance. If Arteta was on the pitch, he would have done the same, and we'd have stood a better chance of killing the game off earlier too.

Easy to say that but there's no guarantee. He still has to hit it with enough power and accuracy to beat the goalkeeper and keep it under the bar. Could easily have fluffed it or mis-kicked it into the keeper's hands.

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The player he came on for (Arteta) would most certainly have scored that. He's a much better shooter than Flamini.

had to take the shot on when he did or it would have been intercepted
shame he used too much power to score the goal
there is a limit on how much power he can use
he won,t be able to call on it if needed in future now
arsenal win and it makes some so unhappy
weird


Once again missing the point. Just because he used more power than he needed doesn't mean it was any harder finish.

i get the point but its bollocks. the ball went in the net thats all that matters weather he blasted it or tickled it in with a feather.
its like when people say about goalkeepers making a save for the cameras
so what?
should they be overcasual and risk the ball going in?
i fail to see this as an issue
goal scored
job done
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Re: Cardiff 0-3 Arsenal | Premier League 30/11/13

Postby starmandb » Fri Dec 06, 2013 11:19 am

Angelito wrote:RE: Podolski

He can EASILY play as a striker. I don't get where people developed this concept. He played as a striker before and because of Klose and German NT's strength, Low moved him wide because he was 'undroppable.'

Re: Aguero

Comparing Aguero to Giroud? Let's conviniently ignore how Aguero went through a divorce with his wife last season, had injuries throughout, whilst the entire City team were shambolic? Yeah...

Re: Giroud

Giroud is good but we do need better. If we can get somebody who can score goals out of nowhere, we'd be fine. Right now Giroud is all we have, so let's hope he stays up and scores. When was the last time Giroud scored a goal from outside the box, btw? Starman?

at brighton in the fa cup last season
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Re: Cardiff 0-3 Arsenal | Premier League 30/11/13

Postby starmandb » Fri Dec 06, 2013 12:06 pm

GSK_AFC wrote:
DiamondGooner wrote:
GSK_AFC wrote:I think Poldi would be a poacher if we were to play him upfront, he doesn't really excel at interplay.


Podolski and Cazorla had the best interplay in the team when they were playing together regularly, also don't forget how Pod won us the Fulham game? before he got injured with a great strike.

People under estimate Pod to easily considering he's not even had long stints in the team.

The only time I can think of good interplay is from Liverpool (A) last year.
I rate Podolski but only as an outlet on the left not upfront.

cazorla passed for podolski goal at fulham this season
last as you said they set up each others at liverpool
pod passed to caz for our 3rd v spurs
pod set up 2 of caz goals with a cross and a pass in his hat trick at reading
pod set up caz for our 3rd v west ham
caz set up all 4 v wigan inc pods 2 goals
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