Crystal Palace 0-2 Arsenal | Premier League 26/10/13

Re: Crystal Palace vs Arsenal | Premier League 26/10/13

Postby Schlandi » Sun Oct 27, 2013 6:37 pm

Gooner_Gaz wrote:Anyone think Giroud was quite poor yesterday.....apart from his goal


I do and so far I gave him the worst rating in the rating thread. :Peace:
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Re: Crystal Palace vs Arsenal | Premier League 26/10/13

Postby Arsenal~Fanatic » Sun Oct 27, 2013 6:53 pm

Omphi93 wrote:
Arsenal~Fanatic wrote:
Omphi93 wrote:
Arsenal~Fanatic wrote:Ramsey is on track to become the next Walcott. No matter what he does he will always be a limited player. Walcott did not win manage to win over a section of fans despite scoring and assisting the most last season so i can see where this is going with Ramsey. Had Ramsey been playing for another club the the same people slagging him would be calling him phenomenal. Ramsey is not a finished product by any standards but the kind of IMPROVEMENT he has shown in his passing/tackling/dribbling/shooting/energy is something i haven't seen in any premier league player in recent times. After his horrific leg break he has shown that when you put your mind to something you can achieve anything.


Walcott is "limited" in term of his footballing attributes

Ramsey is not not.


LOL i would be happy if you were consistent at-least. You defend Giroud [ i am not one of his haters although i think we need better and different] and literally pounce on anybody the moment somebody makes a comment about him being pretty limited which is a fact and say Walcott is limited when he comfortable out-scored and out-assisted Giroud despite not playing centrally. This is why i say one need to apply the same standards to judge players.


When people reffer to Walcott being limited thats what they are talking about, his range and set of attributes.

Iv yet to see people fans and haters alike refer to Ramsey as being limited, he has a lot of criticism but thats not something that bought up and he wont "always be branded a limited player".

Walcott could be the the greatest Wing in the world and the limited tag would still apply, Its not a comment on form, efficiency,team value its a comment on his set of attributes.


When you talk about the likes of Messi and Ronaldo most players would look limited in front of the array of talent they have. Yes Walcott is limited if you apply those standards. Its funny how Walcott is called limited by those tv pundits and media journalists cos he cannot dribble. Walcott has added a lot to his game over the years. To call a bloke who has great pace, a knack of timing his runs to perfection, good movement off the ball, good link up play, a much better final ball these days which shows in his assists, and is a good finisher which shows in his goal tally.. No offence but its funny how our own supporters lap up the age old spin. He is far for being a complete footballer but offers enough versatility to be not called limited at-least.
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Re: Crystal Palace vs Arsenal | Premier League 26/10/13

Postby Apollo » Sun Oct 27, 2013 7:12 pm

Arsenal~Fanatic wrote:
Omphi93 wrote:
Arsenal~Fanatic wrote:
Omphi93 wrote:
Arsenal~Fanatic wrote:Ramsey is on track to become the next Walcott. No matter what he does he will always be a limited player. Walcott did not win manage to win over a section of fans despite scoring and assisting the most last season so i can see where this is going with Ramsey. Had Ramsey been playing for another club the the same people slagging him would be calling him phenomenal. Ramsey is not a finished product by any standards but the kind of IMPROVEMENT he has shown in his passing/tackling/dribbling/shooting/energy is something i haven't seen in any premier league player in recent times. After his horrific leg break he has shown that when you put your mind to something you can achieve anything.


Walcott is "limited" in term of his footballing attributes

Ramsey is not not.


LOL i would be happy if you were consistent at-least. You defend Giroud [ i am not one of his haters although i think we need better and different] and literally pounce on anybody the moment somebody makes a comment about him being pretty limited which is a fact and say Walcott is limited when he comfortable out-scored and out-assisted Giroud despite not playing centrally. This is why i say one need to apply the same standards to judge players.


When people reffer to Walcott being limited thats what they are talking about, his range and set of attributes.

Iv yet to see people fans and haters alike refer to Ramsey as being limited, he has a lot of criticism but thats not something that bought up and he wont "always be branded a limited player".

Walcott could be the the greatest Wing in the world and the limited tag would still apply, Its not a comment on form, efficiency,team value its a comment on his set of attributes.


When you talk about the likes of Messi and Ronaldo most players would look limited in front of the array of talent they have. Yes Walcott is limited if you apply those standards. Its funny how Walcott is called limited by those tv pundits and media journalists cos he cannot dribble. Walcott has added a lot to his game over the years. To call a bloke who has great pace, a knack of timing his runs to perfection, possesses good movement off the ball, has good link up play, has a much better final ball these days which shows in his assists, and is a good finisher which shows in his goal tally.. No offence but its funny how our own supporters lap up the age old spin. He is far for being a complete footballer but offers enough versatility to be not called limited at-least.


No one is comparing him to Ronaldo and Messi.

Even if you compared him to lesser, raw, underdeveloped players it would still hold true.

If there is no space to run in behind his game is nullified, its dependent on the space thats why he is reffered to as limited. Its not about dribbling, sure that may be factored in but it goes beyond that.

The reason he is also labbeled as "inconsistent" is because we wont play against high line opposition everyweek , so when there is space he will thrive as all his positive attributes are geared towards that and when there isnt space he wont effectively contribute to the team play. Not saying he cant score a goal or an assist against teams sitting deep as anyone can score against any opposition at anytime before random stats are drawn up, but his game play and overall contribution is significantly refused.

This is how you get frequent matchday posts of theo hasnt done anything, or hasnt been seen on the pitch, or is even playing, but none of this precludes him of popping up with and assist or goal of course, but it does makes him a limirted footballer in terms of his attributes.
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Re: Crystal Palace vs Arsenal | Premier League 26/10/13

Postby Tony_Adams » Sun Oct 27, 2013 7:14 pm

^ good post omphi
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Re: Crystal Palace vs Arsenal | Premier League 26/10/13

Postby Gooner_Gaz » Sun Oct 27, 2013 7:57 pm

Ramsey has been playing unbelievable this season and saying he is limited is just stupid and shows you know nothing about football, i for one feel lucky arsenal fc have him as i think he will go on to be one of the superstars of the future for us, people forget he is only 21 aswell, in regards to walcott personally i felt we missed a trick not signing Navas from seville, exactly the sort of player we could use in our system, people may also say walcott is limited but he has pace to burn and scores important goals so he is considered a big player
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Re: Crystal Palace vs Arsenal | Premier League 26/10/13

Postby Arsenal~Fanatic » Sun Oct 27, 2013 7:59 pm

Omphi93 wrote:
Arsenal~Fanatic wrote:
Omphi93 wrote:
Arsenal~Fanatic wrote:
Omphi93 wrote:
Arsenal~Fanatic wrote:Ramsey is on track to become the next Walcott. No matter what he does he will always be a limited player. Walcott did not win manage to win over a section of fans despite scoring and assisting the most last season so i can see where this is going with Ramsey. Had Ramsey been playing for another club the the same people slagging him would be calling him phenomenal. Ramsey is not a finished product by any standards but the kind of IMPROVEMENT he has shown in his passing/tackling/dribbling/shooting/energy is something i haven't seen in any premier league player in recent times. After his horrific leg break he has shown that when you put your mind to something you can achieve anything.


Walcott is "limited" in term of his footballing attributes

Ramsey is not not.


LOL i would be happy if you were consistent at-least. You defend Giroud [ i am not one of his haters although i think we need better and different] and literally pounce on anybody the moment somebody makes a comment about him being pretty limited which is a fact and say Walcott is limited when he comfortable out-scored and out-assisted Giroud despite not playing centrally. This is why i say one need to apply the same standards to judge players.


When people reffer to Walcott being limited thats what they are talking about, his range and set of attributes.

Iv yet to see people fans and haters alike refer to Ramsey as being limited, he has a lot of criticism but thats not something that bought up and he wont "always be branded a limited player".

Walcott could be the the greatest Wing in the world and the limited tag would still apply, Its not a comment on form, efficiency,team value its a comment on his set of attributes.


When you talk about the likes of Messi and Ronaldo most players would look limited in front of the array of talent they have. Yes Walcott is limited if you apply those standards. Its funny how Walcott is called limited by those tv pundits and media journalists cos he cannot dribble. Walcott has added a lot to his game over the years. To call a bloke who has great pace, a knack of timing his runs to perfection, possesses good movement off the ball, has good link up play, has a much better final ball these days which shows in his assists, and is a good finisher which shows in his goal tally.. No offence but its funny how our own supporters lap up the age old spin. He is far for being a complete footballer but offers enough versatility to be not called limited at-least.


No one is comparing him to Ronaldo and Messi.

Even if you compared him to lesser, raw, underdeveloped players it would still hold true.

If there is no space to run in behind his game is nullified, its dependent on the space thats why he is reffered to as limited. Its not about dribbling, sure that may be factored in but it goes beyond that.

The reason he is also labbeled as "inconsistent" is because we wont play against high line opposition everyweek , so when there is space he will thrive as all his positive attributes are geared towards that and when there isnt space he wont effectively contribute to the team play. Not saying he cant score a goal or an assist against teams sitting deep as anyone can score against any opposition at anytime before random stats are drawn up, but his game play and overall contribution is significantly refused.

This is how you get frequent matchday posts of theo hasnt done anything, or hasnt been seen on the pitch, or is even playing, but none of this precludes him of popping up with and assist or goal of course, but it does makes him a limirted footballer in terms of his attributes.


Has scored against all type of oppositions last year. Despite him having improved a lot in the last couple of seasons his assessment by ''some'' has remained the same. Everybody has his strengths and weaknesses the one that he does well only against high line is again one more of the usual sticks his haters use to beat him with. Its funny how people dismiss his final ball as an odd assist lol when he had the highest assist count last year.
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Re: Crystal Palace vs Arsenal | Premier League 26/10/13

Postby DiamondGooner » Sun Oct 27, 2013 8:20 pm

Gooner_Gaz wrote:Anyone think Giroud was quite poor yesterday.....apart from his goal



Good 1st half, pretty invisible 2nd half and a few mishaps.
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Re: Crystal Palace vs Arsenal | Premier League 26/10/13

Postby ivän itchybüm » Sun Oct 27, 2013 8:31 pm

DiamondGooner wrote:
Gooner_Gaz wrote:Anyone think Giroud was quite poor yesterday.....apart from his goal



Good 1st half, pretty invisible 2nd half and a few mishaps.

As of late he's played well and not scored, yesterday he didn't play well and did score! It's an odd one
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Re: Crystal Palace vs Arsenal | Premier League 26/10/13

Postby Diaby24AFC » Sun Oct 27, 2013 9:16 pm

I don't think he was poor. There was not much he could do since the midfield didn't really do much to support him.

Everything depends on the midfield. If they do shite, of course the striker won't have a fantastic match.
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Re: Crystal Palace vs Arsenal | Premier League 26/10/13

Postby DiamondGooner » Sun Oct 27, 2013 10:53 pm

Diaby24AFC wrote:I don't think he was poor. There was not much he could do since the midfield didn't really do much to support him.

Everything depends on the midfield. If they do shite, of course the striker won't have a fantastic match.


For Giroud maybe but in general that's not exactly true.

Strikers who are not one dimensional i.e Henry, Messi, Suarez even Sturridge etc can come deep, join in with midfield and can be part of the build up or make solo runs past defenders and score.

Its why Arsenal revolutionized the role of a striker when we used to make wingers into ST's because they were used to doing a lot more than just waiting in the box for crosses.
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Re: Crystal Palace vs Arsenal | Premier League 26/10/13

Postby Gooner_Gaz » Sun Oct 27, 2013 11:29 pm

Diaby24AFC wrote:I don't think he was poor. There was not much he could do since the midfield didn't really do much to support him.

Everything depends on the midfield. If they do shite, of course the striker won't have a fantastic match.





In context of the whole game if you watch him closley though he constantly gave the ball away and was never off the floor, i think giroud always needs about 3 chances before he scores aswell, listen im not slating him i think giroud has performed well this season (well above himself) but arsenal have a great midfied so it would be difficult for a striker not to do well with those guys behind you, i just dont think hes top class and the striking position does concern me, i dont know if Podolski will be player up there either when hes back.

Tell you who looks a player, that costa boy that players for athletico, seen him a few times this season, bloody brilliant!


Costa, Benteke, Lewandowski, Benzema


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Re: Crystal Palace vs Arsenal | Premier League 26/10/13

Postby starmandb » Mon Oct 28, 2013 12:03 am

Plymöuth Gööner wrote:Ramsey this season has shown his ability over a few months, Walcott has never been that consistent.

between sept 15th 2012 and 9th feb 2013
southampton at home to sunderland away
theo played 28 games
scored 18 goals and got 13 assists
he must have been f***ing phenominal in that 1 good game in 10 you claim he has during that period
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Re: Crystal Palace vs Arsenal | Premier League 26/10/13

Postby mp4eedz » Mon Oct 28, 2013 12:27 am

Giroud had been in a BIT of a goal slump in the PL. He broke that, but his short passing game has remained been first class!

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Re: Crystal Palace vs Arsenal | Premier League 26/10/13

Postby Massa » Mon Oct 28, 2013 12:39 am

starmandb wrote:
Plymöuth Gööner wrote:Ramsey this season has shown his ability over a few months, Walcott has never been that consistent.

between sept 15th 2012 and 9th feb 2013
southampton at home to sunderland away
theo played 28 games
scored 18 goals and got 13 assists
he must have been f***ing phenominal in that 1 good game in 10 you claim he has during that period

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Re: Crystal Palace vs Arsenal | Premier League 26/10/13

Postby Tony_Adams » Mon Oct 28, 2013 5:11 am

starmandb wrote:
Plymöuth Gööner wrote:Ramsey this season has shown his ability over a few months, Walcott has never been that consistent.

between sept 15th 2012 and 9th feb 2013
southampton at home to sunderland away
theo played 28 games
scored 18 goals and got 13 assists
he must have been f***ing phenominal in that 1 good game in 10 you claim he has during that period


:rolleyes: I was taking the p.

In that period of 28 games, how many of them did he get no goals or assists? I think that stat would be a better indicator.
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