09/02/19 | Huddersfield Town 1-2 Arsenal | Premier League

Re: 09/02/19 | Huddersfield Town 1-2 Arsenal | Premier Leagu

Postby Phil71 » Sun Feb 10, 2019 11:16 am

BrunelGooner wrote:I am sorry but some of you are complete and utter embarrassments.

But before anyone wants to accuse me of being up Emery's backside, please read my comments in this thread where I was severely critical of his tactics and team selection yesterday.

The usual suspects (Angelito in particular and others) have no sense of perspective or understanding at all.

I do not accept this revisionism of Wenger's latter years where we played "attractive football". No - the football we played was equally as drab and where we put in some of the worst, most gutless and spineless displays known to man. Where we passed the ball around with no intensity or purpose. Where any team that showed even a smidgen of physicality, we would fold like a pack of cards.

We already have more away wins this season than we did for the entirety of last season. It's only February.

We have more points and scored more goals than this point last season. We are also not cut adrift from the top 4 (though I do not think we will get it).

We are one of the favourites for the Europa League. We are a solitary point off Manchester United in 4th.

And this is despite us having one of the worst injury crises we've ever had, where 3 of our first choice back 4 are injured, 3 important players have had season-ending injuries, we've got the worst squad out of all the top 6 and we have strapped for cash (mainly down to self-sabotage admittedly).

People talk about us winning cups and competing for top 4 under Wenger when he's the reason the squad is in the sorry state it is in currently. Tell me - did winning 3 FA Cups in 4 years mean we had progressed? Were fans happy? Or were people calling for Wenger's head despite the cup wins because all they did were mask our structural deficiencies?

When other clubs were making movements, looking to improve and increase their chances of success, he was dithering because he didn't want to kill Giroud's career...

When you have ex-Arsenal players saying that the coaching staff at the club weren't good enough, yet Wenger persisted with keeping them anyway, is it any wonder we haven't seen any development in our players?

When David Ornstein - one of the most reliable sources of intel there is - is saying that people within the club felt Wenger had too much power and authority at the club to the point where he felt infallible, people are acting as if pastures new was not only necessary, but needed for the sake of the club's future.

It's Emery's first season, you're expecting him to win everything in sight when the main priority for this season is to get into the CL (which has to take precedence over a trophy in the short-term due to the additional income). He was always going to make some mistakes in his first season.

As for money being an excuse - people can say it is an excuse all they want, it doesn't change the reality. A HUGE part of the reason why we are in the mess we are in is because we wasted money on the wrong players either through transfers or contract extensions. Other clubs were bound to catch up. This has been an issue that preceded Emery.

Our defensive issues have been prevalent well before Emery was manager. In fact, it's been all people have spoken about us for the last 10 years. It takes time to change mentalities, let alone personnel.

As for having no recognised identity, I'm not sure what you want me to say. We were playing good stuff up until December time and since then we have not played that well, yeah. Injuries to your key players will influence that, though. When you then factor in the lack of quality and depth we had already, it doesn't exactly enhance our chances of playing good football.

So, considering all the external and internal factors, Emery's not done a bad job so far.

Is he faultless? Absolutely not. I have been critical of him plenty of times.

But I refuse to be drawn into this doom mongering when it is abundantly clear some of you never wanted him to succeed in the first place.

To which I say: go f**k yourselves.


Well said
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Re: 09/02/19 | Huddersfield Town 1-2 Arsenal | Premier Leagu

Postby gooney » Sun Feb 10, 2019 11:55 am

EliteKiller wrote:Interesting game, we certainly were not in 'complete control' but we always had the upper hand. One of the areas we've been weak in for a long time is 'putting the foot in' and giving away cheap free-kicks to break up opponents play ... City and Spuds are masters at 'the niggle foul' against Huddersfield we committed 17 fouls pretty sure that's a season's high, most of these were done to break up Huddersfield's play, that's clearly deliberate tactics.

Whilst we still look a bit all over the place there are signs that Emery is starting to impose himself on the squad, today with no Auba, Ramsey, Ozil, Xhaka I think we got a look at where our future lies ... Auba will be back the other three maybe not ....

we didnt have upper hand....what match were you watching. We were dominated and pushed back by the worst team in the league by some distance. They havent scored a goal in over 10 hours and has terrible finishing because their players are not PL standard. But they dominated us and pushed us back. They had more possession, completed more than 100 passes against us. In the last 14 league games they have lost 13 and drew 1. They havent completed as many passes against any other team where they had that many more passes. We were terrible and some of you really need to wake up and stop being so small time. We are fecking Arsenal....one of the biggest clubs in the world
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Re: 09/02/19 | Huddersfield Town 1-2 Arsenal | Premier Leagu

Postby Zedie » Sun Feb 10, 2019 12:40 pm

Phil71 wrote:
BrunelGooner wrote:I am sorry but some of you are complete and utter embarrassments.

But before anyone wants to accuse me of being up Emery's backside, please read my comments in this thread where I was severely critical of his tactics and team selection yesterday.

The usual suspects (Angelito in particular and others) have no sense of perspective or understanding at all.

I do not accept this revisionism of Wenger's latter years where we played "attractive football". No - the football we played was equally as drab and where we put in some of the worst, most gutless and spineless displays known to man. Where we passed the ball around with no intensity or purpose. Where any team that showed even a smidgen of physicality, we would fold like a pack of cards.

We already have more away wins this season than we did for the entirety of last season. It's only February.

We have more points and scored more goals than this point last season. We are also not cut adrift from the top 4 (though I do not think we will get it).

We are one of the favourites for the Europa League. We are a solitary point off Manchester United in 4th.

And this is despite us having one of the worst injury crises we've ever had, where 3 of our first choice back 4 are injured, 3 important players have had season-ending injuries, we've got the worst squad out of all the top 6 and we have strapped for cash (mainly down to self-sabotage admittedly).

People talk about us winning cups and competing for top 4 under Wenger when he's the reason the squad is in the sorry state it is in currently. Tell me - did winning 3 FA Cups in 4 years mean we had progressed? Were fans happy? Or were people calling for Wenger's head despite the cup wins because all they did were mask our structural deficiencies?

When other clubs were making movements, looking to improve and increase their chances of success, he was dithering because he didn't want to kill Giroud's career...

When you have ex-Arsenal players saying that the coaching staff at the club weren't good enough, yet Wenger persisted with keeping them anyway, is it any wonder we haven't seen any development in our players?

When David Ornstein - one of the most reliable sources of intel there is - is saying that people within the club felt Wenger had too much power and authority at the club to the point where he felt infallible, people are acting as if pastures new was not only necessary, but needed for the sake of the club's future.

It's Emery's first season, you're expecting him to win everything in sight when the main priority for this season is to get into the CL (which has to take precedence over a trophy in the short-term due to the additional income). He was always going to make some mistakes in his first season.

As for money being an excuse - people can say it is an excuse all they want, it doesn't change the reality. A HUGE part of the reason why we are in the mess we are in is because we wasted money on the wrong players either through transfers or contract extensions. Other clubs were bound to catch up. This has been an issue that preceded Emery.

Our defensive issues have been prevalent well before Emery was manager. In fact, it's been all people have spoken about us for the last 10 years. It takes time to change mentalities, let alone personnel.

As for having no recognised identity, I'm not sure what you want me to say. We were playing good stuff up until December time and since then we have not played that well, yeah. Injuries to your key players will influence that, though. When you then factor in the lack of quality and depth we had already, it doesn't exactly enhance our chances of playing good football.

So, considering all the external and internal factors, Emery's not done a bad job so far.

Is he faultless? Absolutely not. I have been critical of him plenty of times.

But I refuse to be drawn into this doom mongering when it is abundantly clear some of you never wanted him to succeed in the first place.

To which I say: go f**k yourselves.


Well said


Bang on.
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Re: 09/02/19 | Huddersfield Town 1-2 Arsenal | Premier Leagu

Postby Ach » Sun Feb 10, 2019 1:43 pm

Zedie wrote:
Phil71 wrote:
BrunelGooner wrote:I am sorry but some of you are complete and utter embarrassments.

But before anyone wants to accuse me of being up Emery's backside, please read my comments in this thread where I was severely critical of his tactics and team selection yesterday.

The usual suspects (Angelito in particular and others) have no sense of perspective or understanding at all.

I do not accept this revisionism of Wenger's latter years where we played "attractive football". No - the football we played was equally as drab and where we put in some of the worst, most gutless and spineless displays known to man. Where we passed the ball around with no intensity or purpose. Where any team that showed even a smidgen of physicality, we would fold like a pack of cards.

We already have more away wins this season than we did for the entirety of last season. It's only February.

We have more points and scored more goals than this point last season. We are also not cut adrift from the top 4 (though I do not think we will get it).

We are one of the favourites for the Europa League. We are a solitary point off Manchester United in 4th.

And this is despite us having one of the worst injury crises we've ever had, where 3 of our first choice back 4 are injured, 3 important players have had season-ending injuries, we've got the worst squad out of all the top 6 and we have strapped for cash (mainly down to self-sabotage admittedly).

People talk about us winning cups and competing for top 4 under Wenger when he's the reason the squad is in the sorry state it is in currently. Tell me - did winning 3 FA Cups in 4 years mean we had progressed? Were fans happy? Or were people calling for Wenger's head despite the cup wins because all they did were mask our structural deficiencies?

When other clubs were making movements, looking to improve and increase their chances of success, he was dithering because he didn't want to kill Giroud's career...

When you have ex-Arsenal players saying that the coaching staff at the club weren't good enough, yet Wenger persisted with keeping them anyway, is it any wonder we haven't seen any development in our players?

When David Ornstein - one of the most reliable sources of intel there is - is saying that people within the club felt Wenger had too much power and authority at the club to the point where he felt infallible, people are acting as if pastures new was not only necessary, but needed for the sake of the club's future.

It's Emery's first season, you're expecting him to win everything in sight when the main priority for this season is to get into the CL (which has to take precedence over a trophy in the short-term due to the additional income). He was always going to make some mistakes in his first season.

As for money being an excuse - people can say it is an excuse all they want, it doesn't change the reality. A HUGE part of the reason why we are in the mess we are in is because we wasted money on the wrong players either through transfers or contract extensions. Other clubs were bound to catch up. This has been an issue that preceded Emery.

Our defensive issues have been prevalent well before Emery was manager. In fact, it's been all people have spoken about us for the last 10 years. It takes time to change mentalities, let alone personnel.

As for having no recognised identity, I'm not sure what you want me to say. We were playing good stuff up until December time and since then we have not played that well, yeah. Injuries to your key players will influence that, though. When you then factor in the lack of quality and depth we had already, it doesn't exactly enhance our chances of playing good football.

So, considering all the external and internal factors, Emery's not done a bad job so far.

Is he faultless? Absolutely not. I have been critical of him plenty of times.

But I refuse to be drawn into this doom mongering when it is abundantly clear some of you never wanted him to succeed in the first place.

To which I say: go f**k yourselves.


Well said


Bang on.
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Re: 09/02/19 | Huddersfield Town 1-2 Arsenal | Premier Leagu

Postby Santi » Sun Feb 10, 2019 2:16 pm

insert long post trying to be as central as possible while still having a dig at wenger

400 insta-likes & a :clap: from chicken nuggets
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Re: 09/02/19 | Huddersfield Town 1-2 Arsenal | Premier Leagu

Postby Angelito » Sun Feb 10, 2019 3:58 pm

Santi wrote:insert long post trying to be as central as possible while still having a dig at wenger

400 insta-likes & a :clap: from chicken nuggets


As usual, our hero Zedie will be too late to the party.

Soz Zed man, I love ya but we know history repeats itself. :P
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Re: 09/02/19 | Huddersfield Town 1-2 Arsenal | Premier Leagu

Postby BrunelGooner » Sun Feb 10, 2019 9:44 pm

Santi wrote:insert long post trying to be as central as possible while still having a dig at wenger

400 insta-likes & a :clap: from chicken nuggets


Or...it could be my actual opinion on things? Which, again if you want to check my posting history, you will see I have been pretty consistent with.

I just don't subscribe to this overbearing negativity and myopia that yourself, Angelito, Swipe Right and a few others have.
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Re: 09/02/19 | Huddersfield Town 1-2 Arsenal | Premier Leagu

Postby Power n Glory » Sun Feb 10, 2019 11:33 pm

BrunelGooner wrote:
Santi wrote:insert long post trying to be as central as possible while still having a dig at wenger

400 insta-likes & a :clap: from chicken nuggets


Or...it could be my actual opinion on things? Which, again if you want to check my posting history, you will see I have been pretty consistent with.

I just don't subscribe to this overbearing negativity and myopia that yourself, Angelito, Swipe Right and a few others have.


You say that but seem to be blind to the overbearing negativity surrounding Iwobi and AMN. It's a bit of a double standard. Personally, I think developing players need support and especially if they are home grown, but nobody is exempt from scrutiny and criticism. I don't see why people are looking so far beyond Emery and his coaching especially when considering the amount of scrutiny Wenger was under in his final years. Fron his training methods, staff around him to involvement with transfers. That level of scrutiny should be extended to Emery. It doesn't matter how long he's been here, he shouldn't just have a free pass because that sort of leniency is never extended to the players.
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Re: 09/02/19 | Huddersfield Town 1-2 Arsenal | Premier Leagu

Postby Zedie » Sun Feb 10, 2019 11:46 pm

Power n Glory wrote:
BrunelGooner wrote:
Santi wrote:insert long post trying to be as central as possible while still having a dig at wenger

400 insta-likes & a :clap: from chicken nuggets


Or...it could be my actual opinion on things? Which, again if you want to check my posting history, you will see I have been pretty consistent with.

I just don't subscribe to this overbearing negativity and myopia that yourself, Angelito, Swipe Right and a few others have.


You say that but seem to be blind to the overbearing negativity surrounding Iwobi and AMN. It's a bit of a double standard. Personally, I think developing players need support and especially if they are home grown, but nobody is exempt from scrutiny and criticism. I don't see why people are looking so far beyond Emery and his coaching especially when considering the amount of scrutiny Wenger was under in his final years. Fron his training methods, staff around him to involvement with transfers. That level of scrutiny should be extended to Emery. It doesn't matter how long he's been here, he shouldn't just have a free pass because that sort of leniency is never extended to the players.


Hes hardly being given a free slate is he? Hes working with a mostly unchanged squad that already had gaping issues in the 11.

We have players like iwobi, mustafi, Monreal, lichtensteiner, xhaka to name a few as regulars in our first team that wouldn't make the other 5s first team.

I'm really not sure what you expect Emery to do in his first season without large scale investment and time or should we adopt the manager roulette approach until someone magically makes those players to play beyond their evident limitations?

I can't be arsed to argue this anymore, it's probably easier to just let people ignore the blindingly obvious and stick pins into a guy that's just starting on the road with us.

You lot would have had klopp out in his first season if he was with us.
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Re: 09/02/19 | Huddersfield Town 1-2 Arsenal | Premier Leagu

Postby Power n Glory » Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:11 am

Zedie wrote:
Power n Glory wrote:
BrunelGooner wrote:
Santi wrote:insert long post trying to be as central as possible while still having a dig at wenger

400 insta-likes & a :clap: from chicken nuggets


Or...it could be my actual opinion on things? Which, again if you want to check my posting history, you will see I have been pretty consistent with.

I just don't subscribe to this overbearing negativity and myopia that yourself, Angelito, Swipe Right and a few others have.


You say that but seem to be blind to the overbearing negativity surrounding Iwobi and AMN. It's a bit of a double standard. Personally, I think developing players need support and especially if they are home grown, but nobody is exempt from scrutiny and criticism. I don't see why people are looking so far beyond Emery and his coaching especially when considering the amount of scrutiny Wenger was under in his final years. Fron his training methods, staff around him to involvement with transfers. That level of scrutiny should be extended to Emery. It doesn't matter how long he's been here, he shouldn't just have a free pass because that sort of leniency is never extended to the players.


Hes hardly being given a free slate is he? Hes working with a mostly unchanged squad that already had gaping issues in the 11.

We have players like iwobi, mustafi, Monreal, lichtensteiner, xhaka to name a few as regulars in our first team that wouldn't make the other 5s first team.

I'm really not sure what you expect Emery to do in his first season without large scale investment and time or should we adopt the manager roulette approach until someone magically makes those players to play beyond their evident limitations?

I can't be arsed to argue this anymore, it's probably easier to just let people ignore the blindingly obvious and stick pins into a guy that's just starting on the road with us.

You lot would have had klopp out in his first season if he was with us.


It's best not to argue the point because you approach it the same way each time. Just merely asking you to think critically and analyse the problems brings up this irrational reaction.

Emery will need to bring I his own players but everyone that keeps jumping to that conclusion has no idea what Emeryball actually looks like or the type of players required. Nobody has even thought about how much it will cost or whether it can be achieved with the owner we have.

It's not an unchanged squad. We've brought in players and he's personally spoken with all of the players and has decided on who he wants to keep and who he wants to discard or send out on loan.

From what we were told about the hiring process, Emery told the Board that he could improve individual players in this squad and improve our defending. That hasn't happened. It's failure to get the basics right that's disappointing.

Anyway, as said before, if a driver has bad driving habits, a new car won't solve the problem. If I hand over my car keys to someone I've never seen drive before, I'm going to be watching them closely and a little on edge until they have proven they're safe and I get the destination safely. Same principle for football. No I idea why you're turning the blinders off and critical thought has gone out of the window for the manager of all people.
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Re: 09/02/19 | Huddersfield Town 1-2 Arsenal | Premier Leagu

Postby BrunelGooner » Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:16 am

Power n Glory wrote:
BrunelGooner wrote:
Santi wrote:insert long post trying to be as central as possible while still having a dig at wenger

400 insta-likes & a :clap: from chicken nuggets


Or...it could be my actual opinion on things? Which, again if you want to check my posting history, you will see I have been pretty consistent with.

I just don't subscribe to this overbearing negativity and myopia that yourself, Angelito, Swipe Right and a few others have.


You say that but seem to be blind to the overbearing negativity surrounding Iwobi and AMN. It's a bit of a double standard.


I haven't and it isn't. I'm not really sure what your point is here.

Yes there has been a lot of criticism for Iwobi and AMN. I haven't said I want either of them to leave permanently, I think the former is a good squad player but is not good enough to start for us. He is going to be 23 and this is his 4th season playing with the first XI. He's still young enough to improve, so I haven't written him off. But we can't put our plans on hold in the hope he may become good. So we do need an upgrade out wide. As I said on the AMN thread already, he needs to be given game time in the position he prefers because he is constantly being tinkered with which hasn't helped his development. But I do think he needs a loan move before we decide what to do next.

In any case, this is Emery's first season with a squad that, by and large, isn't particularly good. And he's had one transfer window where we spent £70m which is peanuts in this day and age.

So he is bound to get a bit more leeway than the other players, who have been at the club for longer and haven't showed significant enough improvement.
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Re: 09/02/19 | Huddersfield Town 1-2 Arsenal | Premier Leagu

Postby BrunelGooner » Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:23 am

Power n Glory wrote:Anyway, as said before, if a driver has bad driving habits, a new car won't solve the problem. If I hand over my car keys to someone I've never seen drive before, I'm going to be watching them closely and a little on edge until they have proven they're safe and I get the destination safely. Same principle for football. No I idea why you're turning the blinders off and critical thought has gone out of the window for the manager of all people.



What if the driver doesn't have bad driving habits, but has been given a faulty car and hasn't been given sufficient money to fix its main problems? There's only so much a driver can do until it breaks down again. To me, that is more of the case we have here than the analogy you have provided.
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Re: 09/02/19 | Huddersfield Town 1-2 Arsenal | Premier Leagu

Postby DiamondGooner » Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:24 am

Santi wrote:insert long post trying to be as central as possible while still having a dig at wenger

400 insta-likes & a :clap: from chicken nuggets


I actually can't believe that this r***rd along with Angelito and his band of well known trolls are going around the forum attacking people for supporting AFC.

When I say AFC I mean the club, the manager, the players etc.

By the way Brunel, excellent post, reasonable and common sense thinking is being starved out atm, these sorts of posts should be the norm, not the exception.

PS - Just to note, we don't think Emery is beyond critic, I could list a number of things I'd like him to improve but this Emery Out movement is beyond sense, let the guy have a season at least, AFC are going to give him that, is it really worth a hate campaign when he's not going anywhere yet?

To think a respected Mod is going around in toe with a bunch of trolls who were formerly banned on numerous occasions jumping on AFC fans is beyond ridiculous.
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Re: 09/02/19 | Huddersfield Town 1-2 Arsenal | Premier Leagu

Postby Angelito » Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:32 am

And we all know where the abuse is coming from or the band that's hell bent on name calling and attacking fellow members here—just because they have a different, a more critical outlook on the situation.

Let's not take the moral high ground.
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Re: 09/02/19 | Huddersfield Town 1-2 Arsenal | Premier Leagu

Postby Power n Glory » Mon Feb 11, 2019 12:38 am

BrunelGooner wrote:
Power n Glory wrote:Anyway, as said before, if a driver has bad driving habits, a new car won't solve the problem. If I hand over my car keys to someone I've never seen drive before, I'm going to be watching them closely and a little on edge until they have proven they're safe and I get the destination safely. Same principle for football. No I idea why you're turning the blinders off and critical thought has gone out of the window for the manager of all people.



What if the driver doesn't have bad driving habits, but has been given a faulty car and hasn't been given sufficient money to fix its main problems? There's only so much a driver can do until it breaks down again. To me, that is more of the case we have here than the analogy you have provided.


How can anyone put the blame on Wenger if that's your argument? It's flawed thinking. Aren't we doomed in that case? If we're saying the manager is perfectly fine but it's the Board that won't provide the money to build a better squad, what hope is there?

A faulty car doesn't finish the race or get off the starting line. Also, even with a faulty car, you should be able to demonstrate the basics. We haven't seen this team defend as unit, press, we haven't tactically out foxed our opponents, I also suspect the training is contributing to our injury list... there is a lot we can look at to judge the manager on before just jumping to the transfer window conclusion. That's the same flawed thinking that kept Wenger out of the spotlight for so long. In fact, by that logic, it could be argued to this day that Wenger wasn't given enough funds to compete. But you could argue that point for any chequebook manager.
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