Aston Villa Vs Arsenal | Premiership 21/12/2011

Re: Aston Villa Vs Arsenal | Premiership 21/12/2011

Postby friedslice » Thu Dec 22, 2011 4:26 am

starmandb wrote:
gooner_7890 wrote:I thought we looked rather lacklustre tonight and didn't really deserve to win but we managed to grind out the victory and come away with all three points, so i'm happy with the result.

However, i think tonight's performance shows we still need to add some quality in the January transfer window.

we scored more than the opposition
of coarse we desrved to win


Biggest load of nonsense I've read on this forum I'm affraid boss.

Are you suggesting that in your decades of watching football every side that's won has deserved to? because I'll f***ing tell you now our name should be on the FA Cup 2001 instead of Liverpool and there's more examples every week throughout football.

There's a big difference between getting something and deserving something and that's evident in everything in life.
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Re: Aston Villa Vs Arsenal | Premiership 21/12/2011

Postby Arsenal~Fanatic » Thu Dec 22, 2011 4:36 am

friedslice wrote:
Arsenal~Fanatic wrote:Gervinho , offered nothing defensively today and was wasteful again in the final third . second bad game on the bounce for him..


No surprises you point it out.

He was still far better than Walcott, of whom is a far inferiour player yet you regularly praise whilst criticise Gervinho.

At the end of the day most were shit yesterday.

It's the same old story that i've repeated in nearly every post match analysis, a 5th placed team playing like a 5th placed team.
Sure, we have the talent and decent players to scrape through matches against the teams lower than us, and lets be frank, that's all we've managed against Stoke, Sunderland, Swansea, Villa etc etc. then we fall short when we face a decent side.
Quite simply we have a good team with a real lack of top quality stars that can take us to another level and a) ensure we finish teams off easier b) take us over the line in close games and c) get us challenging and beating the top teams regularly.

Frimpong and Ramsey were terrible yesterday and both have been for most of the season. I really can't see how either get such high praise on here.
Arteta playing as a DM?! why? He's left annonymous throughout most matches despite being quite a creative player and wearing the number 8 :BangHead:
Walcott is annonymous for most matches, he gives away simple passes and falls over.
Gervinho is playing in his first 4 months of EPL football and over the course of the season has looked twice as threatening as Theo has - who we've been waiting very patiently for to have that 'breakthrough' year. He's still fitting in slowly and is making a few mistakes, he's looked threatening at least which is something I can't say about anyone else bar RVP.

Mertesacker is a donkey, he's slow to react and I've never seen him jump (something which had me screaming at the screen v Citeh).

Add to it we've got nothing on the bench to come on, no support for RVP and no depth.

We got a very very good win yesterday, but it was just the typical lacklustre performance, too many 'decent' players with not enough quality of any substance and then a defensive error costing us a goal....same old story.



Mate no offence but were you watching a different game ?

Were we so bad ? I have my issues against the team but to say the entire team barring RVP is trash is hollow .We are on a good run and several other teams would love to be in our shooes . Yeah we have holes in our squad and we need to fill them and that too in January cos United and Chelsea will spend for sure . Walcott had a good game yesterday and it reflects in his ratings in the ratings thread . Gervinho , did he look threatening yesterday ? I only stated facts . He had a poor game on the weekend and this one. So am i targeting him for the heck off it ? Lets not make a sweeping generalization out of everything . Mertescaker was fairly solid, nothing great but did his job. Arteta was decent and yeah i agree Ramsey was poor against city and yesterday as well . He has to stop his show-boating in critical areas of the pitch . The win wasn't lacklustre but a midweek fixture especially after the City game was expected to be like this . I have a couple of issues regarding a lack of an advanced play-maker and a Striker to cover RVP but other than that we are looking good . I repeat it would be criminal not to sign a couple of players in January but that's for another thread.
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Re: Aston Villa Vs Arsenal | Premiership 21/12/2011

Postby VCC » Thu Dec 22, 2011 4:45 am

Gervinho is exactly what he is another work in progress,he does not have a quick football brain and needs to learn how effective a early cross is,as i have said in previous weeks he tries to be to flash and needs to many touches....................but he still gets into good positions and is definatley worth continuing with.........................Rambo needs a rest.Arteta is consistant and that is exactly what you need
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Re: Aston Villa Vs Arsenal | Premiership 21/12/2011

Postby Arsenal~Fanatic » Thu Dec 22, 2011 5:07 am

VCC wrote:Gervinho is exactly what he is another work in progress,he does not have a quick football brain and needs to learn how effective a early cross is,as i have said in previous weeks he tries to be to flash and needs to many touches....................but he still gets into good positions and is definatley worth continuing with.........................Rambo needs a rest.Arteta is consistant and that is exactly what you need


Gervinho has a lot of positives going for him-pace , dribbling ability ,movement but has two obvious flaws

1] finishing.. enough said

2] does not track back and defend . yesterday When Villa were having a good spell early in the second half , Gervinho disowned Vermaelen .

As you say another work in progress , far from being a finished article but somebody you would love to have around.
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Re: Aston Villa Vs Arsenal | Premiership 21/12/2011

Postby friedslice » Thu Dec 22, 2011 7:47 am

Arsenal~Fanatic wrote:
friedslice wrote:
Arsenal~Fanatic wrote:Gervinho , offered nothing defensively today and was wasteful again in the final third . second bad game on the bounce for him..


No surprises you point it out.

He was still far better than Walcott, of whom is a far inferiour player yet you regularly praise whilst criticise Gervinho.

At the end of the day most were shit yesterday.

It's the same old story that i've repeated in nearly every post match analysis, a 5th placed team playing like a 5th placed team.
Sure, we have the talent and decent players to scrape through matches against the teams lower than us, and lets be frank, that's all we've managed against Stoke, Sunderland, Swansea, Villa etc etc. then we fall short when we face a decent side.
Quite simply we have a good team with a real lack of top quality stars that can take us to another level and a) ensure we finish teams off easier b) take us over the line in close games and c) get us challenging and beating the top teams regularly.

Frimpong and Ramsey were terrible yesterday and both have been for most of the season. I really can't see how either get such high praise on here.
Arteta playing as a DM?! why? He's left annonymous throughout most matches despite being quite a creative player and wearing the number 8 :BangHead:
Walcott is annonymous for most matches, he gives away simple passes and falls over.
Gervinho is playing in his first 4 months of EPL football and over the course of the season has looked twice as threatening as Theo has - who we've been waiting very patiently for to have that 'breakthrough' year. He's still fitting in slowly and is making a few mistakes, he's looked threatening at least which is something I can't say about anyone else bar RVP.

Mertesacker is a donkey, he's slow to react and I've never seen him jump (something which had me screaming at the screen v Citeh).

Add to it we've got nothing on the bench to come on, no support for RVP and no depth.

We got a very very good win yesterday, but it was just the typical lacklustre performance, too many 'decent' players with not enough quality of any substance and then a defensive error costing us a goal....same old story.



Mate no offence but were you watching a different game ?

Were we so bad ? I have my issues against the team but to say the entire team barring RVP is trash is hollow .We are on a good run and several other teams would love to be in our shooes . Yeah we have holes in our squad and we need to fill them and that too in January cos United and Chelsea will spend for sure . Walcott had a good game yesterday and it reflects in his ratings in the ratings thread . Gervinho , did he look threatening yesterday ? I only stated facts . He had a poor game on the weekend and this one. So am i targeting him for the heck off it ? Lets not make a sweeping generalization out of everything . Mertescaker was fairly solid, nothing great but did his job. Arteta was decent and yeah i agree Ramsey was poor against city and yesterday as well . He has to stop his show-boating in critical areas of the pitch . The win wasn't lacklustre but a midweek fixture especially after the City game was expected to be like this . I have a couple of issues regarding a lack of an advanced play-maker and a Striker to cover RVP but other than that we are looking good . I repeat it would be criminal not to sign a couple of players in January but that's for another thread.



I've watched the game through twice, live, and then again on replay.
What did Walcott do other than turn the defender for the penalty? I've watched 180 minutes of it and still can't find how he deserves a decent rating for being completely annonymous throughout despite being one of 3 attackers.

Gervinho wasn't great, im not defending him, on the whole i just think he's been far better than theo.

I've not said our squad is trash, I was referring to this performance, and yes, we were bad. But my opinion of this squad has been the same throughout this season (and you can go back and read my comments in each match thread). It's the same old story, plenty of pretty football but little end product, due solely to us having a good squad without the added world class talent (RVP aside - no surprises we rely on him so much).

At the end of the day we have decent players, and that's it. Ramsey, Arteta, Song are all 'decent' players in my book.
Decent is 5th place, that's why we're sitting around there. Decent enough to beat most poor teams (just) but will struggle when really tested, and i think that is EXACTLY what we've seen in most matches this season.
Throughout our good run we've scraped through against inferior sides, that's the sign of a decent team, but one several QUALITY players away from making the next much needed step forward.

This team is good enough to get 4th, it's also poor enough to not. It could go either way depending on whether we manage to keep scraping these important points. If we had some more quality in the squad we wouldn't need to be scraping through matches like this, i think we all agree on that.

Quite simply we need a better standard of player than Arteta, Ramsey, Song, Walcott, Santos, Frimpong etc if we really want to win titles. They're good players to have if we have 3-4 world class players mixed in (much like Henry/Bergy/Vieira mixed with Parlour/Ljungberg etc), but a team of 'decent' players as we have will struggle to get top 4, and that's exactly what we're doing.

Next week will be the same and so to will the one after that.
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Re: Aston Villa Vs Arsenal | Premiership 21/12/2011

Postby starmandb » Thu Dec 22, 2011 9:35 am

friedslice wrote:
Arsenal~Fanatic wrote:Gervinho , offered nothing defensively today and was wasteful again in the final third . second bad game on the bounce for him..


No surprises you point it out.

He was still far better than Walcott, of whom is a far inferiour player yet you regularly praise whilst criticise Gervinho.

At the end of the day most were shit yesterday.

It's the same old story that i've repeated in nearly every post match analysis, a 5th placed team playing like a 5th placed team.
Sure, we have the talent and decent players to scrape through matches against the teams lower than us, and lets be frank, that's all we've managed against Stoke, Sunderland, Swansea, Villa etc etc. then we fall short when we face a decent side.
Quite simply we have a good team with a real lack of top quality stars that can take us to another level and a) ensure we finish teams off easier b) take us over the line in close games and c) get us challenging and beating the top teams regularly.

Frimpong and Ramsey were terrible yesterday and both have been for most of the season. I really can't see how either get such high praise on here.
Arteta playing as a DM?! why? He's left annonymous throughout most matches despite being quite a creative player and wearing the number 8 :BangHead:
Walcott is annonymous for most matches, he gives away simple passes and falls over.
Gervinho is playing in his first 4 months of EPL football and over the course of the season has looked twice as threatening as Theo has - who we've been waiting very patiently for to have that 'breakthrough' year. He's still fitting in slowly and is making a few mistakes, he's looked threatening at least which is something I can't say about anyone else bar RVP.

Mertesacker is a donkey, he's slow to react and I've never seen him jump (something which had me screaming at the screen v Citeh).

Add to it we've got nothing on the bench to come on, no support for RVP and no depth.

We got a very very good win yesterday, but it was just the typical lacklustre performance, too many 'decent' players with not enough quality of any substance and then a defensive error costing us a goal....same old story.

chelsea 3 arsenal 5
winner scored last night by benayoun off the bench
i agree more needed from theo but he did earn penalty
as for gervinho i thought he was our best player at man city
Last edited by starmandb on Thu Dec 22, 2011 9:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Aston Villa Vs Arsenal | Premiership 21/12/2011

Postby starmandb » Thu Dec 22, 2011 9:38 am

friedslice wrote:
starmandb wrote:
gooner_7890 wrote:I thought we looked rather lacklustre tonight and didn't really deserve to win but we managed to grind out the victory and come away with all three points, so i'm happy with the result.

However, i think tonight's performance shows we still need to add some quality in the January transfer window.

we scored more than the opposition
of coarse we desrved to win


Biggest load of nonsense I've read on this forum I'm affraid boss.

Are you suggesting that in your decades of watching football every side that's won has deserved to? because I'll f***ing tell you now our name should be on the FA Cup 2001 instead of Liverpool and there's more examples every week throughout football.

There's a big difference between getting something and deserving something and that's evident in everything in life.

it means nothing.go to the pay out window of a betting shop and try getting your money because you deserved to win
all you will draw is your breath.
i don,t make excuses if we lose so i,m damn sure i aint gonna do it if we win
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Re: Aston Villa Vs Arsenal | Premiership 21/12/2011

Postby starmandb » Thu Dec 22, 2011 9:56 am

friedslice wrote:
Arsenal~Fanatic wrote:
friedslice wrote:
Arsenal~Fanatic wrote:Gervinho , offered nothing defensively today and was wasteful again in the final third . second bad game on the bounce for him..


No surprises you point it out.

He was still far better than Walcott, of whom is a far inferiour player yet you regularly praise whilst criticise Gervinho.

At the end of the day most were shit yesterday.

It's the same old story that i've repeated in nearly every post match analysis, a 5th placed team playing like a 5th placed team.
Sure, we have the talent and decent players to scrape through matches against the teams lower than us, and lets be frank, that's all we've managed against Stoke, Sunderland, Swansea, Villa etc etc. then we fall short when we face a decent side.
Quite simply we have a good team with a real lack of top quality stars that can take us to another level and a) ensure we finish teams off easier b) take us over the line in close games and c) get us challenging and beating the top teams regularly.

Frimpong and Ramsey were terrible yesterday and both have been for most of the season. I really can't see how either get such high praise on here.
Arteta playing as a DM?! why? He's left annonymous throughout most matches despite being quite a creative player and wearing the number 8 :BangHead:
Walcott is annonymous for most matches, he gives away simple passes and falls over.
Gervinho is playing in his first 4 months of EPL football and over the course of the season has looked twice as threatening as Theo has - who we've been waiting very patiently for to have that 'breakthrough' year. He's still fitting in slowly and is making a few mistakes, he's looked threatening at least which is something I can't say about anyone else bar RVP.

Mertesacker is a donkey, he's slow to react and I've never seen him jump (something which had me screaming at the screen v Citeh).

Add to it we've got nothing on the bench to come on, no support for RVP and no depth.

We got a very very good win yesterday, but it was just the typical lacklustre performance, too many 'decent' players with not enough quality of any substance and then a defensive error costing us a goal....same old story.



Mate no offence but were you watching a different game ?

Were we so bad ? I have my issues against the team but to say the entire team barring RVP is trash is hollow .We are on a good run and several other teams would love to be in our shooes . Yeah we have holes in our squad and we need to fill them and that too in January cos United and Chelsea will spend for sure . Walcott had a good game yesterday and it reflects in his ratings in the ratings thread . Gervinho , did he look threatening yesterday ? I only stated facts . He had a poor game on the weekend and this one. So am i targeting him for the heck off it ? Lets not make a sweeping generalization out of everything . Mertescaker was fairly solid, nothing great but did his job. Arteta was decent and yeah i agree Ramsey was poor against city and yesterday as well . He has to stop his show-boating in critical areas of the pitch . The win wasn't lacklustre but a midweek fixture especially after the City game was expected to be like this . I have a couple of issues regarding a lack of an advanced play-maker and a Striker to cover RVP but other than that we are looking good . I repeat it would be criminal not to sign a couple of players in January but that's for another thread.



I've watched the game through twice, live, and then again on replay.
What did Walcott do other than turn the defender for the penalty? I've watched 180 minutes of it and still can't find how he deserves a decent rating for being completely annonymous throughout despite being one of 3 attackers.

Gervinho wasn't great, im not defending him, on the whole i just think he's been far better than theo.

I've not said our squad is trash, I was referring to this performance, and yes, we were bad. But my opinion of this squad has been the same throughout this season (and you can go back and read my comments in each match thread). It's the same old story, plenty of pretty football but little end product, due solely to us having a good squad without the added world class talent (RVP aside - no surprises we rely on him so much).

At the end of the day we have decent players, and that's it. Ramsey, Arteta, Song are all 'decent' players in my book.
Decent is 5th place, that's why we're sitting around there. Decent enough to beat most poor teams (just) but will struggle when really tested, and i think that is EXACTLY what we've seen in most matches this season.
Throughout our good run we've scraped through against inferior sides, that's the sign of a decent team, but one several QUALITY players away from making the next much needed step forward.

This team is good enough to get 4th, it's also poor enough to not. It could go either way depending on whether we manage to keep scraping these important points. If we had some more quality in the squad we wouldn't need to be scraping through matches like this, i think we all agree on that.

Quite simply we need a better standard of player than Arteta, Ramsey, Song, Walcott, Santos, Frimpong etc if we really want to win titles. They're good players to have if we have 3-4 world class players mixed in (much like Henry/Bergy/Vieira mixed with Parlour/Ljungberg etc), but a team of 'decent' players as we have will struggle to get top 4, and that's exactly what we're doing.

Next week will be the same and so to will the one after that.

scrapping thru throughout our run?
west brom 3-0
wigan [a] 4-0
certain periods you have to dig in
but
i 100 per cent agree that we should not be selling ourselves short and if players are needed to suplement the squad not to do so is negligent.
and i don,t see why we have to do so at liddle rather than harrods
we are a big club and that needs to be reflected in our transfer dealings
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Re: Aston Villa Vs Arsenal | Premiership 21/12/2011

Postby StLGooner » Thu Dec 22, 2011 12:40 pm

matt22 wrote:This, my friends, was special.

For how long have we been accused of being unable to grind out results? Now, in come some hard nosed vets like Arteta and Benayoun, and of course our old boy Rosicky, and we get to give a giant middle finger to those members of the press.

To Arsene: This is why sometimes you have to buy a finished product to help the youth project.

In a way, this makes me happier than when we clobbered Chelsea. This was the exact type of game we couldn't win with Cesc. There's only so much ability can do.

on another note, anybody know Yossi's number? I want to make a donation to him.



We've been grinding out results all year now, very few of our games we played really well in, or won easily.
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Re: Aston Villa Vs Arsenal | Premiership 21/12/2011

Postby StLGooner » Thu Dec 22, 2011 12:43 pm

starmandb wrote:
ChVint22 wrote:
Massa wrote:wtf is alex-oxlade chamberlain srsly



He's on the bench thinking "why did I sign for this shit team".

no his on the bench thinking come on arsenal
give it a go



Oh surprise, surprise, starman is here to quote everybody after a win, shame we don't see you after losses. :rolleyes:

Did you ask him yourself what he was thinking?
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Re: Aston Villa Vs Arsenal | Premiership 21/12/2011

Postby TRA Dial Square » Thu Dec 22, 2011 1:32 pm

GunnGunn wrote:We have to sign Yossi on a permanent contract, perfect squad player.


Which is what I moaned about when we "loaned him" in summer (why we didn't buy) and people moaned about even that lol
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Re: Aston Villa Vs Arsenal | Premiership 21/12/2011

Postby ThereIsBearCüm » Thu Dec 22, 2011 2:04 pm

friedslice wrote:
starmandb wrote:
gooner_7890 wrote:I thought we looked rather lacklustre tonight and didn't really deserve to win but we managed to grind out the victory and come away with all three points, so i'm happy with the result.

However, i think tonight's performance shows we still need to add some quality in the January transfer window.

we scored more than the opposition
of coarse we desrved to win


Biggest load of nonsense I've read on this forum I'm affraid boss.

Are you suggesting that in your decades of watching football every side that's won has deserved to? because I'll f***ing tell you now our name should be on the FA Cup 2001 instead of Liverpool and there's more examples every week throughout football.

There's a big difference between getting something and deserving something and that's evident in everything in life.


as far as I'm concerned, the team that scores more goals deserves the win (except when refereeing howlers come into it, but that's another story)
you can have as much possession and as many shots as you want, but if you don't score more than the opposition, then you weren't good enough to win and didn't deserve to
finishing is an important skill in football, don't discount it
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Aston Villa Vs Arsenal | Premiership 21/12/2011

Postby Arsenal Tone » Thu Dec 22, 2011 2:46 pm

Recorded football first but it didnt record properly!
Raya/Ramsdale
White/Tomiyasu--Saliba/Timber--Gabriel/Kiwior--???/Zinchenko
???/Jorginho
Odegaard/Smith Rowe----Rice/???
Saka/Jesus-------------------Martinelli/Trossard
???/Havertz
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Aston Villa Vs Arsenal | Premiership 21/12/2011

Postby Arsenal Tone » Thu Dec 22, 2011 2:51 pm

Fixed it!
Raya/Ramsdale
White/Tomiyasu--Saliba/Timber--Gabriel/Kiwior--???/Zinchenko
???/Jorginho
Odegaard/Smith Rowe----Rice/???
Saka/Jesus-------------------Martinelli/Trossard
???/Havertz
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Re: Aston Villa Vs Arsenal | Premiership 21/12/2011

Postby Massa » Thu Dec 22, 2011 5:09 pm

ThereIsBearCum wrote:
friedslice wrote:
starmandb wrote:
gooner_7890 wrote:I thought we looked rather lacklustre tonight and didn't really deserve to win but we managed to grind out the victory and come away with all three points, so i'm happy with the result.

However, i think tonight's performance shows we still need to add some quality in the January transfer window.

we scored more than the opposition
of coarse we desrved to win


Biggest load of nonsense I've read on this forum I'm affraid boss.

Are you suggesting that in your decades of watching football every side that's won has deserved to? because I'll f***ing tell you now our name should be on the FA Cup 2001 instead of Liverpool and there's more examples every week throughout football.

There's a big difference between getting something and deserving something and that's evident in everything in life.


as far as I'm concerned, the team that scores more goals deserves the win (except when refereeing howlers come into it, but that's another story)
you can have as much possession and as many shots as you want, but if you don't score more than the opposition, then you weren't good enough to win and didn't deserve to
finishing is an important skill in football, don't discount it

Agreed.
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