British Politics

[UFGN]

You're more concerned with forcing through a leave vote because the people voted on absolute lies 2 years ago than actually looking at what benefits a leave vote would give us versus the massive pitfalls.

You talk like every country in the world isn't doing just fine outside of the EU?

Who sold you this line that if we're not in the UK we'll sink into the atlantic?

The fact is all those pit falls you declared are "possibilities" I'm not saying they are or aren't I'm saying no one know's because we're not out of the EU and we haven't gone out on our own so no one know's.

What Remain are doing is using the uncertainty of no-deal to declare it a bad thing.

You see as you said, I'm bothered that the referendum isn't carried out despite the uncertainty .......... well yes Zedie, because that's how democracy works.

If we were to fail to deliver Brexit then what? what democratic elected decision should ever be upheld? ......... that's called a dictatorship.

I'm pretty disgusted to be fair because Remain started off saying "Well yes the votes been had but we want a Soft Brexit" now its "We want another chance to vote Remain".

Hypocrisy doesn't wash down very well when your a central voter who believes in democracy.

Whether you like it or not, there was a result and all these threats were issued before the vote, Remain just want to rehash it until they get the outcome they want, that is not democracy, which is why I can't side with Remain.

The fact that you and UFGN can't grasp why that's my position is the whole trouble with why middle of the road voters get turned off by this Ultra socialist approach of not accepting a democratic decision.

1: You're not a voter at all

2: Re the bold bit, we've been over this before and you simply can't get it into your head;

The EU are our biggest importer and exporter, and our neighbours. For "Other countries" with economies similar to ours, that isn't the case

f***ing obviously

[DiamondGooner]

1: You're not a voter at all

2: Re the bold bit, we've been over this before and you simply can't get it into your head;

The EU are our biggest importer and exporter, and our neighbours. For "Other countries" with economies similar to ours, that isn't the case

f***ing obviously

1: At this rate I may vote next time.

2: ........... whatever

4: Yes they are so it works both ways, why can't you get that into your head, if they impose punishment then we do it back two fold.
Also so what if they're our neighbours, modern technology doesn't make that a hindrance these days unless you haven't noticed, we get fruit from all over the globe.

Again you judging things on the status quo, yes all our current deals are with EU countries because we're not allowed to set up our own yet!!

Fkin obviously.

......... and more to the point, what are you proposing exactly?

[DiamondGooner]

You're more concerned with forcing through a leave vote because the people voted on absolute lies 2 years ago than actually looking at what benefits a leave vote would give us versus the massive pitfalls.

You talk like every country in the world isn't doing just fine outside of the EU?

Who sold you this line that if we're not in the UK we'll sink into the atlantic?

The fact is all those pit falls you declared are "possibilities" I'm not saying they are or aren't I'm saying no one know's because we're not out of the EU and we haven't gone out on our own so no one know's.

What Remain are doing is using the uncertainty of no-deal to declare it a bad thing.

You see as you said, I'm bothered that the referendum isn't carried out despite the uncertainty .......... well yes Zedie, because that's how democracy works.

If we were to fail to deliver Brexit then what? what democratic elected decision should ever be upheld? ......... that's called a dictatorship.

I'm pretty disgusted to be fair because Remain started off saying "Well yes the votes been had but we want a Soft Brexit" now its "We want another chance to vote Remain".

Hypocrisy doesn't wash down very well when your a central voter who believes in democracy.

Whether you like it or not, there was a result and all these threats were issued before the vote, Remain just want to rehash it until they get the outcome they want, that is not democracy, which is why I can't side with Remain.

The fact that you and UFGN can't grasp why that's my position is the whole trouble with why middle of the road voters get turned off by this Ultra socialist approach of not accepting a democratic decision.

Is the no deal or shite deal we are likely to get what the 'leavers' voted for? If the deal involves staying in the single market and/or keeping freedom of movement should we still go ahead?

I think there are a lot of people who voted leave who are now realising that what they voted for (based on BS from the likes of farage and boris) isn't attainable. That is why they should be given a chance to vote on whatever rubbish deal/no deal is on the table.

Of course its not attainable.

Because Parliament has gone back on their word, they are refusing to allow us to break away clean of the EU and go to WTO rules (same as the rest of the world).

This is what I have a problem with more than whether we leave or stay.

My issue is that there has been a miscarriage of democracy where May and her remainer friends will not allow us to leave the EU despite the vote, so how could Leave ever have stood a chance.
In a nutshell they are messing it up on purpose.

............ and yes Boris and co are disgusting cretins for ducking and running and leaving it to a Remainer in May to deliver Brexit.

Complete farce.

So the question is yes, we have another vote ............... then what if that's Leave too?

[UFGN]

1: You're not a voter at all

2: Re the bold bit, we've been over this before and you simply can't get it into your head;

The EU are our biggest importer and exporter, and our neighbours. For "Other countries" with economies similar to ours, that isn't the case

f***ing obviously

1: At this rate I may vote next time.

2: ........... whatever

4: Yes they are so it works both ways, why can't you get that into your head, if they impose punishment then we do it back two fold.
Also so what if they're our neighbours, modern technology doesn't make that a hindrance these days unless you haven't noticed, we get fruit from all over the globe.

Again you judging things on the status quo, yes all our current deals are with EU countries because we're not allowed to set up our own yet!!

Fkin obviously.

......... and more to the point, what are you proposing exactly?

Well hell DG I dunno. I voted to remain, that was my contribution. It's a f***ing mess.

We are led by a prime minister who you supported and I opposed

Who leads a government and party who you supported and I opposed

Who is dealing with an outcome (Leave) that you supported and I opposed

But somehow I'm the one who's in the wrong here

Ok

[DiamondGooner]

No don't side step.

We are where we are, you keep digging at me because I'm saying I find the Gov't thwarting the vote of the people unsavoury so I'm asking you ...............

What would you want to happen now?

[UFGN]

No don't side step.

We are where we are, you keep digging at me because I'm saying I find the Gov't thwarting the vote of the people unsavoury so I'm asking you ...............

What would you want to happen now?

Leave the EU with the best possible deal

But I'm f***ked if I know what that is. Probably stay in the single market and customs union because it is what is best for our financial services sector, and that is basically all our wealth

If tax is levied on financial services we're f***ked probably. They will probably levy taxes if we don't stay in the single market

Then there's Northern Ireland. Good luck with that.

All of what I said is completely relevant and I'm not ducking anything. It's your shitty decisions and politics that led us down this clown super highway

[DiamondGooner]

No don't side step.

We are where we are, you keep digging at me because I'm saying I find the Gov't thwarting the vote of the people unsavoury so I'm asking you ...............

What would you want to happen now?

Leave the EU with the best possible deal

But I'm f***ked if I know what that is. Probably stay in the single market and customs union because it is what is best for our financial services sector, and that is basically all our wealth

If tax is levied on financial services we're f***ked probably. They will probably levy taxes if we don't stay in the single market

Then there's Northern Ireland. Good luck with that.

........... so you're describing a Soft Brexit, so two issues with that.

One - The politicians won't let us get a Soft Brexit through Parliament, because their end game is clear, derail talks until crunch time then all we're left with is In or Out with no prior preparation for Out so they'll vote it down.
So even as a Remainer trying to uphold democracy, they wouldn't allow you even that right.

This quote has never been so true .............

"If voting made any difference, they wouldn't let us do it"
Mark Twain

Apparently he's right because voting didn't make a difference, they won't let us leave regardless.

Second - The type of Soft Brexit your describing is worse than Remain, we may as well stay in the EU and try and claw our way back up to 3rd spot behind France and Germany who obviously run the thing.

Canada have a Free trade agreement and Norway has some sort of half membership but again the plan is to not let us have anything decent so we panic the public into a 2nd referendum or Parliament do it for us and just vote down everything so we can;t leave, its easy to change peoples minds when the Gov't are refusing to do Brexit properly.

Its like me hiring builders i can't un-hire and they refuse to build the walls to my house.

No matter what happens I'm looking forward to the day when this is over and the Conservatives are taken to task for this betrayal .......... I personally will never forgive them, I don't think a lot of voters will.

All of what I said is completely relevant and I'm not ducking anything. It's your shitty decisions and politics that led us down this clown super highway

Are you deliberately being a d*ckhead? because 10mins ago you had a go at me for not voting ......... yet its my decisions now?? make your mind up.

[UFGN]

You can't deny you supported May

You can't deny you supported the Tories

You can't deny you supported brexit

This is all stuff you wanted and I most deffinately didn't want

It's your special little three way of success. Everything you wanted.

And now it's a load of bullshit

[DiamondGooner]

You can't deny you supported May

You can't deny you supported the Tories

You can't deny you supported brexit

This is all stuff you wanted and I most deffinately didn't want

It's your special little three way of success. Everything you wanted.

And now it's a load of bullshit

I wanted a Primeminister that was going to deliver for this country Theresa May said she would, she lied.

I liked the idea of Brexit yes, I didn't want Brexit purposefully ruined.

Not sure what 3 way success your on about tbf?

.............it is BS because the Remainer's in Parliament are refusing to carry out the vote of the majority.

The only thing the Remainer's are saying which is actually true is "Leavers didn't vote for this" very true, and Remainer's made sure that was the case.
That's not a blame squarely on Remainer's, I also blame Brexit ministers who for some strange reason refuse to take charge and deliver what they're preaching.

[EliteKiller]

2: Re the bold bit, we've been over this before and you simply can't get it into your head;

The EU are our biggest importer and exporter, and our neighbours. For "Other countries" with economies similar to ours, that isn't the case

f***ing obviously

and you've been corrected on your fake assumption over, and over, and over again, but you just don't listen ....

The EU countries will not cease trading with the UK after Brexit ... believe it or not the EU trades with non-EU countries, who knew?

In 2017 the EU sent 67billion more goods into the UK than we sent to them ... they need that trade as much as we do ...

It's f***ing obvious that after we leave the EU they will still be by far our largest trading partner .... what bit about that can't you understand?

[UFGN]

A three way success of your choice of prime minister, your choice of political party in government and your choice of Leave

All a load of crap

You blame remainers in parliament.....

You don't reckon maybe it's got a lot more to do with the EU being difficult about trade, about Northern Ireland, about freedom of movement?

Because from where I'm sitting those seem to be the main hurdles and they are the exact same things Remainers warned about

[LMAO]

You're more concerned with forcing through a leave vote because the people voted on absolute lies 2 years ago than actually looking at what benefits a leave vote would give us versus the massive pitfalls.

You talk like every country in the world isn't doing just fine outside of the EU?

Who sold you this line that if we're not in the UK we'll sink into the atlantic?

The fact is all those pit falls you declared are "possibilities" I'm not saying they are or aren't I'm saying no one know's because we're not out of the EU and we haven't gone out on our own so no one know's.

The UK will be less relevant to the rest of the world outside the UK than it currently is as an EU member. Idk if it matters to you, but it'll have huge ramifications when it comes to bargaining power at the trade table.

What all the Leavers who are pissed to be tied to the EU, it's gonna be hilarious when they realize that the UK is be even more of our little brother/"puppet" state without the EU to back you up.

Basically, the UK will be a lesser South Korea imo (not that that's a bad thing). If you're fine with that, then by all means, go full steam ahead with a no deal Brexit.

[EliteKiller]

The UK will be less relevant to the rest of the world outside the UK than it currently is as an EU member -

Why? After Brexit the UK can Trade with the EU, and with the rest of the World, the issue is on what terms ... there is an argument to say that free from the confines of EU Trade agreements the UK will in fact be in a far stronger position to negotiate Trade deals ...

What all the Leavers who are pissed to be tied to the EU, it's gonna be hilarious when they realize that the UK is be even more of our little brother/"puppet" state without the EU to back you up.

Again Why? When has the EU ever had the UK's back on Trade? The EU protects the weaker Southern nations at the expense of the richer Northern nations, that's part of it's purpose, in return the stronger Northern nations receive access to the free movement of labour ...

Basically, the UK will be a lesser South Korea imo (not that that's a bad thing). If you're fine with that, then by all means, go full steam ahead with a no deal Brexit.

If only that turns out to be true -

The UK is the the 10th largest exporter in the world at 411m, the 4th largest importer at 636m with a Trade deficit of 224m ranked 144
South Korea is the the 6th largest exporter in the world at 495m, the 8th largest importer at 406m with a Trade surplus of 89m ranked 4

[DiamondGooner]

A three way success of your choice of prime minister, your choice of political party in government and your choice of Leave

All a load of crap

You blame remainers in parliament.....

You don't reckon maybe it's got a lot more to do with the EU being difficult about trade, about Northern Ireland, about freedom of movement?

Because from where I'm sitting those seem to be the main hurdles and they are the exact same things Remainers warned about

They are IF your going cap in hand for a deal, go No Deal and watch them roll out the red carpet.

Honestly, they sell to us ffs, what do you think happens to German cars and French food goods if we hike up the tariffs? they become un-competitive that's what.

NI will then become a matter of state, put the fkin border up, I mean what is this anyway? "Violence will start if you put a border up" ........ why exactly?

Freedom of movement again is our own decision, EU are pissed to hell because they're scared sh*tless we won't take their migrants anymore.

May and her merry band of remainers have given the EU all the power because she's gone begging cap in hand, she could of spent these two years prepping other arrangements.

The EU already said if we go No Deal they'll straight away offer a Canada Free trade deal and more.
They have to for their own sake.

[LMAO]

The UK will be less relevant to the rest of the world outside the UK than it currently is as an EU member -

Why? After Brexit the UK can Trade with the EU, and with the rest of the World, the issue is on what terms ... there is an argument to say that free from the confines of EU Trade agreements the UK will in fact be in a far stronger position to negotiate Trade deals ...

The EU is a bloc with a population of 512,596,403 (446,556,174 without the UK) and a nominal GDP of $17.3B ($14.7B without the UK). Thus, the EU holds significantly more leverage when it comes to negotiating trade deals than any of its member countries would individually because the EU has greater competitive advantage offerings. The UK alone will find it difficult to convince trading partners to come to deals that are at least as fair as what the EU enjoys. Yes, the UK will be able to forge its own trade agreements with maybe some more beneficial to the UK than current EU deals, but what will be the overall cost?

What all the Leavers who are pissed to be tied to the EU, it's gonna be hilarious when they realize that the UK is be even more of our little brother/"puppet" state without the EU to back you up.

Again Why? When has the EU ever had the UK's back on Trade? The EU protects the weaker Southern nations at the expense of the richer Northern nations, that's part of it's purpose, in return the stronger Northern nations receive access to the free movement of labour ...

The UK's service sector is the greatest contributor to its nominal GDP, with the financial industry of London making up a huge chunk of it. Without London being in the EU and thus allowing access to the EU's financial markets, the importance of the UK's financial sector will diminish, thus making it more reliant on the big outside players (i.e., America, the EU, and China) than it was before. Y'all still have aerospace, pharmaceuticals, and machinery, but without your primary competitive advantage (financial services), the UK's economy will take a noticeable hit.

Basically, the UK will be a lesser South Korea imo (not that that's a bad thing). If you're fine with that, then by all means, go full steam ahead with a no deal Brexit.

If only that turns out to be true -

The UK is the the 10th largest exporter in the world at 411m, the 4th largest importer at 636m with a Trade deficit of 224m ranked 144
South Korea is the the 6th largest exporter in the world at 495m, the 8th largest importer at 406m with a Trade surplus of 89m ranked 4

We'll see how long that trade deficit endures if there's no deal.