The bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki

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The bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki

Postby RowdyRoddyPoppins » Sat May 28, 2016 8:42 am

Ok, I started a heated debate on social media with the following post -

Japan was diabolically brutal & evil in the war. The suicide bombings, death-marches, & brutal enslavement of Asian women, as sex slaves. There was no place in the Japanese heart for regard of other non-Japanese humans, and there was no other choices left for America to persuade Japan otherwise to stop the madness. Japan & its emperor was convinced just like Hitler, that it was racially superior.

Which was in response to Obama's visit to Hiroshima as reported on BBC-

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-36394975

Turns out a lot of people think the US should apologise and that the use of these bombs on civilian areas can NEVER be justified.

My response to the surprisingly Anti US backlash was the Japanese started the war. They were refusing to surrender and had indicated every intention of fighting to the death. The only alternative was an invasion of mainland Japan itself, which would have slaughtered thousands - if not millions - more. The bombs were dropped in Aug 45. The Geneva convention was amended to prohibit the specific targeting of civilians in 1949. This is why the Germans weren't prosecuted for Coventry or us for Hamburg either.

Finally if these people think American should say sorry then surely Japan should apologise for its treatment of POW'S (The Japanese captured over 1 million Chinese soldiers and only 56 were left alive at war's end), the Nanking massacre (up to 300,000 civilians dead, which Japan still denies even happened), comfort women (sex slaves), in fact many describe what Japan got up to around this time as an Asian Holocaust. Many innocent lives were lost in Hiroshima and Nagasaki but I consider it a necessary evil to prevent death on a much wider scale. The planned ground invasion of Japan would of killed half a million minimum alone.

Would love to hear your thoughts, particularly our American members.
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Re: The bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki

Postby Rastayouth » Sat May 28, 2016 8:56 am

RowdyRoddyPoppins wrote:
Finally if these people think American should say sorry then surely Japan should apologise for its treatment of POW'S (The Japanese captured over 1 million Chinese soldiers and only 56 were left alive at war's end), the Nanking massacre (up to 300,000 civilians dead, which Japan still denies even happened), comfort women (sex slaves), in fact many describe what Japan got up to around this time as an Asian Holocaust. Many innocent lives were lost in Hiroshima and Nagasaki but I consider it a necessary evil to prevent death on a much wider scale. The planned ground invasion of Japan would of killed half a million minimum alone.


Thought about this a while. Everything you say is spot on. Horrible and uncomfortable truth to admit, particularly when you have broadcasts of victims recounting their experience.
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Re: The bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki

Postby GoonerAlexandre » Sat May 28, 2016 9:01 am

What Japan did in China and Asia was worse than anything the US did in that war.
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Re: The bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki

Postby 22-0 » Sat May 28, 2016 9:31 am

America has become political correct... it will be their downfall.
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Re: The bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki

Postby UFGN » Sat May 28, 2016 10:10 am

My only issue in all of it is the dropping of the second bomb. That surely could have been avoided if they'd really pursued every avenue.

The message had already been delivered loud and clear in Hiroshima.

That said, the appalling loss of life from both attacks may have ultimately saved lives. In an alternative reality where a smaller bomb or no bomb had been used, the word wouldn't have been so afraid of nuclear weapons which could have lead to an even worse nuclear conflict later on.
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Re: The bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki

Postby Zedie » Sat May 28, 2016 10:33 am

All sides should apologise for what they thought up and actually went through with and all sides should be throuroughly ashamed of the decisions they made in the name of their cause.

Japan should officially acknowledge unit 731
(warning, do not read up on if you are squeamish, still have a semblance of faith in humanity etc).

The allied forces engaged in a lot of dark practices all over the globe. While the atomic bombing of a hundreds of thousands of civilians was the key action everyone talks about, there were plenty more.

Germany have at least stood up and admitted a lot of what they did, even if they were pretty much forced into it however just thinking about their plans for the Polish people and how far they actually got, the wholesale murder of Jewish people, what the gestapo did to their own nationals who bravely resisted the nazi party etc it makes my blood boil.

The whole event was f***ing horrific and showed the human race for what it is and fully learning about it should make anyone throuroughly ashamed to be human imo.
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Re: The bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki

Postby RowdyRoddyPoppins » Sat May 28, 2016 10:44 am

Zedie wrote:All sides should apologise for what they thought up and actually went through with and all sides should be throuroughly ashamed of the decisions they made in the name of their cause.

Japan should officially acknowledge unit 731
(warning, do not read up on if you are squeamish, still have a semblance of faith in humanity etc).

The allied forces engaged in a lot of dark practices all over the globe. While the atomic bombing of a hundreds of thousands of civilians was the key action everyone talks about, there were plenty more.

Germany have at least stood up and admitted a lot of what they did, even if they were pretty much forced into it however just thinking about their plans for the Polish people and how far they actually got, the wholesale murder of Jewish people, what the gestapo did to their own nationals who bravely resisted the nazi party etc it makes my blood boil.

The whole event was f***ing horrific and showed the human race for what it is and fully learning about it should make anyone throuroughly ashamed to be human imo.



Top marks here Zedie. :clap:

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Re: The bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki

Postby CukiZeGerman » Sat May 28, 2016 4:44 pm

The Yanks have a lot of things they shouldn't be proud of or celebrate.
Droping the nukes isn't one of those things.

They gave the Japs an ultimatum

We call upon the government of Japan to proclaim now the unconditional surrender of all Japanese armed forces, and to provide proper and adequate assurances of their good faith in such action. The alternative for Japan is prompt and utter destruction.


The japs could have prevented Hiroshima and Nagasaki from happening - they can only blame themselvs for not accepting the offer when they could.
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Re: The bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki

Postby Fenice » Sat May 28, 2016 8:26 pm

UFGN wrote:My only issue in all of it is the dropping of the second bomb. That surely could have been avoided if they'd really pursued every avenue.

The message had already been delivered loud and clear in Hiroshima.

That said, the appalling loss of life from both attacks may have ultimately saved lives. In an alternative reality where a smaller bomb or no bomb had been used, the word wouldn't have been so afraid of nuclear weapons which could have lead to an even worse nuclear conflict later on.


I've thought the same. The first was to stop a long, horrific war. The second, was a war crime. More time should have been given, more discussion. Always seemed so wrong.
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Re: The bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki

Postby VCC » Sat May 28, 2016 9:52 pm

Sadly my experience of Japanese people even now is not much better, My mother when she was alive had a neighbour the couple were Japanese no problems there we are not racist and are indigenous people our selves, the couple had a dog which they walked every day the man walked the dog the women followed five yards behind every day problem started when they started throwing dog shit over my mothers fence then abused her when she asked them about it, big problem I went around there knocked on their door they set the dog on me which I kicked in the head walked in and smashed him out problem solved. People have no regard for anyone else I actualy can say I am probably very fucken off to all Japenese peole now it amazes me how they will push into a line when waiting I have pulled a few males out of line and escorted them to the back many times now f**k THEM I SAY, any ways long story short went up on charges took a visit from some club mates and was all sorted they lived charges dropped.
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Re: The bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki

Postby Va-Va-Voom » Sat May 28, 2016 10:01 pm

VCC wrote:Sadly my experience of Japanese people even now is not much better, My mother when she was alive had a neighbour the couple were Japanese no problems there we are not racist and are indigenous people our selves, the couple had a dog which they walked every day the man walked the dog the women followed five yards behind every day problem started when they started throwing dog shit over my mothers fence then abused her when she asked them about it, big problem I went around there knocked on their door they set the dog on me which I kicked in the head walked in and smashed him out problem solved. People have no regard for anyone else I actualy can say I am probably very fucken off to all Japenese peole now it amazes me how they will push into a line when waiting I have pulled a few males out of line and escorted them to the back many times now f**k THEM I SAY, any ways long story short went up on charges took a visit from some club mates and was all sorted they lived charges dropped.


This is gold. :rofll: :rofll:
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Re: The bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki

Postby Sims » Sat May 28, 2016 10:08 pm

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL
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Re: The bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki

Postby Jedi » Sat May 28, 2016 10:54 pm

Quite simple really:
They won the war, they get to be heroes while everyone else is the bad guy.

Really like the argument "Japan didn't want to surrender, therefore they had to kill hundreds of thousands of civillians to save lives"
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Re: The bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki

Postby Zedie » Sat May 28, 2016 10:59 pm

VCC wrote:Sadly my experience of Japanese people even now is not much better, My mother when she was alive had a neighbour the couple were Japanese no problems there we are not racist and are indigenous people our selves, the couple had a dog which they walked every day the man walked the dog the women followed five yards behind every day problem started when they started throwing dog shit over my mothers fence then abused her when she asked them about it, big problem I went around there knocked on their door they set the dog on me which I kicked in the head walked in and smashed him out problem solved. People have no regard for anyone else I actualy can say I am probably very fucken off to all Japenese peole now it amazes me how they will push into a line when waiting I have pulled a few males out of line and escorted them to the back many times now f**k THEM I SAY, any ways long story short went up on charges took a visit from some club mates and was all sorted they lived charges dropped.


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Re: The bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki

Postby UFGN » Sat May 28, 2016 11:34 pm

Jedieurokrem wrote:
Really like the argument "Japan didn't want to surrender, therefore they had to kill hundreds of thousands of civillians to save lives"


A land invasion was the only alternative and would probably have killed just as many people.

There were also thousands of allied civilians in Japanese internment camps in Japan and occupied China who were being starved to death by the Japs. A land war would have taken much longer and those prisoners didn't have time to spare.
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