Religion and Oppression (ft. the Catholic Church)

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Religion and Oppression (ft. the Catholic Church)

Postby LMAO » Thu May 28, 2015 3:21 am

Vatican says Ireland gay marriage vote is 'defeat for humanity'
Vatican diplomat seen as second only to the pope insists Saturday’s referendum result shows ‘the church must strengthen its commitment to evangelisation’

A senior Vatican official has attacked the legalisation of gay marriage in Ireland. The referendum that overwhelmingly backed marriage equality last weekend was a “defeat for humanity”, he claimed.

“I was deeply saddened by the result,” Cardinal Pietro Parolin, the Vatican’s secretary of state, said at a conference in Rome on Tuesday night. “The church must take account of this reality, but in the sense that it must strengthen its commitment to evangelisation. I think that you cannot just talk of a defeat for Christian principles, but of a defeat for humanity.”

The remarks by the Vatican’s top diplomat, who is seen as second only to the pope in the church’s hierarchy, represent the most damning assessment of the Irish vote by a senior church official to date.

It was a far more critical response than the circumspect reaction offered by archbishop Diarmuid Martin of Dublin, who said: “It is very clear that if this referendum is an affirmation of the views of young people … [then the church needs] a reality check.”

Ireland became the first country to legalise gay marriage by popular vote after a referendum found that 62% of voters were in favour of changing the constitution to allow gay and lesbian couples to marry.

While the results were celebrated by advocates of gay rights in Ireland and around the world, it was also seen as a stark symbol of how wide the chasm has grown between young people in what has traditionally been a staunchly Catholic country and the church itself, which says that homosexual acts are a sin and vehemently opposes gay marriage.

Parolin’s comments are sure to revive the debate about the church’s attitude to gay rights and equality under the papacy of Pope Francis, who once famously said “who am I to judge?” when asked about the existence of a “gay lobby” within the Vatican. That remark spurred hope among progressive Catholics that the church was entering a new era of tolerance and acceptance of homosexuality.

For some, that hope has been dashed by an ongoing controversy involving a French diplomat and practising Catholic named Laurent Stefanini, who is gay. The Vatican has refused to accept Stefanini’s nomination as France’s ambassador to the Holy See because of his sexual orientation, according to media reports in France and Italy.

The Vatican has declined to comment on the matter, but there has been speculation in recent weeks that the pope could make an abrupt change and accept the nomination, after all. The Vatican recently told the Guardian that any news on the appointment would be made available on the Vatican’s bulletin, where such appointments are usually publicised.

On Tuesday night, Parolin said the dialogue between the Vatican and France was continuing in regard to the controversial nomination, and that he hoped it would come to a conclusion in a “positive manner”.

Parolin’s remarks on the Irish vote are significant given the broader role Parolin plays in crafting the church’s message on major diplomatic and social issues.

At the time of his appointment in 2013, veteran Vatican reporter John Allen wrote in the National Catholic Reporter that Parolin had been “on the frontlines of shaping the Vatican’s response to virtually every geopolitical challenge of the past two decades”.

Among other issues, the Italian cardinal has been an outspoken advocate for action to combat global warming. In recent remarks, he denounced the “globalisation of indifference and the economy of exclusion” that has put the planet in peril.

He has also been the public face of Francis’s diplomatic efforts, including the church’s role in helping Cuba and the US restore diplomatic ties.

But on Tuesday, with his choice of words, Parolin differed from the pope in one respect: the Argentinian pontiff has also used the phrase “defeat for humanity”, but he was talking about war, not the legalisation of gay marriage.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/may/26/vatican-ireland-gay-marriage-referendum-vote-defeat-for-humanity


My word. The Western world is in 2015 and these losers (minus one of the most 'progressive' popes ever) are stuck in 380. How you can want to deny someone their freedoms (inalienable rights) is beyond me :shout:

I'm sure Cardinal Pietro Parolin also considers:
-The Inquisition
-Crusades
-Witch hunts
-Priests sexually assaulting minors
-Multiple f***ked up popes
-etc. etc. etc.
to be "defeat[s] for humanity" :rolleyes: f***ing muppet.

I know FIFA was busted yesterday, but even they can't compete with the most corrupt organization on the planet.
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Re: Religion and Oppression (ft. the Catholic Church)

Postby UFGN » Thu May 28, 2015 9:05 am

The church can cry and squeal as much as they want. Their years of oppression in places like Ireland are over. The people have spoken, and according to the church they are all God's people, no?

So the Vatican can stfu because nobody gives a f**k what their opinion on the matter is.
Corinthians 15:57; But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus

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Re: Religion and Oppression (ft. the Catholic Church)

Postby Angelito » Thu May 28, 2015 10:11 am

Religion is against life and living.

I don't want to offend the religious people here, but how religion is still the cause behind discussions in this day is a big surprise to me. It's outdated and irrelevant. The religious leaders glorify suffering and diminish the vast potential of humans. They describe a code to follow when it's impossible to limit people because of the incalculable energy forms running within us to keep us alive and functioning.

As long as you're not obstructing somebody else's rights, you can do whatever you want.

Godliness over God - please.
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Re: Religion and Oppression (ft. the Catholic Church)

Postby ThereIsBearCüm » Thu May 28, 2015 11:07 am

Pretty f***ing rich for them to try to take the moral high ground, considering all the kiddy fiddling they're responsible for (and continue to cover up).
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Re: Religion and Oppression (ft. the Catholic Church)

Postby StLGooner » Thu May 28, 2015 1:45 pm

The hypocrisy of some religious groups/people is just ridiculous. I posted something on FB yesterday about Josh Duggar. Not sure if you Brits know about this show, but there is a reality show about a deeply religious family that has like 20 kids. One of the kids (Josh), who is now in his 20's molested a few girls 12 years ago, two of which were his own sisters. Now, some politicians here (one of which who is a presidential candidate), and some other famous well known Christian conservatives, have voiced their support for this man. The same christians that are against gay marriage and equality, against teaching evolution in public schools, but openly support a incestuous child molester. I'd be willing to bet my life that if Josh was a famous gay person, or an atheist they would be condemning him to hell, and talking about the evils of being gay, or an atheist, but since he's a fellow famous Christian, they support him. These are also the same people that say the reason why there are school shootings and tornadoes that kill people is because God is mad at us for allowing gay marriages, or taking religion out of schools. And these people actually have real power in society and it's scary as f**k!!!
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Re: Religion and Oppression (ft. the Catholic Church)

Postby Maradonna » Thu May 28, 2015 3:38 pm

Angelito wrote:Religion is against life and living.

Wow, how sophisticated.
lol
you have the theological understanding of a 11 years old.
its like when a kid tries to explain the big bang.
or a fox news reporter trying to explain the "muslim world" (wherever that phrase means)
sad when people talk about what they dont understand.
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Re: Religion and Oppression (ft. the Catholic Church)

Postby StLGooner » Thu May 28, 2015 3:43 pm

Maradonaitis wrote:
Angelito wrote:Religion is against life and living.

Wow, how sophisticated.
lol
you have the theological understanding of a 11 years old.
its like when a kid tries to explain the big bang.
or a fox news reporter trying to explain the "muslim world" (wherever that phrase means)
sad when people talk about what they dont understand.


How would you even know what he does or doesn't understand? You took a 6 word sentence and assumed so much about him from that, and then tried to insult him. That's what I would call sad.
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Re: Religion and Oppression (ft. the Catholic Church)

Postby 22-0 » Thu May 28, 2015 3:44 pm

religion has no place in todays society
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Re: Religion and Oppression (ft. the Catholic Church)

Postby Maradonna » Thu May 28, 2015 3:51 pm

StLGooner wrote:
Maradonaitis wrote:
Angelito wrote:Religion is against life and living.

Wow, how sophisticated.
lol
you have the theological understanding of a 11 years old.
its like when a kid tries to explain the big bang.
or a fox news reporter trying to explain the "muslim world" (wherever that phrase means)
sad when people talk about what they dont understand.


How would you even know what he does or doesn't understand? You took a 6 word sentence and assumed so much about him from that, and then tried to insult him. That's what I would call sad.

because that is a terrible phrase that is brutally ignorant. When someone said something racist i stand up and say something about it, when someone said something as offending as that, i stand up and say something about it.
we should be all alarmed by a fascist statement.
it is ignorant, its like listening to neuroscientists talk about religion (Sam Harris), it's like Darwin Evolutionists talking about race and measuring heads at the beginning of the XX century. All behind a "secular" oratory that embellish a very conservative and unsophisticated full of hate way of thinking.
It's awful. Demining and ignorant.
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Re: Religion and Oppression (ft. the Catholic Church)

Postby Apollo » Thu May 28, 2015 3:52 pm

Religious people piss me off about as much as non religions people.
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Re: Religion and Oppression (ft. the Catholic Church)

Postby Maradonna » Thu May 28, 2015 3:53 pm

Apollo wrote:Religious people piss me off about as much as non religions people.

bingo.
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Re: Religion and Oppression (ft. the Catholic Church)

Postby StLGooner » Thu May 28, 2015 4:05 pm

Maradonaitis wrote:
StLGooner wrote:
Maradonaitis wrote:
Angelito wrote:Religion is against life and living.

Wow, how sophisticated.
lol
you have the theological understanding of a 11 years old.
its like when a kid tries to explain the big bang.
or a fox news reporter trying to explain the "muslim world" (wherever that phrase means)
sad when people talk about what they dont understand.


How would you even know what he does or doesn't understand? You took a 6 word sentence and assumed so much about him from that, and then tried to insult him. That's what I would call sad.

because that is a terrible phrase that is brutally ignorant. When someone said something racist i stand up and say something about it, when someone said something as offending as that, i stand up and say something about it.
we should be all alarmed by a fascist statement.
it is ignorant, its like listening to neuroscientists talk about religion (Sam Harris), it's like Darwin Evolutionists talking about race and measuring heads at the beginning of the XX century. All behind a "secular" oratory that embellish a very conservative and unsophisticated full of hate way of thinking.
It's awful. Demining and ignorant.



So why is it that under the name of religion or God, people are allowed to be "racist, and ignorant", and very hateful, but when people say the same about religion in general it's not ok. Kind of a double standard isn't it? Religion shouldn't be protected from it's hypocritical bigotry. And calling it out and making religion accountable for it's horrible actions is something that is needed.
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Re: Religion and Oppression (ft. the Catholic Church)

Postby Maradonna » Thu May 28, 2015 4:07 pm

StLGooner wrote:
Maradonaitis wrote:
StLGooner wrote:
Maradonaitis wrote:
Angelito wrote:Religion is against life and living.

Wow, how sophisticated.
lol
you have the theological understanding of a 11 years old.
its like when a kid tries to explain the big bang.
or a fox news reporter trying to explain the "muslim world" (wherever that phrase means)
sad when people talk about what they dont understand.


How would you even know what he does or doesn't understand? You took a 6 word sentence and assumed so much about him from that, and then tried to insult him. That's what I would call sad.

because that is a terrible phrase that is brutally ignorant. When someone said something racist i stand up and say something about it, when someone said something as offending as that, i stand up and say something about it.
we should be all alarmed by a fascist statement.
it is ignorant, its like listening to neuroscientists talk about religion (Sam Harris), it's like Darwin Evolutionists talking about race and measuring heads at the beginning of the XX century. All behind a "secular" oratory that embellish a very conservative and unsophisticated full of hate way of thinking.
It's awful. Demining and ignorant.



So why is it that under the name of religion or God, people are allowed to be "racist, and ignorant", and very hateful, but when people say the same about religion in general it's not ok. Kind of a double standard isn't it? Religion shouldn't be protected from it's hypocritical bigotry. And calling it out and making religion accountable for it's horrible actions is something that is needed
.

im not a religious person, i dont justify hate, period.
and religion dont kill, people does.
religion its just a signpost, a language, a complexity of symbols and metaphors to explain what it's unexplainable, the divine experience. Language and words don't kill people, people kill people.
What angelito said is ignorant a fascist and it should not be tolerated.
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Re: Religion and Oppression (ft. the Catholic Church)

Postby StLGooner » Thu May 28, 2015 4:30 pm

Maradonaitis wrote:
StLGooner wrote:
Maradonaitis wrote:
StLGooner wrote:
Maradonaitis wrote:
Angelito wrote:Religion is against life and living.

Wow, how sophisticated.
lol
you have the theological understanding of a 11 years old.
its like when a kid tries to explain the big bang.
or a fox news reporter trying to explain the "muslim world" (wherever that phrase means)
sad when people talk about what they dont understand.


How would you even know what he does or doesn't understand? You took a 6 word sentence and assumed so much about him from that, and then tried to insult him. That's what I would call sad.

because that is a terrible phrase that is brutally ignorant. When someone said something racist i stand up and say something about it, when someone said something as offending as that, i stand up and say something about it.
we should be all alarmed by a fascist statement.
it is ignorant, its like listening to neuroscientists talk about religion (Sam Harris), it's like Darwin Evolutionists talking about race and measuring heads at the beginning of the XX century. All behind a "secular" oratory that embellish a very conservative and unsophisticated full of hate way of thinking.
It's awful. Demining and ignorant.



So why is it that under the name of religion or God, people are allowed to be "racist, and ignorant", and very hateful, but when people say the same about religion in general it's not ok. Kind of a double standard isn't it? Religion shouldn't be protected from it's hypocritical bigotry. And calling it out and making religion accountable for it's horrible actions is something that is needed
.

im not a religious person, i dont justify hate, period.
and religion dont kill, people does.
religion its just a signpost, a language, a complexity of symbols and metaphors to explain what it's unexplainable, the divine experience. Language and words don't kill people, people kill people.
What angelito said is ignorant a fascist and it should not be tolerated.



I will kindly disagree. Yes, it is people that do the killing, but you would have to have lived under a rock your entire life if you don't think that religion influences people to do very evil things. Yes, the moderate everyday person that believes in a God in one sense or another is a very good person most likely, probably like you and I. But religion definitely deserves it's criticism. It states that people who don't follow it or believe in it deserve a lake of fire for eternity. It endorses slavery, oppresses women, and obviously thinks gay people are less than human. It is very anti-life and living in my opinion, and Anglito has every right to say that.
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Re: Religion and Oppression (ft. the Catholic Church)

Postby Maradonna » Thu May 28, 2015 4:45 pm

StLGooner wrote:
Maradonaitis wrote:
StLGooner wrote:
Maradonaitis wrote:
StLGooner wrote:
Maradonaitis wrote:
Angelito wrote:Religion is against life and living.

Wow, how sophisticated.
lol
you have the theological understanding of a 11 years old.
its like when a kid tries to explain the big bang.
or a fox news reporter trying to explain the "muslim world" (wherever that phrase means)
sad when people talk about what they dont understand.


How would you even know what he does or doesn't understand? You took a 6 word sentence and assumed so much about him from that, and then tried to insult him. That's what I would call sad.

because that is a terrible phrase that is brutally ignorant. When someone said something racist i stand up and say something about it, when someone said something as offending as that, i stand up and say something about it.
we should be all alarmed by a fascist statement.
it is ignorant, its like listening to neuroscientists talk about religion (Sam Harris), it's like Darwin Evolutionists talking about race and measuring heads at the beginning of the XX century. All behind a "secular" oratory that embellish a very conservative and unsophisticated full of hate way of thinking.
It's awful. Demining and ignorant.



So why is it that under the name of religion or God, people are allowed to be "racist, and ignorant", and very hateful, but when people say the same about religion in general it's not ok. Kind of a double standard isn't it? Religion shouldn't be protected from it's hypocritical bigotry. And calling it out and making religion accountable for it's horrible actions is something that is needed
.

im not a religious person, i dont justify hate, period.
and religion dont kill, people does.
religion its just a signpost, a language, a complexity of symbols and metaphors to explain what it's unexplainable, the divine experience. Language and words don't kill people, people kill people.
What angelito said is ignorant a fascist and it should not be tolerated.



I will kindly disagree. Yes, it is people that do the killing, but you would have to have lived under a rock your entire life if you don't think that religion influences people to do very evil things. Yes, the moderate everyday person that believes in a God in one sense or another is a very good person most likely, probably like you and I. But religion definitely deserves it's criticism. It states that people who don't follow it or believe in it deserve a lake of fire for eternity. It endorses slavery, oppresses women, and obviously thinks gay people are less than human. It is very anti-life and living in my opinion, and Anglito has every right to say that.

because KKK exist, white people is racist.
Generalization its terrible when you talk about social issues. Academics all over the world are appalled by the way religion its treated. We fear what we dont know.
Debt its much of a problem than religion, Isis Palestina and Israel conflicts are about Territory and tribal situations, not about religion. Religion it is used as a tool to explain tribal, territorial and economical valid and invalid grievances, Of course people on both sides have a very cosmic view of that territory and that conflict, but, are we, westernized secular humans going to do the same? are we going to talk about it with a cosmic magical view, or are we going to talk about it as it is, a territorial economical tribal conflict. we should talk about it as what it is.
this analysis applies to every single war in the name of god that was in place through history.
Religion its just a language, i can say that i kill in the name of god, democracy, freedom, etc. its not about the language it's about the acts, and im gay btw, so getting to this place was extremadly hard for me, especially coming from a very religious country and background. i learned, by studying, to understand religion for what it is.
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