American Politics

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Re: American Politics

Postby Royal Gooner » Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:00 pm

DiamondGooner wrote:
Royal Gooner wrote:She isn't, she already said she isn't and with The Rock ruling himself out, I can't see anyone challenging Trump.


Jesus Christ, really??

Every time I think I've seen it all over there, I realise there's lower level to be reached.

The Rock?? I mean :doh:


Why not? He is as charismatic as Trump, only more likable and the ability to get back the support that Obama had. Plus he is a native Floridian which would guarantee that state for the Dems which would really put President Trump in trouble.
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Re: American Politics

Postby Va-Va-Voom » Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:05 pm

Can't tell if you're trolling or seriously asking why a wrestler/action movie star wouldn't be fit for Presidency.
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Re: American Politics

Postby Zedie » Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:25 pm

Phil71 wrote:They don’t have anyone that can beat Trump.

He’s a great campaigner. He’ll win again.


He's spent his first year campaigning lol. People are starting to realise what's actually happening.

Mitch McConnell just announced more cuts to Medicare funding and social security, to plug the financial hole that the tax cuts made, so a shit load of working class Americans are about to feel reality.

His supporters might actually wake up once they're directly feeling it and tbf the trade wars are already starting to tip companies over the edge.

The whole Brett kavanagh situation would have brought it home to a lot of women who made excuses for him so far...

Midterms are going to be Damn interesting.
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Re: American Politics

Postby LMAO » Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:56 pm

Phil71 wrote:They don’t have anyone that can beat Trump.

He’s a great campaigner. He’ll win again.


Ahem. I present to you one Beto O'Rourke.

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He's Obama 2.0: just as charismatic but more progressive.

What he's been able to do thus far as a pro-gun control, pro-choice candidate in Texas has been absolutely incredible. If he can win the Senate seat this year in Texas or even come within 3 points of Cruz, he'll be set up extremely well for a presidential run in 2020 that could end Trump's reelection bid in an instant (because O'Rourke would have a great chance to flip his home state of Texas and that'd be ballgame).
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Re: American Politics

Postby Yago » Tue Oct 16, 2018 11:59 pm

I like Beto and he's running a great campaign, but it doesn't look like he will be able to pull off the win in Texas as he's currently polling around 7 points behind Cruz. It was always gonna be difficult in a deep red state.
And if he doesn't win there's no way he can make a convincing bid for President in 2020 without having served as Senator or Governor.
Even if he does manage to win, he won't run. He can't start campaigning 3 months after he won his seat. And giving that senate seat away (as the republican governor would be the one assigning a successor) would be madness.
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Re: American Politics

Postby EliteKiller » Wed Oct 17, 2018 1:57 am

Yago wrote:I like Beto and he's running a great campaign, but it doesn't look like he will be able to pull off the win in Texas as he's currently polling around 7 points behind Cruz. It was always gonna be difficult in a deep red state.
And if he doesn't win there's no way he can make a convincing bid for President in 2020 without having served as Senator or Governor.
Even if he does manage to win, he won't run. He can't start campaigning 3 months after he won his seat. And giving that senate seat away (as the republican governor would be the one assigning a successor) would be madness.


He's only 46 so has time on his side ... he is off course the traditional 'wealthy white man' but his Irish immigration ancestry will play well ... the fact he broke the STOCK act (basically insider trading) and was forced to return any profit to the US Treasury, in return for charges being dropped, will not play well ... he basically 'did a Trump' and paid his way out of the shite .... is that now acceptable behavior for US Presidential hopefuls? well maybe it is ..............

As you rightly point out beating Cruz in a deep-red state is a near impossibility ... but if by some miracle he did then his chances of being the Dem candidate for 2020 would rocket ....

Like all good Dems in a Republican stronghold (and vice-versa) his base is incredible local, if he moves that likely fades .... without doubt his seat would flip back to the Reps .... not sure he's ready to let that happen ....

One other point of note: Beto has repeatedly used the fact that Ted Cruz ran for president during his first term as Texas Senator as a stick to beat him with .... to do the same himself would thus be almost unthinkable ....
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Re: American Politics

Postby Phil71 » Wed Oct 17, 2018 6:46 am

They should get The Undertaker to run.

Every time he is going to make a speech at the White House, they could announce, "And now, from Death Valley, weighing 299 pounds,..." and start that entrance theme tune.
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Re: American Politics

Postby DiamondGooner » Wed Oct 17, 2018 5:19 pm

Royal Gooner wrote:
DiamondGooner wrote:
Royal Gooner wrote:She isn't, she already said she isn't and with The Rock ruling himself out, I can't see anyone challenging Trump.


Jesus Christ, really??

Every time I think I've seen it all over there, I realise there's lower level to be reached.

The Rock?? I mean :doh:


Why not? He is as charismatic as Trump, only more likable and the ability to get back the support that Obama had. Plus he is a native Floridian which would guarantee that state for the Dems which would really put President Trump in trouble.



For the same reason I wouldn't let Krusty the Clown to do the MOT on my car ........... he's not qualified.

Although I do start to wonder what actually makes a person fit for office these days.

But would you really want a muscle head who used to dive off the top turnbuckle to have his finger on America's nuclear arms?

........... probably an improvement from Trump though I must admit.
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Re: American Politics

Postby Jedi » Wed Oct 17, 2018 5:47 pm

It will be Elizabeth Warren or Kamala Harris and they will get dunked on by Trump. f***ing over Bernie in 2016 was such a mistake. Perhaps he can run again as a one term president.
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Re: American Politics

Postby Yago » Wed Oct 17, 2018 6:15 pm

Jedi wrote:It will be Elizabeth Warren or Kamala Harris and they will get dunked on by Trump. f***ing over Bernie in 2016 was such a mistake. Perhaps he can run again as a one term president.


There was no "f***ing over Bernie". He lost because he wasn't that great a candidate and would've lost to Trump either way. I f***ing hope he's not thinking about running again.
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Re: American Politics

Postby Jedi » Wed Oct 17, 2018 6:29 pm

Yago wrote:
Jedi wrote:It will be Elizabeth Warren or Kamala Harris and they will get dunked on by Trump. f***ing over Bernie in 2016 was such a mistake. Perhaps he can run again as a one term president.


There was no "f***ing over Bernie". He lost because he wasn't that great a candidate and would've lost to Trump either way. I f***ing hope he's not thinking about running again.

Are some people on GoonersWorld allergic to facts? Seriously, couldn't you have done a google search before opening your mouth?

Info taken from: https://www.snopes.com/news/2017/11/03/ ... 6-primary/


On 2 November 2017 Politico published a surprising excerpt from former Democratic National Committee interim chair Donna Brazile’s book Hacks, revealing a fundraising agreement between candidate Hillary Clinton and her political party. Senator Elizabeth Warren has agreed publicly that the primary was rigged in Clinton’s favor.

In a passage pertaining to the tense events surrounding the Democratic National Convention of 2016, the then-interim chair wrote:
I had promised Bernie [Sanders] when I took the helm of the Democratic National Committee after the convention that I would get to the bottom of whether Hillary Clinton’s team had rigged the nomination process, as a cache of emails stolen by Russian hackers and posted online had suggested. I’d had my suspicions from the moment I walked in the door of the DNC a month or so earlier, based on the leaked emails. But who knew if some of them might have been forged? I needed to have solid proof, and so did Bernie.

[…]

By September 7, the day I called Bernie, I had found my proof and it broke my heart.


Brazile addressed the proof she discussed in her call to Sanders:

[Gary Gensler, the chief financial officer of Hillary’s campaign] described the [DNC] as fully under the control of Hillary’s campaign, which seemed to confirm the suspicions of the Bernie camp … Individuals who had maxed out their $2,700 contribution limit to the campaign could write an additional check for $353,400 to the Hillary Victory Fund—that figure represented $10,000 to each of the 32 states’ parties who were part of the Victory Fund agreement—$320,000—and $33,400 to the DNC. The money would be deposited in the states first, and transferred to the DNC shortly after that. Money in the battleground states usually stayed in that state, but all the other states funneled that money directly to the DNC, which quickly transferred the money to Brooklyn.

“Wait,” I said. “That victory fund was supposed to be for whoever was the nominee, and the state party races. You’re telling me that Hillary has been controlling it since before she got the nomination?”

Gary said the campaign had to do it or the party would collapse.

“That was the deal that Robby struck with Debbie,” he explained, referring to campaign manager Robby Mook [and U.S. Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz, then the chair of the DNC]. “It was to sustain the DNC. We sent the party nearly $20 million from September until the convention, and more to prepare for the election.”

[…]

I gasped … When we hung up, I was livid. Not at Gary, but at this mess I had inherited … It would be weeks before I would fully understand the financial shenanigans that were keeping the party on life support.


As news of Brazile’s remarks spread on social media and in the news, Sen. Elizabeth Warren made a 2 November 2017 appearance on CNN with host Jake Tapper. At approximately the 1:20 mark, Tapper asked if Warren agreed “with the notion that [the 2016 Democratic primary] was rigged.”

Warren simply replied “yes”:

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Re: American Politics

Postby Yago » Wed Oct 17, 2018 7:38 pm

Can't expect reason from someone that retarded, but still I try.

Donna Brazile is reliably untrustworthy. A few days after the bit you quoted, she said this:

https://www.politico.com/story/2017/11/ ... ers-244566

Donna Brazile, the former interim chair of the Democratic National Committee, said Sunday she found "no evidence" that the 2016 Democratic primary was rigged in favor of eventual nominee Hillary Clinton, seemingly walking back her recent stinging criticisms of the electoral process.

"I found no evidence, none whatsoever" that the primaries were rigged, Brazile said during an appearance on ABC's "This Week."


https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/3 ... at-brazile

Nearly 100 former Clinton campaign staffers have signed an open letter hitting back at former Democratic National Committee (DNC) head Donna Brazil's depiction of the campaign in her upcoming memoir, titled "Hacks: The Inside Story of the Break-ins and Breakdowns That Put Donald Trump in the White House."

In the letter, 94 former campaign members said that the campaign portrayed by Brazile is unrecognizable to them, and blasted the former DNC interim chair for once considering removing Clinton as the party's presidential nominee — a revelation made in Brazile's book.

"Donna came in to take over the DNC at a very difficult time," the letter, published on the website Medium, reads. "We were grateful to her for doing so. She is a longtime friend and colleague of many of us and has been an important leader in our party. But we do not recognize the campaign she portrays in the book."

The former staffers also accused the former DNC interim chair of buying into "false Russian-fueled propaganda, spread by both the Russians and our opponent," claiming that Clinton's health was deteriorating during the campaign.


As the Washington Post surmises:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the ... 97da695081

But the op-ed doesn't break too much new provable, factual ground, relying more upon Brazile's own perception of the situation and hearsay.
[...]
None of this is truly shocking. In fact, Brazile is largely writing about things we already knew about. The joint fundraising agreement between the Clinton campaign and the DNC was already known about and the subject of derision among Sanders's supporters. But it's worth noting that Sanders was given a similar opportunity and passed on using it, as Brazile notes.
[...]
The timeline here is also important. Many of those emails described above came after it was abundantly clear that Clinton would be the nominee, barring a massive and almost impossible shift in primary votes. It may have been in poor taste and contrary to protocol, but the outcome was largely decided long before Sanders ended his campaign. Brazile doesn't dwell too much on the timeline, so it's not clear exactly how in-the-bag Clinton had the nomination when the alleged takeover began. It's also not clear exactly what Clinton got for her alleged control.
[...]


In fact, the only verifiable wrong thing that did happen in Clinton's favour was perpetrated by Brazile herself: passing on a debate question to the Clinton campaign (the campaign did never ask for that).

Brazile herself first confessed to that, then said that wasn't true. Brazile's only interested in a cashgrab with her book, and if she said earth was a globe I'd start doubting it.

By the time all this happened the primary was all but decided. It was at that moment that Bernie, seeing he was going to lose, started his smear campaign which Trump happily made use of.

Also worth nothing:
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics ... ary-rigged

Within a few days, both Brazile and Warren walked their statements all the way back. Brazile now says she found “no evidence” the primary was rigged. Warren now says that though there was “some bias” within the DNC, “the overall 2016 primary process was fair.”

The 2016 Democratic primary wasn’t rigged by the DNC, and it certainly wasn’t rigged against Sanders. But Democratic elites did try to make Clinton’s nomination as inevitable, as preordained, as possible.
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Re: American Politics

Postby Jedi » Wed Oct 17, 2018 9:08 pm

Not gonna bother going through another quote battle, you'll just go through news articles and post any quote which confirms your bias. Just look at the Hillary Victory fund and the details of that agreement. If you don't think it shows Hillary had insane control of the DNC you can't be saved. The only thing you could argue is that even though she had all this control, she didn't choose to abuse it, but that's just... come on... It's Hillary Clinton for f*ck sakes.

As for Elizabeth Warren suddenly changing her tune, she was pushed to fall in line by other Democrats. I mean how do you justify her admitting that the DNC rigged it for Hillary, and then going back on it? Was she on meds in that Jake Tapper interview?

All you need to do is look at the the odds by bookmakers on Hillary before the primaries even started. She was pushed so hard down the throat of all Americans that nobody could come near her.
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Re: American Politics

Postby Yago » Wed Oct 17, 2018 9:32 pm

As touched upon in the last article I linked, a lot of important people of the Democratic party (which isn't the same as the DNC) did support her before voting began and were trying to clear the path for her. Just have a look at all the endorsements she received. This did help convince potential candidates not to run, but to suggest that throwing one's support and name behind a candidate consists of rigging it is of course untrue.

I explain - I don't justify - Warren's interview in the same way I explain her claim to be of Native American heritage: she doesn't always think very much about what she's saying.
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Re: American Politics

Postby Jedi » Wed Oct 17, 2018 11:18 pm

Yago wrote:As touched upon in the last article I linked, a lot of important people of the Democratic party (which isn't the same as the DNC) did support her before voting began and were trying to clear the path for her. Just have a look at all the endorsements she received. This did help convince potential candidates not to run, but to suggest that throwing one's support and name behind a candidate consists of rigging it is of course untrue.

Good thing i never did that, then. What i argued is that Bernie got "f***ked over" by the Dems, which i stand by. If you don't think that what you mentioned coupled with the slimy Hillary Victory Fund agreement proves that, i really can't help you, as I've said before. I guess that, Hillary having complete control over crowdfunding isn't enough, they need to completely bar someone from running for you to agree that they f***ked them over. Bottom line is, Bernie got as much support from the Democrats as Gary Johnson.

You said he lost because he wasn't a great candidate and would have lost against Trump, anyway. I completely disagree. Bernie with the Dems behind him would have won a landslide victory over Trump. Doesn't have hundred controversies behind him, opposed Iraq war, promoted populist leftie policy like free healthcare and other shit the majority of Americans want. The only thing he couldn't do is get support from the money driven corrupt dumpster that is the Democratic Party so i guess he was a bad candidate in that regard.
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