American Politics

[UFGN]

Oh shut up you insufferable old clown!

You’ve got a president who goes out of his way to insult, belittle, demonise, divide, and “other” people wholesale. And you have the barefaced arrogance to sneeringly refer to all opposition to this piece of shit as “TDS” because of your own deep rooted biases.

Your “f**k You I Got Mine” syndrome is very debilitating in your case I can see. That, along with the entitlement of old age, has left you unable to see the harm the politics you seem very keen on is causing, or indeed to see the point of view of others. Or more accurately, you don’t give a shit.

Oh leave off ! The amount of insults HE has had to take allows him the space to give it back, or do you think its should all be in one direction ? Demonise? He has called out wrong'uns, people in society that give nothing to it but crime. The immigration topic is high on the agenda in every single country that does not have people trying to leave that country, how does that make Trump any different to those leaders ? How is he different to Starmer in that respect ?

There is a bloody problem with immigration whether you choose to accept it or not and when those immigrants commit high-profile crimes the situation gets worse exponentially. This is the case across Europe, this is not just a Trump issue. Divide ? Meh, thats just you getting your knickers in a twist. As with all politics, you have some that will be for and some against, there is a reason why there are different political parties who have different core beliefs, it has nothing to do with dividing people.

No you are absolutely wrong. He uses blatantly devisive and aggressive language consistently in a way not seen from a US president in recent history. And spare me his fking hurt feelings. He's the president of the US and is supposed to rise above it. He gets no more heat than any previous president. Look at Obama for example. Look at George W. Which is funny actually because Trump deserves more than those two.

Language from a president matters. His rhetoric has eboldened racists and made them feel like their views are valid and mainstream. And also provoked hatred against him and Republicans because of his policies and his emboldening of 'Murica First thugs.

And that is all his fault.

He could have chosen for none of that to have happened. But he deliberately CHOSE to whip up hatred and discord as a political policy.

[Pat Rice in Short Shorts]

Oh shut up you insufferable old clown!

You’ve got a president who goes out of his way to insult, belittle, demonise, divide, and “other” people wholesale. And you have the barefaced arrogance to sneeringly refer to all opposition to this piece of shit as “TDS” because of your own deep rooted biases.

Your “f**k You I Got Mine” syndrome is very debilitating in your case I can see. That, along with the entitlement of old age, has left you unable to see the harm the politics you seem very keen on is causing, or indeed to see the point of view of others. Or more accurately, you don’t give a shit.

He may be harsh and direct but his policies work. Perhaps you should revisit the past ten years and why the left has engaged in propagating TDS. Maybe think back to Obama's tactic of causing racial strife for political gain? Or Hillary's demonization of half our nation? Or that Trump has faced illegal anti democratic persecution in Congress and by the DOJ? Recall Russia-gate? Are you still believing everything that you were spoon fed by the left and the media that has been proven false? At some point is there no reconciliation between what you were told and the truth?

Try truth brother, it feels so much nicer to be aware. Truth brings peace. Now if you open your mind to that possibility and drop the Marxist ideology and bitterness it may help you realize that your life outlook may not always match reality as mine may not. We all face that at some point if we honest with ourselves and confront our own biases. We may not agree on politics but truth is not really negotiable, nor is logic.

We probably do agree on many things, many of which I have changed my tune on to some extent. George Bush? Tony Blair? The CIA, NSA, MI6? The effects of British Colonialism on individuals and nations? Totalitarianism perhaps? Political violence? Governmental injustice? Free speech perhaps? How about the value of the Western democratic systems and Common Law?

You seem to have trouble differentiating between "old money" and self made net worth. I do not celebrate my own moderate successes in life (proud and happy as I am of that) but rather the opportunities afforded me by my nation and Constitution. There is a massive difference. My thankfulness at our Thanksgiving dinner yesterday was for the success my kids all achieved through the same hard work and opportunity.

Projection and insults rather than articulating a point is telling. What you also misread is my "ideology". I started to jettisoned that bit by bit about ten years back in favor of core values and basic truths about human nature, and really started apply logic to every situation and it has been freeing. The ideology that I do oppose on every level is Marxism which has crept back into our lives as an empathy laden Trojan Horse and is a threat to us all.

[UFGN]

Oh shut up you insufferable old clown!

You’ve got a president who goes out of his way to insult, belittle, demonise, divide, and “other” people wholesale. And you have the barefaced arrogance to sneeringly refer to all opposition to this piece of shit as “TDS” because of your own deep rooted biases.

Your “f**k You I Got Mine” syndrome is very debilitating in your case I can see. That, along with the entitlement of old age, has left you unable to see the harm the politics you seem very keen on is causing, or indeed to see the point of view of others. Or more accurately, you don’t give a shit.

He may be harsh and direct but his policies work. Perhaps you should revisit the past ten years and why the left has engaged in propagating TDS. Maybe think back to Obama's tactic of causing racial strife for political gain? Or Hillary's demonization of half our nation? Or that Trump has faced illegal anti democratic persecution in Congress and by the DOJ? Recall Russia-gate? Are you still believing everything that you were spoon fed by the left and the media that has been proven false? At some point is there no reconciliation between what you were told and the truth?

Try truth brother, it feels so much nicer to be aware. Truth brings peace. Now if you open your mind to that possibility and drop the Marxist ideology and bitterness it may help you realize that your life outlook may not always match reality as mine may not. We all face that at some point if we honest with ourselves and confront our own biases. We may not agree on politics but truth is not really negotiable, nor is logic.

We probably do agree on many things, many of which I have changed my tune on to some extent. George Bush? Tony Blair? The CIA, NSA, MI6? The effects of British Colonialism on individuals and nations? Totalitarianism perhaps? Political violence? Governmental injustice? Free speech perhaps? How about the value of the Western democratic systems and Common Law?

You seem to have trouble differentiating between "old money" and self made net worth. I do not celebrate my own moderate successes in life (proud and happy as I am of that) but rather the opportunities afforded me by my nation and Constitution. There is a massive difference. My thankfulness at our Thanksgiving dinner yesterday was for the success my kids all achieved through the same hard work and opportunity.

Projection and insults rather than articulating a point is telling. What you also misread is my "ideology". I started to jettisoned that bit by bit about ten years back in favor of core values and basic truths about human nature, and really started apply logic to every situation and it has been freeing. The ideology that I do oppose on every level is Marxism which has crept back into our lives as an empathy laden Trojan Horse and is a threat to us all.

TLDR because I scan read it and saw the same old PRISS bullshit buzzwords. TDS, projection, patronising phrases, Marxism, blah blah ad nausea.

[Pat Rice in Short Shorts]

Is there a point beyond dismissing very valid arguments without addressing them?

Yes, by all means when it gets sticky then project, demonize and deflect. Par for the course by the left when emotional stances come up against fact and logic.

[UFGN]

Is there a point beyond dismissing very valid arguments without addressing them?

Yes, by all means when it gets sticky then project, demonize and deflect. Par for the course by the left when emotional stances come up against fact and logic.

Its not sticky or awkward at all. If you can't admit that this TDS bullshit label is just a catch all to dismiss legitimate critism of Trump then I CBA with you because you're a waste of time.

Every president gets criticism. It doesn't get a special label each time does it. When fking idiots on the right were calling Obama a communist, a this, a that, and words I won't repeat, did it have a special term? No? Nor did criticism of Bush or Biden or Clinton or any of the others

You're tedious and basic.

[Pat Rice in Short Shorts]

TDS becomes an issue when everything that Trump does, even when it aligns with previous policies by other administrations is opposed without question. When 92 plus percent of media coverage is negative that is an issue. When his words are twisted and truth treated as a scene from 1984 it goes far beyond politics and disagreement. When a man is deemed to be Hitler incarnate and his supporters fascists then political violence is "justified". TDS is about the refusal to accept that his policies are democratic and lawful as the courts affirm time after time. TDS is about knee jerk support for the truly corrupt such as the Clintons and Obama folk without question or examination. It is about changing alliances from traditional left wing patriotic stances such as free speech and suspect intel agencies to being in favor of the opposite if it goes against MAGA, which are nothing more than reverting to traditional values that prevailed just 15 years ago. Nothing racist, nothing anti LBGT (the rest of the letters are alphabet soup). Just safe streets, sane taxation and adherence to our Constitution. A document that more nations should be mimicking to be frank.

Like I said before, it is social contagion and treated now as such my many mental health providers. It is not a catch phrase.

[UFGN]

TDS becomes an issue when everything that Trump does, even when it aligns with previous policies by other administrations is opposed without question. When 92 plus percent of media coverage is negative that is an issue. When his words are twisted and truth treated as a scene from 1984 it goes far beyond politics and disagreement. When a man is deemed to be Hitler incarnate and his supporters fascists then political violence is "justified". TDS is about the refusal to accept that his policies are democratic and lawful as the courts affirm time after time. TDS is about knee jerk support for the truly corrupt such as the Clintons and Obama folk without question or examination. It is about changing alliances from traditional left wing patriotic stances such as free speech and suspect intel agencies to being in favor of the opposite if it goes against MAGA, which are nothing more than reverting to traditional values that prevailed just 15 years ago. Nothing racist, nothing anti LBGT (the rest of the letters are alphabet soup). Just safe streets, sane taxation and adherence to our Constitution. A document that more nations should be mimicking to be frank.

Like I said before, it is social contagion and treated now as such my many mental health providers. It is not a catch phrase.

He is being treated EXACTLY THE SAME as any other president. If the criticism of him or his policies feels more intense then maybe YOU need to examine your own biasses and ask

A) Is that actually true compared to other presidents? Really?

B) Is it because you like him so dislike people having a go at him, and in the same vein does your confirmation bias cling to this convient TDS label to validate your opinion over those YOU casualty label "marxists" etc.

C) Even if it is true that he gets more criticism and opposition, (he doesn't) maybe ask why? Maybe even if that were the case, you can't cope woth the actual reasons for that? Maybe it's because he dishes out hate and gets it back? Maybe he causes people to feel afraid so they respond accordingly? Maybe his policies are hurting people and his reckless, inflammatory speeches embolden hate against people who in turn, hate him.

BTW why would other western countries want to be more like the USA ffs. What a ridiculous comment. More violent crime, much more murder, lower education standards in state schools, a medical system that is outrageously expensive and causes bankruptcy, less rights as an employee, much less holiday pay, lower building standards, the highest prison population in the world in both absolute and per capita levels, lower food standards and honestly I could go on and on......all achieved with your magnificent constitution!!! Er, nah. Even with all its problems, Britain still beats the US EASILY. And when it comes to some of our European cousins, the gap between them and the US is even wider in their favour.

[Pat Rice in Short Shorts]

Maybe you are ignoring the bias because it fits yours?

My evidence is that all these conspiracies that media creates, promotes then are proven wrong keep arising. At some point maybe accept that there is an agenda at play and it is not based in democratic ideals.

You like to use projection as an argument, My support for Trump is based in policy and will remain so. You get too mad dude.

Your second paragraph is interesting. My point is that the pendulum is swinging back to the right in global politics. To ignore that is simply not paying attention or not getting the full picture.

[UFGN]

Maybe you are ignoring the bias because it fits yours?

My evidence is that all these conspiracies that media creates, promotes then are proven wrong keep arising. At some point maybe accept that there is an agenda at play and it is not based in democratic ideals.

You like to use projection as an argument, My support for Trump is based in policy and will remain so. You get too mad dude.

Your second paragraph is interesting. My point is that the pendulum is swinging back to the right in global politics. To ignore that is simply not paying attention or not getting the full picture.

I get the distinct impression that you often spout a load of bollocks, probably on and off this forum, and usually get away with it. You're not used to being called out on the absolute bs you come out with

You are extremely biassed in his favour. Even if that is for reasons of policy it doesn't make it any less so. What a stupid thing to say. You think I vote Lib Dem because I like Ed Davey's suits? However, unlike you, if Ed Davey repeatedly, over years, came out with a bunch of nasty, devisive, hurtful and moronic language, designed to spread fear and devision, I wouldn't support him.

You support Trump despite all that....precisely because it is all in furtherence of policies and politics you support.

In addition, you sling amaturish pseudo-political labels and exaggeration around like confetti, and ALL of it is targeted against the left, all the time, so wind your neck in. You're absolutely brimful of it.

[theHotHead]

No you are absolutely wrong. He uses blatantly devisive and aggressive language consistently in a way not seen from a US president in recent history. And spare me his fking hurt feelings. He's the president of the US and is supposed to rise above it. He gets no more heat than any previous president. Look at Obama for example. Look at George W. Which is funny actually because Trump deserves more than those two.

Language from a president matters. His rhetoric has eboldened racists and made them feel like their views are valid and mainstream. And also provoked hatred against him and Republicans because of his policies and his emboldening of 'Murica First thugs.

And that is all his fault.

He could have chosen for none of that to have happened. But he deliberately CHOSE to whip up hatred and discord as a political policy.

Divisive and aggressive language = businessman. Wishy washy and ambiguous = politician.

Trump gets the job done, there is no faffing about, he gets straight to it. Within a month of coming to office he spoke about ending the war in Ukraine, his predecessors were not interested in ending the war, just supporting Ukraine. This war needs to end, so at least begin the dialogue, what is actually needed to end the war. Trump is a doer, others are talkers.

Why is it necessary for Trump to be like his predecessors ? Why does he have to act a certain way to be a president ? Granted, some of the things he has said raises eyebrows - you would never hear any politician say some of those things, but why is that a bad thing ? Isn't that what we teach kids, that being different is not a bad thing?!

What a President does/achieves is important, your association with what Trump says and racists is a lazy link, thrown around with no real thought given to it. Being proud of one's nation is a good thing. Wanting to make your nation strong is a good thing. Identifying bad elements in society snd wanting rid of them is a good thing. In and of itself there is nothing wrong with those goals of Trump. The lazy part is you claiming it emboldens racists LOL. Literally If I said I want black people to have more pride in themselves and to target self -improvement, I would be labelled racist, pro-black, it would incite actual racists to attack me. Am I emboldening racists by saying black people need to get stronger and better ? Its a tenuous link. Extreme nationalists will always gravitate to anything even mildly patriotic, is being a patriot emboldening racists ? Where do we draw the line ?! Being proud of the Union Jack/flag is now deemed something racist, its bonkers.

[Pat Rice in Short Shorts]

Good points. I would ad that 90% of what is reported as being hateful speech by Trump is simply out of context quotes that leave out the qualifiers or even half the sentences. The BBC lawsuit will point these out to the likes of UFGN who willfully ignore the bias and believe all the misinformation that has been spread over the past decade now. The media has been proven wrong time and time time again, accepting Pulitzers for flawed and untrue reporting, with never a retraction or apology to the readers. The number of instances that this occurs is too high to count, but by simply reading a negative take by a media outlet which is parroted and then actually reading the full quote for one's self as many are now doing the whole paradigm changes. Emotion surrenders to logic. To not do this is being lazy and either cheating yourself of truth to oneself or engaging in bias confirmation. Propaganda works when only one viewpoint is examined.

Any reasonable person can see TDS a mile off, and certainly should be able to separate their emotions about a person from the results of the policies. Hell, the media should be able to to do the same and report the good AND the bad. When their reporting is 92% negative on issues that voters do care about such as crime and immigration that is hardly balanced nor could it be definitionally truthful.

The public has been (and the UK is the worst) shamed into being scared of being called racist or some sort of "phobic" for simply asking perfectly reasonable questions about policies that affect their own lives and use their taxes to fund. These accusations are cuddles used to keep folks in line, much as people were when the Catholic Church did the same back in the day or Islam does now. As always, people wake up to the manipulation and start thinking for themselves. History repeats with different players in different times. I'd suggest that Trump is say a modern Che Guevara figure but with opposite world views and political leanings. Both are revolutionary and have popular support that is rooted in utter distain for the establishment. The establishment's response is to try to enact laws that criminalize speech and as we are seeing...even thought.

[Pat Rice in Short Shorts]

Maybe you are ignoring the bias because it fits yours?

My evidence is that all these conspiracies that media creates, promotes then are proven wrong keep arising. At some point maybe accept that there is an agenda at play and it is not based in democratic ideals.

You like to use projection as an argument, My support for Trump is based in policy and will remain so. You get too mad dude.

Your second paragraph is interesting. My point is that the pendulum is swinging back to the right in global politics. To ignore that is simply not paying attention or not getting the full picture.

I get the distinct impression that you often spout a load of bollocks, probably on and off this forum, and usually get away with it. You're not used to being called out on the absolute bs you come out with

You are extremely biassed in his favour. Even if that is for reasons of policy it doesn't make it any less so. What a stupid thing to say. You think I vote Lib Dem because I like Ed Davey's suits? However, unlike you, if Ed Davey repeatedly, over years, came out with a bunch of nasty, devisive, hurtful and moronic language, designed to spread fear and devision, I wouldn't support him.

You support Trump despite all that....precisely because it is all in furtherence of policies and politics you support.

In addition, you sling amaturish pseudo-political labels and exaggeration around like confetti, and ALL of it is targeted against the left, all the time, so wind your neck in. You're absolutely brimful of it.

I have no problem with your political stances, they are yours to take. But I suspect I can easily refute them based on facts and not by bringing your motivation into play. My guess is that they are honest and heartfelt, and that as a 19 year old I certainly held many of the same views.

Projection is pretty easy to identify in any argument put forward in debate. Perhaps you should appreciate that using projection is always a demerit in any formal debate setting, not that some online expression is that. I would be surprised if you switched horses in midstream and took a red pill but dude, at least defend a position with facts and logic.

Is the core issue here Trump as a human being or the results of his policies?

[UFGN]

Maybe you are ignoring the bias because it fits yours?

My evidence is that all these conspiracies that media creates, promotes then are proven wrong keep arising. At some point maybe accept that there is an agenda at play and it is not based in democratic ideals.

You like to use projection as an argument, My support for Trump is based in policy and will remain so. You get too mad dude.

Your second paragraph is interesting. My point is that the pendulum is swinging back to the right in global politics. To ignore that is simply not paying attention or not getting the full picture.

I get the distinct impression that you often spout a load of bollocks, probably on and off this forum, and usually get away with it. You're not used to being called out on the absolute bs you come out with

You are extremely biassed in his favour. Even if that is for reasons of policy it doesn't make it any less so. What a stupid thing to say. You think I vote Lib Dem because I like Ed Davey's suits? However, unlike you, if Ed Davey repeatedly, over years, came out with a bunch of nasty, devisive, hurtful and moronic language, designed to spread fear and devision, I wouldn't support him.

You support Trump despite all that....precisely because it is all in furtherence of policies and politics you support.

In addition, you sling amaturish pseudo-political labels and exaggeration around like confetti, and ALL of it is targeted against the left, all the time, so wind your neck in. You're absolutely brimful of it.

I have no problem with your political stances, they are yours to take. But I suspect I can easily refute them based on facts and not by bringing your motivation into play. My guess is that they are honest and heartfelt, and that as a 19 year old I certainly held many of the same views.

Projection is pretty easy to identify in any argument put forward in debate. Perhaps you should appreciate that using projection is always a demerit in any formal debate setting, not that some online expression is that. I would be surprised if you switched horses in midstream and took a red pill but dude, at least defend a position with facts and logic.

Is the core issue here Trump as a human being or the results of his policies?

Yeah again with the bs pseudobabble

By going on about projection you avoid, as usual, addressing the frailty of your own arguments and your own blatant biasses.

The reason I won't let this drop is you have the breathtaking arrogance to label people with opinions differing to yours as biassed while implying that you are not.

Accusing whoever you're disagreeing with of bias and projection while denying it of yourself might work with whoever was dumb enough to pay for your "political consultancy" but it won't work here. Try harder. Just be honest.

[Pat Rice in Short Shorts]

Ok. lets play then.

I support Trump on America First trade policies given he is an American president...your take?
I support him deporting all illegals and restoring sane immigration policies such as what Obama and Clinton had in place. Your take?
I support the efforts to reduce rampant street crime, yours?
I detest the political violence that has become accepted. Including the Jan 6 violence.
I recognize that drug addiction leads to most "petty" crime along with gang/cartel wars. Yours?
I recognize that Indian reservations are the hub of much of the drug running and distribution and that the tribal members are victimized and "disapeared"...you are for or against the FBI increasing its presence in Indian country?
I am against the massive amount of corruption in government...you?
I am for freedom of speech and thought and am against censorship and media manipulation of facts to fit their agenda...be it BBC or Fox News. I assume that one we agree on?
I support Trump in finding and deporting illegal truck drivers who have been licensed in CA, WA, OR, MN and NY. At least a citizen per week killed by these guys. I am also for prosecuting their employers.
Get the massive waste and abuse out of government.
Save Medicare and Social Security.
I have deep concerns about the massive human trafficking that went along with the open borders. At least some of the kids are being found and taken care of now.
I support Trump in rooting out the financial fraud in Somali communities along with the immigration fraud which has been common knowledge for many years.
I support Trump trying to bring manufacturing back to the US.
I fully support rooting out insider trading by Congressmen and staff...be it Crenshaw or Pelosi.
I want health insurance and pharmaceutical manufactures to be brought to heel.
I want private medical treatment costs to be transparent.
I am thrilled that he got the Abraham Accords through and thus the cease fire in Gaza.
I am all for getting Israel out of our government.
I want the Palestinians to prosper and make Gaza what it should be.
I want a practical and sustainable way to provide healthcare to everyone without screwing up the good bits of our current system.
I am against the globalist's agenda. Bush, Clinton, Obama, Biden extending to Starmer, Boris or Kemi.
I am certainly against never ending wars that do not involve the US. If the UK and EU wants to draft kids to fight Russia good luck.
I am fully supportive of Trump's foreign policy agenda that prioritizes US interests with our own hemisphere.
I want grizzly bears delisted and numbers controlled...a local issue for sure! (One dug up our septic system in October and cost us $3500 to repair, killed two dogs up the road, then he broke into the hatchery and ate fish and chased the guy feeding them until the game warden shot it.)

That's a start my man, Actually that is MAGA in a large nutshell. MAGA matches up with my political and social agendas. I have never worshiped another human being and never will. I do agree with Trump on these policies and will defend him against the BS because that is an attempt to derail these policies. The whole anti Trump agenda is nothing more than opposing his policies. That is what you seem to miss.

Why don't you just check off the ones your do not agree with? I imagine we do agree on lots of it. We both are compassionate but certainly come at issues from opposite sides of the coin?

[theHotHead]

Ok, so now I am at the point where I have to say I think Trump is mad as a madhatter !! Tariffs for countries that don't agree with his mental plan to buy Greenland?!!! What the f**k is wrong with this man?!

I could see the method in his madness for other things, hell I argued the toss in favour of him. But this is just straight up bullying and I don't like bullies. This is a step too far for me.