European Politics

[Yago]

Feels like people aren't really paying attention to the Ukraine situation at all, and even when they are aren't grasping the consequences. This has a good chance of becoming the largest military conflict in Europe since Yugoslavia. Ukraine isn't some insignificant country... 40 million people live there. If Russia does invade, as seems likely atm, it will be a very bloody thing, and the refugee crisis that follows will dwarf the recent Syria one. This will have a huge impact across the continent, yet people will still act as if it came out of nowhere.

[Phil71]

Feels like people aren't really paying attention to the Ukraine situation at all, and even when they are aren't grasping the consequences. This has a good chance of becoming the largest military conflict in Europe since Yugoslavia. Ukraine isn't some insignificant country... 40 million people live there. If Russia does invade, as seems likely atm, it will be a very bloody thing, and the refugee crisis that follows will dwarf the recent Syria one. This will have a huge impact across the continent, yet people will still act as if it came out of nowhere.

I'm well aware of it, and have made a few posts on here about it.

Russia cannot be allowed to invade Ukraine and get away with it. Ukraine must be armed by NATO and Russia must be cut off from all international trade if they invade.

[Yago]

Feels like people aren't really paying attention to the Ukraine situation at all, and even when they are aren't grasping the consequences. This has a good chance of becoming the largest military conflict in Europe since Yugoslavia. Ukraine isn't some insignificant country... 40 million people live there. If Russia does invade, as seems likely atm, it will be a very bloody thing, and the refugee crisis that follows will dwarf the recent Syria one. This will have a huge impact across the continent, yet people will still act as if it came out of nowhere.

I'm well aware of it, and have made a few posts on here about it.

Russia cannot be allowed to invade Ukraine and get away with it. Ukraine must be armed by NATO and Russia must be cut off from all international trade if they invade.

Was talking about the general public tbh, not the posters in here. And yeah, Germany being so dependent on Russian oil isn't helping with regards to possible sanctions.

[Phil71]

Feels like people aren't really paying attention to the Ukraine situation at all, and even when they are aren't grasping the consequences. This has a good chance of becoming the largest military conflict in Europe since Yugoslavia. Ukraine isn't some insignificant country... 40 million people live there. If Russia does invade, as seems likely atm, it will be a very bloody thing, and the refugee crisis that follows will dwarf the recent Syria one. This will have a huge impact across the continent, yet people will still act as if it came out of nowhere.

I'm well aware of it, and have made a few posts on here about it.

Russia cannot be allowed to invade Ukraine and get away with it. Ukraine must be armed by NATO and Russia must be cut off from all international trade if they invade.

Was talking about the general public tbh, not the posters in here. And yeah, Germany being so dependent on Russian oil isn't helping with regards to possible sanctions.

About 25% of Europe's oil & gas supplies come from Russia.

But Russia depends on Europe to buy 50% of the oil & gas it produces, and around 60% of Russia's exports are to Europe and the UK. Add their exports to the rest of NATO countries and that's crippling.

[EliteKiller]

Feels like people aren't really paying attention to the Ukraine situation at all, and even when they are aren't grasping the consequences. This has a good chance of becoming the largest military conflict in Europe since Yugoslavia. Ukraine isn't some insignificant country... 40 million people live there. If Russia does invade, as seems likely atm, it will be a very bloody thing, and the refugee crisis that follows will dwarf the recent Syria one. This will have a huge impact across the continent, yet people will still act as if it came out of nowhere.

I'm well aware of it, and have made a few posts on here about it.

Russia cannot be allowed to invade Ukraine and get away with it. Ukraine must be armed by NATO and Russia must be cut off from all international trade if they invade.

Not as simple as you think - when Russia annexed Crimea it was then part of the Ukraine - but it wanted to be part of Russia and now to all intents and purposes it is.

There are many in far Eastern Ukraine who feel the same, hence the 'minor incursion' drivel from Biden. It is quite possible that a section of eastern Ukraine would happily join with Russia, should the West join a war to stop this happening? Would that be a bit like Europe attacking the UK because it won't allow Scotland to join the EU ... hmmmm

If Russia tries to take over the entire Ukraine then that's a different issue, but as with the Crimea is Russia just takes a section that is mostly ethnic Russians already, is that something to fight a war over? is that the breaking point?

As for cutting Russia off, you're dreaming, they will just trade with Asia primarily China, who have no interest in the Ukraine at all. Shutting the Russian trade with the EU will just cause massive fuel price rises in Europe and make bugger all difference to Russia ... the previous 20 years of US sanctions prove that.

[LMAO]

https://www.thetrafalgargroup.org/wp-co ... Report.pdf

What level of involvement should the U.S. have if Russia invades Ukraine? (%)

• Provide only diplomatic area pressure: 30.5 (All) | 30.7 (Democrats) | 35.4 (Republicans) | 22.0 (Other)
• Provide U.S. troops as boots on the ground: 15.3 | 12.6 | 16.4 | 18.1
• Provide U.S. military advisors: 23.2 | 27.1 | 16.2 | 27.3
• Provide supplies and military weapons: 31.1 | 29.5 | 31.9| 32.5

Do you believe the Biden Administration should use U.S. military assets to defend Taiwan if Taiwan is invaded by China? (%)

• Yes : 58.1 (All) | 56.2 (Democrats) | 60.8 (Republicans) | 57.4 (Other)
• No: 41.9 | 43.8 | 39.2 | 42.6

This poll tracks with my experience. As I've said, I don't want our military fighting in Ukraine, but I'm all for providing Ukraine with weapons and intelligence. Ultimately, Ukraine is Europe's problem whereas Taiwan directly affects us.

[Royal Gooner]

To be honest, I think putin is trying to get separatists to declare independence then claim they are joining Russia the same way Crimea did.

[Goonerred]

To be honest, I think putin is trying to get separatists to declare independence then claim they are joining Russia the same way Crimea did.

I've also read aarticles suggesting that Putin is being quite clever. The West, especially Europe is in a process of change. A new Government in Germany, France and Portugal heading for elections and the UK in disarray becuae of 'partygate'. Maybe we are not as focussed as we should be.

[LMAO]

To be honest, I think putin is trying to get separatists to declare independence then claim they are joining Russia the same way Crimea did.

Sounds like the CIA needs to get up to some Cold War era shenanigans in the Russian Caucasus and Kaliningrad. What's MI6 up to these days? Could do a collab

[Jedi]

Tankie Tulsi blames the US for *checks notes* Russia wanting to invade Ukraine.

I thought at first that It's possible she was just stupid but at this point there's no way she isn't a Kremlin asset.

Hillary Clinton vindicated yet again.

[jayramfootball]

Tankie Tulsi blames the US for *checks notes* Russia wanting to invade Ukraine.

I thought at first that It's possible she was just stupid but at this point there's no way she isn't a Kremlin asset.

Hillary Clinton vindicated yet again.

I don't think the US is to blame per se, but the language that some senior US politicians and influential pundits have used over the last few years when it comes to Russia has been pretty bad. They have been stoking anti-Russia sentiment for so long, I can well imagine the Russians just getting to breaking point and saying 'f**k you'. I could see why Russia would think that the US is a dangerous threat and needs to fortify borders and strategic positions... including Ukraine.

[Jedi]

The language of the US politicians? Have you seen the way Russia acts? Other than the constant cyber attacks, here's Putin showcasing new nukes by demonstrating how they could detonate in Florida. What a friendly guy.
https://youtu.be/VlEaec2d6AA


Also that excuse is so pathetic.

"We're afraid that NATO is close to our border so we will annex an entire country because of it."

Ukraine isn't some strategic position, it's a sovereign country and a democracy and It's not on Russia to decide who they choose to form an alliance with.

I guess NATO should now invade Belarus to fortify their own borders.

You and Tankie Tulsi need to stop bootlicking for fascist Russia.

[jayramfootball]

The language of the US politicians? Have you seen the way Russia acts? Other than the constant cyber attacks, here's Putin showcasing new nukes by demonstrating how they could detonate in Florida. What a friendly guy.
https://youtu.be/VlEaec2d6AA


Also that excuse is so pathetic.

"We're afraid that NATO is close to our border so we will annex an entire country because of it."

Ukraine isn't some strategic position, it's a sovereign country and a democracy and It's not on Russia to decide who they choose to form an alliance with.

I guess NATO should now invade Belarus to fortify their own borders.

You and Tankie Tulsi need to stop bootlicking for fascist Russia.

Russia are not good guys that's for sure, but the US are no better really... and much of the rhetoric has come from the US unfortunately.
It's red under the bed type mentality that has been ramped up for nearly 5 years.
These are the consequences.

I don't know what can be done about it at this stage - it's terrible diplomacy in action.
The US can not win a war against Russia and vice versa... it's mutual destruction. In such a situation cool heads and measured words are needed - something neither side seems to be very good at.

[Jedi]

The US is a lot better. I reject your moral relativism. Democracies and fascist regimes are not the same.

By the way, the only reason Ukraine isn't in NATO, even though they've begged to enter, is because the US and EU wanted to appease Putin and not make him feel threatened.

Their reward for that is Putin likely invading Ukraine. And by the way, this has nothing to do with "securing borders". This is about Putin's dream of reforming the Soviet Union.

If you don't believe me, take it straight from the horses mouth:http://en.kremlin.ru/events/president/news/66181

If you have the time i recommend reading that. It's pretty long but at least skim through it. He gives his perspective on why Ukrainians and Russians are "one people".

[jayramfootball]

The US is a lot better. I reject your moral relativism. Democracies and fascist regimes are not the same.

By the way, the only reason Ukraine isn't in NATO, even though they've begged to enter, is because the US and EU wanted to appease Putin and not make him feel threatened.

Their reward for that is Putin likely invading Ukraine. And by the way, this has nothing to do with "securing borders". This is about Putin's dream of reforming the Soviet Union.

If you don't believe me, take it straight from the horses mouth:http://en.kremlin.ru/events/president/news/66181

If you have the time i recommend reading that. He gives his perspective on why Ukrainians and Russians are "one people".

I am not going to get into any defence of Russia, but I will maintain that he biggest war mongers and threat to peace in the world is the US.
I place them at the top of the list of countries that brought the deaths of millions in the ME.