West Brom Vs Arsenal | Premiership 19/03/2011

[Fabrestuta]

Not getting into the Chamakh v Bendy debate, but what amazes me is Chamakh started out like a house on fire then hit a barren patch and wasn't played again for months. I obviously don't know what goes on behind the scenes but that was very weird imo.

The fact that in the space of one season gooners went from calling him "just what we need" to "he's absolute rubbish" is also kind of mind boggling.

Behind the scenes we were told that he was 'tired' because he wasn't used to the pace of the Prem.

As for the change in opinion, it only reflects his performances really...

He is a lightweight I agree, but he has shown he can score goals. I was frankly disgusted when Wenger announced that he was tired, gave people more ammo to call our players poofs, should have been kept in house, but Chamakh was never the next Henry, as some people got giddy about, but neither is he Jimmy Carter. He is a decent player, imo he won't be any more than that, playing in the English game that is. If he can get say 15 league goals a season I'd class that as ok, people need to stop expecting every one of our forwards to get 30/35 a season.

[Van The Man Persie]

I expected Chamakh to get 10-15 a season and hes got that. Not worried about him. He'll improve even more next season

[Inchpräctice]

But I don't "prefer" Chamakh, that's the mind set I have issue with!! Yes I think Chamakh is a better overall player than Bendtner, but I don't let any petty tribalism like the B52 fan club fog my vision and that's exactly what it looks like you lot do. Bendtner has a bad game, you either go silent or you defend him to the nth degree if anyone has a pop. Chamakh (direct competition with Bendy) has a bad game and you go for the throat. It's not a conspiracy but it's certainly favouritism and it's pretty sad.

This is all in your mind, sorry guv.

I don't criticize Chamakh because he plays in Bendtner's position I criticise him because he's been shit. That's all there is to it.
I really wish he wasn't because if he'd continued his earlier form we might be top of the table.
Besides, B52's position this season seems to be RW so it isn't even the same as Chamakh's.
I think you're confusing post-match criticism with the Bendy v Chamakh debate.
That whole debate was many months ago and if you want to dig the thread out you'll find that I pointed out all the things that Chamakh is better than Bendy at. I'm perfectly capable of being objective thanks.

The only reason I had to defend Bendtner back then is because when Chamakh was brilliant many people had the attitude of 'Right let's sell B52 for as much as possible, Chamakh is clearly waaaay better.' which to me is bullshit.

By the way, again I will reiterate that the B52 fan club only needs to exist because he is so badly slated all the time, even when he scores a hatrick.
There are a few of us who have no choice but to defend him in the face of totally misdirected criticism whenever we lose/draw a game.
He's been the scapegoat for the last few seasons and it's so boring.
The 'fan club' as you put it shouldn't even need to exist, the fan club should be all Arsenal fans, period.
Sadly some fans only want to see the bad in some of our players.

Regarding Sagna, you forget all his fantastic crosses against Man U? Today with 3 strikers on the field don't you expect one of them to get on the end one one of his crosses, even if they aren't the best he's ever put in? I think his delivery has improved significantly this season so it's a really bizarre thing to go knee jerk over

Well maybe but I did admit it was a knee-jerk.
I also agree that his crossing has improved this season but on today's evidence it's clearly back to its old self again.
I'm just so sick of knowing that he'll get looooads of the ball on that right wing and knowing that f**k all will come of it.
It's just like the fact that every gooner knows that we can have 50 corners in a game and we'll never score from one. It's just concrete fact these days and I'm bored of it.

[Leody]

Not getting into the Chamakh v Bendy debate, but what amazes me is Chamakh started out like a house on fire then hit a barren patch and wasn't played again for months. I obviously don't know what goes on behind the scenes but that was very weird imo.

The fact that in the space of one season gooners went from calling him "just what we need" to "he's absolute rubbish" is also kind of mind boggling.

What's mind boggling is how Almunia ever got a job as a professional footballer...

I'm still just amazed at that walk about today. I was at my 'pool mate's house for the match, and he just had to laugh at my reaction. I think I was just blankly staring at the ceiling for a good 20-30 secs... then quickly finished the rest of my beer.

[CynicalGooner]

I expected Chamakh to get 10-15 a season and hes got that. Not worried about him. He'll improve even more next season

I agree. He is decent back up but not a first teamer, just like Bendtner, Koscielny, Eboue and various others. But none of them are more than back-up and as long as that remains the case (whether we sell first team players or not) then I'm fine with them

Unlike certain other current players

[Inchpräctice]

Not getting into the Chamakh v Bendy debate, but what amazes me is Chamakh started out like a house on fire then hit a barren patch and wasn't played again for months. I obviously don't know what goes on behind the scenes but that was very weird imo.

The fact that in the space of one season gooners went from calling him "just what we need" to "he's absolute rubbish" is also kind of mind boggling.

Behind the scenes we were told that he was 'tired' because he wasn't used to the pace of the Prem.

As for the change in opinion, it only reflects his performances really...

He is a lightweight I agree, but he has shown he can score goals. I was frankly disgusted when Wenger announced that he was tired, gave people more ammo to call our players poofs, should have been kept in house, but Chamakh was never the next Henry, as some people got giddy about, but neither is he Jimmy Carter. He is a decent player, imo he won't be any more than that, playing in the English game that is. If he can get say 15 league goals a season I'd class that as ok, people need to stop expecting every one of our forwards to get 30/35 a season.

I don't know who these people were who thought he'd be the next Henry but if I remember correctly the thread about him on here went on for 34928 pages and most of that contained people going 'meh'.
People kept bleating on about the fact that he only scored 12 goals in 7 years or whatever the f***ing number was, so no-one was expecting a 30 goal per season man.

I can only speak for myself and personally I'm disappointed because a) we needed another fox in the box not another SS type of player and b) if he's going to be the type of SS who doesn't score much but makes loads of assists then he needs to be a bit less shit.
It's his first season so we should give him some time to settle in but the bizarre thing is that initially he didn't seem to need any!

[GunnGunn]

I am fan of Bendy, its no secret, but he has been slated by myself on here especially in the past few weeks.

No player is immune to criticism but it swings both ways.

You say people say he can do no wrong, yet on the other hand people seek out to slate him for no apparent reason, and choose to let their petty arguments get in the way of cold hard facts.

The fact of the matter is that A) He was injured for a large chunk of the season B) He has played on the wing for 99% of the season and C) He is only two goals behind Chamakh, has more assists and has played about 10 less games.

Chamakh also cannot score goals that Bendtner can, he cannot cut in and finish, he can only score tap ins and headers, and his headers have been woeful lately.

For the record i like Chamakh and he was excellent at the beginning of the season, but lets not sugar coat the fact that he has gone off the boil massively.

I do not believe the physicality of the Prem has gotten to him, this is a player we thought had a great engine, its supposed to be one of his biggest attributes...Definitely something fishy there IMO.

Don't talk cods either Cyn, you definitely "prefer" him to Bendtner, you have done ever since the start of the season, that isn't a bad thing, yet you make it sound like preferring players is?

Or do you equally prefer Diaby to Nasri? I don't think so.

Everybody has a few players that they really want to see succeed, i want to see Bendtner succeed because he is a quality young player whose mentality has been blown out of proportion, his confidence has been turned against him by the media and fans who proclaim its arrogance.

Anyone who has ever seen an interview with him would know he is one of the most humble and down to earth guys around, he wants to be one of the best and if he genuinely believes that he can be, regardless of whether he will or not, who are we to judge him?

I would rather have a player who believes he can be the best and whose confidence is always at its highest that someone who has accepted they are not going to get much better and bottles it when it comes to the crunch.

Why do you think Bendtner has always come off the bench to save us? Because he just does not give up.

Yes he has had some f***ing massive shockers in his time, and he has been poor more often that not, but last season he was absolute quality and he didn't get any credit for nearly single handedly keeping us in the title race, Remember Hull? Remember Wolves? Games where we could not break them down and he won them for us at the death.

Bendtner is never going to be the most mobile player, or the most pretty but he can and he will grow up to be an extremely effective striker capable of scoring some truly great goals.

And while he is getting there, you can be sure he has the utmost confidence in the abilities he has now, however people rate them.

As for Sagna = Best RB in the World, most consistent as well, i don't give a flying f**k if he can't cross, we never have anyone in the box to finish them off anyway.

[Inchpräctice]

I expected Chamakh to get 10-15 a season and hes got that. Not worried about him. He'll improve even more next season

I agree. He is decent back up but not a first teamer, just like Bendtner, Koscielny, Eboue and various others. But none of them are more than back-up and as long as that remains the case (whether we sell first team players or not) then I'm fine with them

Unlike certain other current players

If Chamakh was meant to be back-up then logically that means we only have one first team striker!

If Bendy, Chamakh and Vela are all back-up it's only RVP!
In the past we've always had two top quality strikers and I don't see why that should change especially when RVP spends all season injured.

[GunnGunn]

Not getting into the Chamakh v Bendy debate, but what amazes me is Chamakh started out like a house on fire then hit a barren patch and wasn't played again for months. I obviously don't know what goes on behind the scenes but that was very weird imo.

The fact that in the space of one season gooners went from calling him "just what we need" to "he's absolute rubbish" is also kind of mind boggling.

What's mind boggling is how Almunia ever got a job as a professional footballer...

I know mate. I am truly amazed. How many points do we need to drop before Wenger realizes that he is just not good enough.

Its not our fault our two star keepers of the season got injured, its not Moonia's either.

[Inchpräctice]

Inch I can't believe you want Sagna to be sold. He is easily the best RB in the league, if not the world and the most natural defender we have. Calling for him to be sold is madness, IMO

It's a knee-jerk ok!
Should've put it in the very thread I created.
He's a brilliant defender but I just wish he'd learn to cross that's all.

We've had Beckham at the club twice and he's picked up nothing from him. I just wonder if he'll ever get that right because in some games it's the difference between winning and losing.

People always moan that we want to walk the ball into the net and we have no plan B. When teams park the bus like today the best plan B is to whip crosses into the box and it just infuriated me that yet again they were so easily cleared by the CBs.
The team works so hard to get the ball out to Sagna in the first place.

[VCC]

I dont mind chamak or Bendy the thing is they are not imo the loan striker type,so they are not first pick for AW,I would love to see the both rotate with RVP and Vela who has been left out of the argument thus far,the thing is i see RVP and Vela prospering well with the tehn added goals that Bendy and Chamak got,then of course if i was offered the chance of bying another proven goal scorer to rotate with RVP i would take it and sell Vella but keep in mind i am talking of playing 2 up top Bendy or Chamak with RVP or new hitman.

[GunnGunn]

Sagna has improved his crossing massively this season Inch, he has played so many quality balls this season.

We don't have anyone to finish them, its all well and good saying they just went to a defenders head but he only has RvP to aim for!

[Inchpräctice]

I think Gunn made a fair point on the crossing part, we rarely have anyone in the box in the right position to bury those crosses, that is one reason people think Clichy's and Sagna's crossing is awful, when it's really not as bad as everyone makes them out to be.

Clichy's crossing was actually decent today, and his right-footed cross to set up RVP's goal against Barca was sublime.
Having said that he gave the ball away far too often today.
I agree we often don't have enough people in the box but today we had RVP, Bendtner and Chamakh running in there.
All tall players and all capable of scoring with their heads.

When Sagna gets it right we win games. Remember the spanking of Spurs when put the ball in FRONT of RVP and RVP ran on to them and scored....?

[Inchpräctice]

Sagna has improved his crossing massively this season Inch, he has played so many quality balls this season.

We don't have anyone to finish them, its all well and good saying they just went to a defenders head but he only has RvP to aim for!

I said his crossing has improved this season but today it was rubbish.
Yes we play with RVP alone up front but other players are often running into the box to get on the end of things.
Like I said, it can't be a coincidence that no-one ever scores from his crosses. Watching him today he always crosses without looking. He just puts the ball into the same area every time.
If he had a quick look up he'd have something to aim for.

[ThereIsBearCüm]

Chamakh got an assist today, more than Bendtner did. (the ball hit the post not his head). Yes Chamakh has fizzled out since the start of the season and as you say Inch no one was great today but I'm frankly bored of the favouritism and selective criticism that goes on here and it's the same people all the time. If Chamakh and Bendtner had 100% identical games we'd be hearing how Bendtner was f***ing brilliant and how Chamakh is a wasteman

The B52 fan club has issues, he can do no wrong in your eyes and likewise anyone who is a threat to his place in the team is an enemy. I can't take you lot seriously.

uhh, no, it hit Bendtner