In the news today...

[Phil71]

The human spirit is a great thing when applied in a good way, and often difficult to alter if the spirit is determined enough.

I've found that people who have pressed the self-destruct button - be they drug addicts or alocoholics or recidivist criminals - will only alter their ways when they themselves have taken stock of their lives and the effect their behaviour has had and is having on themselves and others. Unfortunately no amount of talking or counselling will work for some, so punishment is the only other option. Loss of liberty IS an effective punishment but must be allowed to have the necessary effect. The person must be left alone to determine for themselves that what they have been doing is wrong.

Today there are far too many agencies within our society that weaken the will of the human spirit rather than strengthening it. They offer emotional crutches and cotton-wool landing pads instead of allowing people to fall flat on their face with a big bump when it's required.

Agencies who's ideologies have usurped our cultural remedies for dealing with problems such as anti-social behaviour and criminality. Pseudo-scientists putting a scientific spin on what they have hijacked and promoting themselves as the experts to cure all ills.

They are to blame for a great deal of what's gone wrong in our society over the past 40 years or so.

[Rockape]

It's not acceptable for a young black man to be repeatedly searched, no weapons or drugs found and yet he still gets searched.

That's reasonable in areas where young black kids aren't being killed every week......but the situation has got way out of hand and drastic action is required. If you were a law abiding citizen, you'd be grateful for the Police presence and make it very easy to be scanned quickly, so you could go on your way.

Or you might find it disrespectful and racist that despite being searched multiple times in the same area, the local police still see you as a suspect

Well, I thought that these gangster kids make it pretty easy to be identified as they tend to wear the same clothing and are mostly teenagers? If you dress like a gangster, then be prepared to be stopped. The police should be under orders to focus only on these youths to get the knives off the streets.
CCTV would be helpful too, so particular individuals can be identified and then grabbed by snatch squads.

[UFGN]

It's not acceptable for a young black man to be repeatedly searched, no weapons or drugs found and yet he still gets searched.

That's reasonable in areas where young black kids aren't being killed every week......but the situation has got way out of hand and drastic action is required. If you were a law abiding citizen, you'd be grateful for the Police presence and make it very easy to be scanned quickly, so you could go on your way.

Or you might find it disrespectful and racist that despite being searched multiple times in the same area, the local police still see you as a suspect

Well, I thought that these gangster kids make it pretty easy to be identified as they tend to wear the same clothing and are mostly teenagers? If you dress like a gangster, then be prepared to be stopped. The police should be under orders to focus only on these youths to get the knives off the streets.
CCTV would be helpful too, so particular individuals can be identified and then grabbed by snatch squads.

I have no issue with known criminals being targeted.

People who've been cautioned or convicted of a violent or drug crime..... for say five years after their caution or conviction, it should be open season on them

People who are known to have bragged on Facebook etc about drugs, violence or gangs

But to repeatedly search someone who has repeatedly had nothing on them is rude, disrespectful and racist

[Phil71]

It's not acceptable for a young black man to be repeatedly searched, no weapons or drugs found and yet he still gets searched.

That's reasonable in areas where young black kids aren't being killed every week......but the situation has got way out of hand and drastic action is required. If you were a law abiding citizen, you'd be grateful for the Police presence and make it very easy to be scanned quickly, so you could go on your way.

Or you might find it disrespectful and racist that despite being searched multiple times in the same area, the local police still see you as a suspect

Well, I thought that these gangster kids make it pretty easy to be identified as they tend to wear the same clothing and are mostly teenagers? If you dress like a gangster, then be prepared to be stopped. The police should be under orders to focus only on these youths to get the knives off the streets.
CCTV would be helpful too, so particular individuals can be identified and then grabbed by snatch squads.

I have no issue with known criminals being targeted.

People who've been cautioned or convicted of a violent or drug crime..... for say five years after their caution or conviction, it should be open season on them

People who are known to have bragged on Facebook etc about drugs, violence or gangs

But to repeatedly search someone who has repeatedly had nothing on them is rude, disrespectful and racist

How are the police supposed to apply this policy?

[UFGN]

It's not acceptable for a young black man to be repeatedly searched, no weapons or drugs found and yet he still gets searched.

That's reasonable in areas where young black kids aren't being killed every week......but the situation has got way out of hand and drastic action is required. If you were a law abiding citizen, you'd be grateful for the Police presence and make it very easy to be scanned quickly, so you could go on your way.

Or you might find it disrespectful and racist that despite being searched multiple times in the same area, the local police still see you as a suspect

Well, I thought that these gangster kids make it pretty easy to be identified as they tend to wear the same clothing and are mostly teenagers? If you dress like a gangster, then be prepared to be stopped. The police should be under orders to focus only on these youths to get the knives off the streets.
CCTV would be helpful too, so particular individuals can be identified and then grabbed by snatch squads.

I have no issue with known criminals being targeted.

People who've been cautioned or convicted of a violent or drug crime..... for say five years after their caution or conviction, it should be open season on them

People who are known to have bragged on Facebook etc about drugs, violence or gangs

But to repeatedly search someone who has repeatedly had nothing on them is rude, disrespectful and racist

How are the police supposed to apply this policy?

Why would it be hard for them to?

Local police in XYZ area will know who these people are.

[Phil71]

It's not acceptable for a young black man to be repeatedly searched, no weapons or drugs found and yet he still gets searched.

That's reasonable in areas where young black kids aren't being killed every week......but the situation has got way out of hand and drastic action is required. If you were a law abiding citizen, you'd be grateful for the Police presence and make it very easy to be scanned quickly, so you could go on your way.

Or you might find it disrespectful and racist that despite being searched multiple times in the same area, the local police still see you as a suspect

Well, I thought that these gangster kids make it pretty easy to be identified as they tend to wear the same clothing and are mostly teenagers? If you dress like a gangster, then be prepared to be stopped. The police should be under orders to focus only on these youths to get the knives off the streets.
CCTV would be helpful too, so particular individuals can be identified and then grabbed by snatch squads.

I have no issue with known criminals being targeted.

People who've been cautioned or convicted of a violent or drug crime..... for say five years after their caution or conviction, it should be open season on them

People who are known to have bragged on Facebook etc about drugs, violence or gangs

But to repeatedly search someone who has repeatedly had nothing on them is rude, disrespectful and racist

How are the police supposed to apply this policy?

Why would it be hard for them to?

Local police in XYZ area will know who these people are.

What if they are not from that area? Or they're wearing a hoodie?

[UFGN]

It's not acceptable for a young black man to be repeatedly searched, no weapons or drugs found and yet he still gets searched.

That's reasonable in areas where young black kids aren't being killed every week......but the situation has got way out of hand and drastic action is required. If you were a law abiding citizen, you'd be grateful for the Police presence and make it very easy to be scanned quickly, so you could go on your way.

Or you might find it disrespectful and racist that despite being searched multiple times in the same area, the local police still see you as a suspect

Well, I thought that these gangster kids make it pretty easy to be identified as they tend to wear the same clothing and are mostly teenagers? If you dress like a gangster, then be prepared to be stopped. The police should be under orders to focus only on these youths to get the knives off the streets.
CCTV would be helpful too, so particular individuals can be identified and then grabbed by snatch squads.

I have no issue with known criminals being targeted.

People who've been cautioned or convicted of a violent or drug crime..... for say five years after their caution or conviction, it should be open season on them

People who are known to have bragged on Facebook etc about drugs, violence or gangs

But to repeatedly search someone who has repeatedly had nothing on them is rude, disrespectful and racist

How are the police supposed to apply this policy?

Why would it be hard for them to?

Local police in XYZ area will know who these people are.

What if they are not from that area? Or they're wearing a hoodie?

Most stabbings and drug / knife crime happens within local areas

You rarely get people traveling to another city to commit these crimes

[Phil71]

It's not acceptable for a young black man to be repeatedly searched, no weapons or drugs found and yet he still gets searched.

That's reasonable in areas where young black kids aren't being killed every week......but the situation has got way out of hand and drastic action is required. If you were a law abiding citizen, you'd be grateful for the Police presence and make it very easy to be scanned quickly, so you could go on your way.

Or you might find it disrespectful and racist that despite being searched multiple times in the same area, the local police still see you as a suspect

Well, I thought that these gangster kids make it pretty easy to be identified as they tend to wear the same clothing and are mostly teenagers? If you dress like a gangster, then be prepared to be stopped. The police should be under orders to focus only on these youths to get the knives off the streets.
CCTV would be helpful too, so particular individuals can be identified and then grabbed by snatch squads.

I have no issue with known criminals being targeted.

People who've been cautioned or convicted of a violent or drug crime..... for say five years after their caution or conviction, it should be open season on them

People who are known to have bragged on Facebook etc about drugs, violence or gangs

But to repeatedly search someone who has repeatedly had nothing on them is rude, disrespectful and racist

How are the police supposed to apply this policy?

Why would it be hard for them to?

Local police in XYZ area will know who these people are.

What if they are not from that area? Or they're wearing a hoodie?

Most stabbings and drug / knife crime happens within local areas

You rarely get people traveling to another city to commit these crimes

Another City?

You do realise how big London is and how many people live in it?

Even in one area of it, the idea that every officer police should know every person who has a criminal record is nothing short of ludicrous.

[UFGN]

It's not acceptable for a young black man to be repeatedly searched, no weapons or drugs found and yet he still gets searched.

That's reasonable in areas where young black kids aren't being killed every week......but the situation has got way out of hand and drastic action is required. If you were a law abiding citizen, you'd be grateful for the Police presence and make it very easy to be scanned quickly, so you could go on your way.

Or you might find it disrespectful and racist that despite being searched multiple times in the same area, the local police still see you as a suspect

Well, I thought that these gangster kids make it pretty easy to be identified as they tend to wear the same clothing and are mostly teenagers? If you dress like a gangster, then be prepared to be stopped. The police should be under orders to focus only on these youths to get the knives off the streets.
CCTV would be helpful too, so particular individuals can be identified and then grabbed by snatch squads.

I have no issue with known criminals being targeted.

People who've been cautioned or convicted of a violent or drug crime..... for say five years after their caution or conviction, it should be open season on them

People who are known to have bragged on Facebook etc about drugs, violence or gangs

But to repeatedly search someone who has repeatedly had nothing on them is rude, disrespectful and racist

How are the police supposed to apply this policy?

Why would it be hard for them to?

Local police in XYZ area will know who these people are.

What if they are not from that area? Or they're wearing a hoodie?

Most stabbings and drug / knife crime happens within local areas

You rarely get people traveling to another city to commit these crimes

Another City?

You do realise how big London is and how many people live in it?

Even in one area of it, the idea that every officer police should know every person who has a criminal record is nothing short of ludicrous.

Local police know local criminals, especially burglars, drug dealers and gangs. Even in London.

If you were to look at all the stabbings in London this year, I'll bet you anything you like that the majority of people convicted of those murders turn out to be both;

from within two miles of where it happened,

and

with a previous criminal record or caution for drugs or violence

[DiamondGooner]

Stan Lee dies at age 95.

The man, the myth, the legend.

Big thanks to Stan, loved the comics when I was a kid.

[DiamondGooner]

The solution to stop and search is to target meaningfully.

It's not acceptable for a young black man to be repeatedly searched, no weapons or drugs found and yet he still gets searched.

I remember reading about a guy who'd been searched over 100 times despite not having a criminal record. I'm from the same borough, I'm white.... I've never been searched in my life

Its not easy for the police though is it because there's a lot of gang culture promoted in black communities among the youth in particular so a lot of the youth "look" the same i.e clothing and style wise, Hip hop style clothing is identical to what he thugs wear a lot of the time.

Its not easy for the police to determine who is a gang member and who isn't.

If they were stopping and searching a black guy wearing a shirt and tie or looking normal then that's one thing, but when they're a bunch of youths on a street corner it's not easy to determine who is or who isn't.

Don't get me wrong it is stereotyping of the highest order, but what else can you do, facts are its not black guys in a shirt and trousers running around stabbing and throwing acid at people, like it or not, that's just the facts.

Until the day wannabe gang members start wearing plaid shirts and shoes, then how can the police not stereotype?

Again you either want policing or you don't, I'm not saying they should do either, that's up to the locals.

.............. PS I also grew up in Hackney and basically used to dress and hang around with the sort of kids I'm talking about, so I know the deal as I've been there and lived it.

[Phil71]

I hope the police are not instructed to ensure they follow a pathetic quota system with their stop & search.

[UFGN]

The solution to stop and search is to target meaningfully.

It's not acceptable for a young black man to be repeatedly searched, no weapons or drugs found and yet he still gets searched.

I remember reading about a guy who'd been searched over 100 times despite not having a criminal record. I'm from the same borough, I'm white.... I've never been searched in my life

Its not easy for the police though is it because there's a lot of gang culture promoted in black communities among the youth in particular so a lot of the youth "look" the same i.e clothing and style wise, Hip hop style clothing is identical to what he thugs wear a lot of the time.

Its not easy for the police to determine who is a gang member and who isn't.

If they were stopping and searching a black guy wearing a shirt and tie or looking normal then that's one thing, but when they're a bunch of youths on a street corner it's not easy to determine who is or who isn't.

Don't get me wrong it is stereotyping of the highest order, but what else can you do, facts are its not black guys in a shirt and trousers running around stabbing and throwing acid at people, like it or not, that's just the facts.

Until the day wannabe gang members start wearing plaid shirts and shoes, then how can the police not stereotype?

Again you either want policing or you don't, I'm not saying they should do either, that's up to the locals.

.............. PS I also grew up in Hackney and basically used to dress and hang around with the sort of kids I'm talking about, so I know the deal as I've been there and lived it.

But if you dress like and associate with known drug dealers or gangs you should expect to get searched

Those kids a few weeks ago who got held up by armed police while making a drill video.... bitch please what did you expect

I am talking about normal people going about their normal business. If those people are being searched dozens of times, frankly because they're black and live in a poor area, that's not good enough. More effort needs to be put into getting it right

[Phil71]

It's not acceptable for a young black man to be repeatedly searched, no weapons or drugs found and yet he still gets searched.

That's reasonable in areas where young black kids aren't being killed every week......but the situation has got way out of hand and drastic action is required. If you were a law abiding citizen, you'd be grateful for the Police presence and make it very easy to be scanned quickly, so you could go on your way.

Or you might find it disrespectful and racist that despite being searched multiple times in the same area, the local police still see you as a suspect

Well, I thought that these gangster kids make it pretty easy to be identified as they tend to wear the same clothing and are mostly teenagers? If you dress like a gangster, then be prepared to be stopped. The police should be under orders to focus only on these youths to get the knives off the streets.
CCTV would be helpful too, so particular individuals can be identified and then grabbed by snatch squads.

I have no issue with known criminals being targeted.

People who've been cautioned or convicted of a violent or drug crime..... for say five years after their caution or conviction, it should be open season on them

People who are known to have bragged on Facebook etc about drugs, violence or gangs

But to repeatedly search someone who has repeatedly had nothing on them is rude, disrespectful and racist

How are the police supposed to apply this policy?

Why would it be hard for them to?

Local police in XYZ area will know who these people are.

What if they are not from that area? Or they're wearing a hoodie?

Most stabbings and drug / knife crime happens within local areas

You rarely get people traveling to another city to commit these crimes

Another City?

You do realise how big London is and how many people live in it?

Even in one area of it, the idea that every officer police should know every person who has a criminal record is nothing short of ludicrous.

Local police know local criminals, especially burglars, drug dealers and gangs. Even in London.

If you were to look at all the stabbings in London this year, I'll bet you anything you like that the majority of people convicted of those murders turn out to be both;

from within two miles of where it happened,

and

with a previous criminal record or caution for drugs or violence

This needs a much broader brush approach.

Anyone complaining should accept it’s for their own good and get on with it.

[UFGN]

Great... until it's you who's being told this, and it's the second time this week by the same officers