Coronavirus (COVID-19)

In Tribute to Drama, SE13 & Fabrestuta. RIP
Grab a chair, open a beer & chat away

Which one did you get?

Pfizer-BioNTech
4
22%
Moderna
1
6%
Janssen (J&J)
2
11%
Oxford-AstraZeneca
8
44%
Sinopharm/Sinovac
0
No votes
Sputnik-V
0
No votes
Not vaccinated yet
3
17%
 
Total votes : 18

Re: Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Postby Santi » Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:37 pm

Jedi wrote:
DiamondGooner wrote:So this blanket indication that people who've had the vaccine get lesser symptoms is not proven.

Lab coat man gets lots of people. Lab coat man gives half people vaccine and other half placebo. Lab coat man wait few months. He check how many sick. Only 5 or 6 vaccinated sick, but in placebo group hundreds sick. A few in placebo group even die. Zero in vaccine group die.

Vaccine good, vaccine work. Vaccine make man less sick. Get vaccine.


NGL that fuckin cracked me up :rofll:
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Re: Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Postby Rockape » Tue Sep 14, 2021 7:35 pm

Out of 51,281 Covid deaths recorded between Jan 2 and July 2 in England, just 256 died after they had two doses, and the majority of those were “extremely clinically vulnerable”.

The average age of those who died after a second dose was 84, and only 59 double-jabbed people died who were not very ill or elderly.

It means that 99.51 per cent of Covid deaths since the start of the year were in people who were not fully vaccinated.
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Re: Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Postby DiamondGooner » Tue Sep 14, 2021 9:45 pm

Rockape wrote:Out of 51,281 Covid deaths recorded between Jan 2 and July 2 in England, just 256 died after they had two doses, and the majority of those were “extremely clinically vulnerable”.

The average age of those who died after a second dose was 84, and only 59 double-jabbed people died who were not very ill or elderly.

It means that 99.51 per cent of Covid deaths since the start of the year were in people who were not fully vaccinated.


Again and I'm not trying to be difficult to you in particular because I know your not a d*ck like some I'm debating here but this is the treatment we get whenever we state something so it has to be an even playing field ..............

Links to sources.

How many trials and if its just one who conducted it / collected the data?

I want to see out of those who died who weren't vaccinated what their condition was prior to testing positive.
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Re: Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Postby Dejan » Tue Sep 14, 2021 10:41 pm

I dont know how to embed this:

https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/14 ... 67265?s=19

Interesting.
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Re: Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Postby Ach » Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:08 pm

Dejan wrote:I dont know how to embed this:

https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/14 ... 67265?s=19

Interesting.
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Re: Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Postby LMAO » Wed Sep 15, 2021 6:12 am

22-0 wrote:Since you're calling them anti vaxxers you already have no idea what this is about.

99% of the people against this covid shit aint anti vax.


Would help if you read earlier posts tbh. I don't feel like typing "anti-COVID vax" every time.

anti-vax = opposed to vaccination

Do people not want to get vaccinated? Ergo, anti-vax. And yes, I'm including the vaccine hesitant in this because we have months and billions of data points by now for the COVID vaccines. The material in the vaccines are flushed out of your body within 3 weeks. If side effects were going to show up, they'd show up in that 3 week period.

It's not that complicated.
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Re: Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Postby LMAO » Wed Sep 15, 2021 6:22 am

Power n Glory wrote:
LMAO wrote:
DiamondGooner wrote:
LMAO wrote:There it is:



Was wondering how long this was going to take once the FDA fully approved the Pfizer vaccine. We'll now see how strong the anti-COVID vax crowd's convictions are. They can uphold their end of the social contract, or they can become pariahs. You're entitled to refuse the vaccine; you're not entitled to employment.


So you approve of the Gov't being able to force any junk they conjure in a lab to put in you and MAKE you have it.

Its not a choice if its part of employement, because its not a "choice" to pay your bills and buy food in a capitalist country.

This is communism rules via capitalism by taking away someones right to take part in it.

How anyone thinks this is a good idea instead of mandatory testing says a lot about you as a person, and its not good.

Mandatory testing is acceptable but then the money £££ is in the vaccine so obviously ..............


Anything I don't like is communism, and the more I don't like it, the more communismer it is.

The government isn't forcing anyone. You can choose to get vaccinated and keep your job, or you can choose to not and re re re all the way to unemployment. It might be coercive, but it's still a choice at the end of the day. Besides, nothing is stopping the anti-vax crowd from starting their own companies, keeping the payroll under 100 people, and not contracting with the federal government if they feel so strongly about it :dontknow:

I think it's a good idea because I'd prefer the unvaccinated or those without natural immunity to not hog up ICUs for the more unfortunate (like people in vehicle accidents for example) and putting unnecessary strain on our medical system. I'd be perfectly okay with COVID vaccine mandates done away with if the anti-vax crowd agrees to be deprioritized/triaged for treatment if they contract the virus and need medical assistance for it.


It sounds a lot like elements of China's social credit system.

https://www.wired.co.uk/article/china-social-credit-system-explained


The problem you have in America is that it will split the country even further. If you make social pariahs of those against the vaccine and force them out of the job, they're not just going to shrug shoulders and become entrepreneurs. That's wishful thinking. If they can't work or feed their families, it will push the crime rate up because most will have to get money illegally. Those with the money will be food. Unemployment boosts the crime rate.

Also, you create an even more dangerous situation that hasn't even had a chance to heal after the storming of Capitol Hill. Those already disillusioned with the Government will just be pushed further to the edge and you create more extreme groups with more sympathisers. This is dangerous territory and some more thought needs to go into what is being proposed.


We've literally had vaccine mandates in this country since the days of George f***ing Washington, and the courts have consistently ruled that public health > individual liberty. You have to get vaccinated against multiple diseases (measles, mumps, rubella, hepatitis B, etc.) to even be able to attend school here. Few if any have a problem with those. The carrot approach didn't work, so now it's time to try the stick.

And like I said to 22-0, we have months and billions of data points by now for the COVID vaccines. The material in the vaccines are flushed out of your body within 3 weeks. If side effects were going to show up, then they'd show up in that 3 week period.
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Re: Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Postby Rockape » Wed Sep 15, 2021 12:07 pm

DiamondGooner wrote:
Rockape wrote:Out of 51,281 Covid deaths recorded between Jan 2 and July 2 in England, just 256 died after they had two doses, and the majority of those were “extremely clinically vulnerable”.

The average age of those who died after a second dose was 84, and only 59 double-jabbed people died who were not very ill or elderly.

It means that 99.51 per cent of Covid deaths since the start of the year were in people who were not fully vaccinated.


Again and I'm not trying to be difficult to you in particular because I know your not a d*ck like some I'm debating here but this is the treatment we get whenever we state something so it has to be an even playing field ..............

Links to sources.

How many trials and if its just one who conducted it / collected the data?

I want to see out of those who died who weren't vaccinated what their condition was prior to testing positive.


That was in yesterdays Telegraph and were figures from the Office for National Statistics. The figures go on confirming various details, but Julie Stanborough, dep director of health analysis and life events at the ONS said The risk of death involving COVID 19 is much lower among people who are fully vaccinated, than those who are unvaccinated or have only recieved one dose.
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Re: Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Postby Rockape » Wed Sep 15, 2021 12:10 pm

may as well post the article:

Only 59 fully vaccinated people without serious health conditions died from Covid-19 out of more than 50,000 deaths in England this year, new figures from the Office for National Statistics (ONS) show.

In the first study of deaths by vaccination status, the ONS found that around 99 per cent of Covid-19 deaths between January 2 and July 2 2021 were in people who had not had two doses.

Overall 640 (1.2 per cent) of deaths were in those who had received both vaccine doses, but the ONS said many of those could have been infections picked up before the second dose.

Just 256 deaths (0.5 per cent) were considered true “breakthrough” infections where the second dose had long enough to work, but still did not offer protection.

However, the average age of those “breakthrough” infections was 84 and the majority (76 per cent) were classed as “extremely clinically vulnerable”. Just 59 did not have serious medical conditions.

Julie Stanborough, deputy director of health and life events at the ONS, said: “The risk of a death involving Covid-19 is much lower among people who are fully vaccinated than those who are unvaccinated or have only received one dose.

“This shows the effectiveness of the vaccines in giving a high degree of protection against severe illness and death.”

More than three quarters of adults in the UK have now received two doses, and most recent figures suggest 95,200 deaths, 23.9 million infections and 82,100 hospitalisations have been prevented by the vaccines in Britain.

Commenting on the figures, Professor Gino Martini, Chief Scientist for the Royal Pharmaceutical Society, said: “It is extremely reassuring to see the latest statistics around the vaccination programme in England.

“The data show that people are much better protected from the virus after two doses, and hopefully this will inspire others to get the vaccination to protect themselves and others.”

Booster jabs ‘may not offer more protection’ against Covid
To boost, or not to boost. That is the thorny question currently being considered by immunisation experts ahead of a potential new winter wave.

Now it appears that the Office of National Statistics (ONS) may have provided an answer: out of 51,281 Covid-19 deaths recorded between January 2 and July 2 in England this year, just 256 died after they had two doses, and the majority of those were “extremely clinically vulnerable”.
The average age of those who died after a second dose was 84, and only 59 double-jabbed people died who were not very ill or elderly.

It means that 99.51 per cent of coronavirus deaths since the beginning of the year were in people who were not fully vaccinated.

Although many of the deaths occurred before second doses were widespread, it is still a striking indication of the protective impact of full vaccination, and calls into question the need for a booster.

More than three quarters of adults in the UK have now received two doses, and most recent figures suggest 60,000 deaths, 22 million infections and 66,900 hospitalisations have been prevented by the vaccines in Britain.

It’s worth bearing in mind that people with severely weakened immune systems are already getting a third dose, so the most vulnerable will be getting extra protection. For everyone else, three jabs are unlikely to bring much added benefit.

This is also the view of Professor Dame Sarah Gilbert, the lead scientist on the Oxford jab, as well as the heads of AstraZeneca who believe that two doses are plenty for the vast majority of people, and would rather see the extra jabs deployed elsewhere.

Despite their concerns, the Government seems intent on pushing ahead with the programme.

Last week, Nadim Zahawi, the vaccines minister, said that the NHS was preparing to boost around 35 million people, and that he expected the rollout to get started this month, to coincide with the flu jab.

The Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunisation (JCVI) is currently debating whether to advise third jabs, and recently received data from the University Hospital Southampton NHS Foundation Trust’s Cov-Boost study showing a third jab boosts antibodies seven-fold.

Yet the new ONS data appears to show that people already have sufficient immunity to fight off disease.

“Death rates are consistently lower in people who have had both vaccine doses than in people who have had just one, or no vaccination at all,” said Professor Kevin McConway, Emeritus Professor of Applied Statistics at the Open University.

“[Of the] people who did sadly die of, or with, Covid-19 after two vaccine doses, a greater percentage had a weakened immune system.

“What this is reminding us is that there will always be people that aren’t protected as well by vaccines as the rest of us.”

There are, of course, other matters to consider, such as whether a third jab could prevent cases of long Covid or lower the number of hospitalisations. But a new review in The Lancet seems to suggest that two jabs are highly protective against lesser forms of the illness as well.

Based on observational studies to date, the team from Oxford University, the World Health Organisation (WHO) and US Food and Drug Administration (FDA) estimated a 95 per cent effectiveness against severe disease, and more than 80 per cent effectiveness against any infection at all, for both Alpha and Delta variants.

The expert review, published on Monday, concluded that a booster is not needed for the general population because effectiveness is so high, even against the Delta variant.

“Taken as a whole, the currently available studies do not provide credible evidence of substantially declining protection against severe disease, which is the primary goal of vaccination,” said Dr Ana-Maria Henao-Restrepo of the WHO.

“If vaccines are deployed where they would do the most good, they could hasten the end of the pandemic by inhibiting further evolution of variants.”

The team found that although vaccines are less effective against asymptomatic disease or against transmission than against severe disease, it is the unvaccinated minority who are still the major drivers of transmission.

“Although the idea of further reducing the number of Covid-19 cases by enhancing immunity in vaccinated people is appealing, any decision to do so should be evidence-based and consider the benefits and risks for individuals and society,” said Dr Soumya Swaminathan, chief scientist of the World Health Organisation and co-author of The Lancet paper.

The experts also note that even if antibody levels wane over time, it does not necessarily mean that protection against severe disease will drop. Other parts of the immune system may still be protecting against severe disease, they argue.

It is therefore more sensible to focus effort on boosting vaccination in areas of low uptake. In several parts of London, for example, only around half of residents have had two doses.

Even in Oxford where the AstraZeneca jab was developed, only 55 per cent of residents have had two jabs, and the ONS figures show that people are still at risk after just one vaccine.

It’s arguably time to finish the job we started before embarking on a new round of vaccinations that will have little impact.
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Re: Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Postby Ach » Wed Sep 15, 2021 12:22 pm

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Re: Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Postby Power n Glory » Wed Sep 15, 2021 5:54 pm

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Re: Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Postby theHotHead » Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:51 am

LMAO wrote:
Anything I don't like is communism, and the more I don't like it, the more communismer it is.

The government isn't forcing anyone. You can choose to get vaccinated and keep your job, or you can choose to not and re re re all the way to unemployment. It might be coercive, but it's still a choice at the end of the day. Besides, nothing is stopping the anti-vax crowd from starting their own companies, keeping the payroll under 100 people, and not contracting with the federal government if they feel so strongly about it :dontknow:

I think it's a good idea because I'd prefer the unvaccinated or those without natural immunity to not hog up ICUs for the more unfortunate (like people in vehicle accidents for example) and putting unnecessary strain on our medical system. I'd be perfectly okay with COVID vaccine mandates done away with if the anti-vax crowd agrees to be deprioritized/triaged for treatment if they contract the virus and need medical assistance for it.

Are you trying to be funny ? How is that a choice ??

I am at the point where I know almost as many people who caught covid whilst being double jabbed as those that caught covid who were not vaccinated. So if the vaccinated are as likely to catch it and transmit it, why do unvaccinated need to lose their jobs if they refuse to be vaccinated ???
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Re: Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Postby theHotHead » Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:53 am

22-0 wrote:Since you're calling them anti vaxxers you already have no idea what this is about.

99% of the people against this covid shit aint anti vax.

Its just easy lazy narrative ! God forbid we question what the government attempt to force us to do !
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Re: Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Postby theHotHead » Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:57 am

Luzh 22 wrote:
DiamondGooner wrote: HotHeads stats for the UK showed a hospital admittance for Covid cases were 40% people who WERE vaccinated.


That's correct. 40% of hospital admissions were people who were vaccinated. What's not said in that statistic, is that the vast majority of adults are now vaccinated, meaning comparatively, it actually proves the vaccine is working, otherwise the numbers would tell a different story.

It also doesn't show that those hospitalised who were vaccinated, on the whole, suffered less severe complications from COVID. Another indicator the vaccine is working.

Mate, this doesn't need to be complicated. I would expect the split between those hospitalised with covid having not been vaccinated to be in the 90s percentage wise and those who were vaccinated to be in at least single figures. The fact its 40% of those being vaccinated tells you the vaccine is NOT what it seems, it is NOT what we are being told and it is NOT what we were led to believe. Its a glorified Strepsil !
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Re: Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Postby theHotHead » Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:59 am

Jedi wrote:
DiamondGooner wrote:So this blanket indication that people who've had the vaccine get lesser symptoms is not proven.

Lab coat man gets lots of people. Lab coat man gives half people vaccine and other half placebo. Lab coat man wait few months. He check how many sick. Only 5 or 6 vaccinated sick, but in placebo group hundreds sick. A few in placebo group even die. Zero in vaccine group die.

Vaccine good, vaccine work. Vaccine make man less sick. Get vaccine.

Non vaccine man say - wait - if 40% of hospital admissions are made up of vaccine people why the f**k I should take crazy useless vaccine ?!
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