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Re: Tennis

Postby Santi » Mon Jan 28, 2019 12:36 pm

Jedi wrote:
Santi wrote:



Pointless stat unless they’re all the same age/peaked at the same time.

I mean look at the Nadal - Federer one, 23-15 but of those only 3 matches on grass which would most likely swing in Federer's favour, while there are 15 matches on Clay and obviously dominated by Rafa :dontknow:

Other than Wimbledon, there isn't many relevant grass tournaments. Out of the 9 ATP 1000 Tournaments, 6 are on hard surfaces, 3 are on clay. It's not Nadals fault Federer happens to be dominant on the surface one tournament is played on.

Santi wrote:
Losmeister wrote:As for Djoko v Fed, no surprise that it's since 2011 when the record swung...
Federer dominated during their early matches, leading 13–6 by the end of 2010, but Djokovic took over the lead in the head-to-head in 2016, thanks to a 19–9 record since 2011.

Doesn't coincide with Federer's decline at all does it? Guess what, happened to be Djoko's peak as well because there's 6 years between them ffs.


But in 2011 Federer was 29 and Djokovic was 23. This doesn't coincide with Federer's decline but Djokovic entering his prime. I mean this is his breakthrough year, where he had his crazy streak and destroyed everyone in his path, so if facing tougher opposition means you're declining then i guess his decline started at 26 since he hasn't dominated Tennis like Nadal and Djokovic past that age.

Also, Nadal shared his prime with both players and completely dominated Federer, but losing to Djokovic.


So for the first part, that doesn't make my point any less true? It just means the tennis schedule is favourable to Nadal's game over Federer and yet 23-15 isn't exactly a domination as you described. If anything it shows that Federer has the better all round game because Nadal has only spanked him on Clay and offset the H2H. Can spend all day taking those stats in favour of either man which is why I said they are pointless in trying to prove one over the other.

The simple reality is that GOAT discussions will come down to popularity because you can even argue Federer won his slams at an easier era of tennis (don't particularly agree, think it's unnecessary degrading but people do it) and therefore even most slams means nothing in reality, not without context.

Like I said, Djoko is a good player but he'll never have the following of the other two and that's partly down to his style, it's gotten better but it's not as exciting to watch and the other issue is that he came along third. Federer was already loved and, despite challenging the king, Nadal was loved because of the manner in which he came about.
Djokovic gets respect because he has been unbelievable and probably the most unbeatable any of the three of them have ever been but there is no way he is as popular or charismatic.

So, back to my original point, it is exactly why he will never be considered the GOAT, not because he isn't a good enough player. But I guess you're too busy automatically discarding my opinion to even read the rest of my posts and put aside your Serb love for Novak.
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Re: Tennis

Postby Jedi » Mon Jan 28, 2019 1:03 pm

"My Serb love for Novak"

How wrong can you be lol

Always hated the guy because of his status in my country. Only recently had a change of heart when i found out everyone else hates him.

Some of my older posts here:
Jedi wrote:Djokovic wins, hopefully he loses the final

Jedi wrote:Djokovic destroyed. Del Potro with an unreal performance. Serbs on suicide watch. Djoker is treated as a godly entity in my country, can't wait to poke fun at my friends which are obssesed with him.

Jedi wrote:Djokovic ruined, he will never catch up now


One thing that hasn't changed, though, is my stance that he can become GOAT (and now in 2019 most likely is). I've mainted that opinion even when i hated him the most.
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Re: Tennis

Postby Santi » Mon Jan 28, 2019 1:18 pm

Traitor to your own nation and a flip flopper as well then :hiding:



;)
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Re: Tennis

Postby Marsbar100 » Mon Jan 28, 2019 2:12 pm

Between 2010-16, not a small period of time, over 7 seasons, Federer won less majors than Murray.
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Re: Tennis

Postby Santi » Mon Jan 28, 2019 4:49 pm

Again, weird stat to show anything given Fed spent the best part of 2 of those years out and/or struggling with injuries while Murray had his best ever form, finally winning Wimbledon and the Olympics (against Fed).

If you had to name the most gracious player in history, most people would say Fed. He's done it all with class and artistic style and still stands atop of the pile, it's a simple as that. Barcelona won the treble in 2008/09 whatever it was, teams had done it before but this team was widely considered one of the best of all time because of the way they did it. It matters.

Anyway I've said more than enough about it, everyone's free to have their views but I'm just saying I can't ever see Djoko being considered the GOAT by the majority because of his style and popularity against Roger's. Never disagreed that Djoko is incredible and effective but only Jedi seems to have more than a random stat.
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Re: Tennis

Postby Losmeister » Mon Jan 28, 2019 5:25 pm

fwiw, Fed has that one handed backhand that is the prettiest stroke I've ever seen...

I am not tryna convince anybody... i try to be objective and of course there are periods when all three struggled with injury and there is the fact that Rafa is the best clay court player ever by far...
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Re: Tennis

Postby Marsbar100 » Sat Mar 02, 2019 9:53 pm

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Re: Tennis

Postby Jedi » Mon May 13, 2019 1:16 pm

Djokovic won Madrid yesterday. In solid form going into Roland Garros and surely a favorite to win it. Well, it's him or Rafa.
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Re: Tennis

Postby Jedi » Sun May 19, 2019 1:18 pm

Djokovic vs Nadal Rome final starting in 40 mins.

Nadal is the favorite.
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Re: Tennis

Postby Losmeister » Sun May 19, 2019 6:50 pm

nadal vs anybody on clay is a mismatch in his favor
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Re: Tennis

Postby Va-Va-Voom » Sun May 19, 2019 11:26 pm

Nadal on clay might be the greatest athlete of all time.
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Re: Tennis

Postby Losmeister » Tue May 21, 2019 7:59 pm

Va-Va-Voom wrote:Nadal on clay might be the greatest athlete of all time.


interesting topic...

Phelps?
Bolt?
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Re: Tennis

Postby Va-Va-Voom » Tue May 21, 2019 8:31 pm

Losmeister wrote:
Va-Va-Voom wrote:Nadal on clay might be the greatest athlete of all time.


interesting topic...

Phelps?
Bolt?


What do you think?

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=30890
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Re: Tennis

Postby Losmeister » Tue May 21, 2019 9:32 pm

Va-Va-Voom wrote:
Losmeister wrote:
Va-Va-Voom wrote:Nadal on clay might be the greatest athlete of all time.


interesting topic...

Phelps?
Bolt?


What do you think?

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=30890


i dont have a defined answer... so hard to compare across eras and different sports...i mean babe ruth in his era...
mind blowing stuff
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Re: Tennis

Postby Jedi » Thu Jun 06, 2019 3:01 pm

Djokovic, Nadal, Federer all in the semis.

Nadal vs Federer and Djokovic vs Thiem tomorrow. It's shaping up to be another Djokovic vs Nadal final, as I've hoped. Well, as long as Thiem doesn't pull an upset.
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